Not too long ago I started a thread about what to say to patients who were anxious and depressed. I received a lot of great comments and advice but, I now ran into another issue tonight which has to do with the topic of this thread.
I went into this mans room and asked if he needed anything. He said he would like some ice water and juice and I got it for him. After I asked if he needed anything else he said yes, forgiveness. Naturally I asked what he wanted forgiveness for. He began to say that he was talking to the hospital chaplain and then started to go into his family life and some of his own. It was a pretty normal conversation until he mentioned that he did something really stupid back in the 70's and that's what he wanted forgiveness for. He said he tried to molest his daughter but stopped just in time. He then began to go on about how beautiful and smart this daughter was. I was just dumbfounded. The only thing that saved me was there was a fire drill at that moment and I had to leave to help close the doors.
I understand that working in the hospital you deal with all types including the most foul wastes of life but, they still need care. I just abhor child molesters and after hearing that I found it hard to care about anything that happened to this man. Now I don't want anyone to think that as a future RN if I ran into this situation again I would purposely cause harm to a patient with a twisted past because I wouldn't. I think I would just perform care without caring.
How do you handle patients like this if you know they committed horrible things? Have any patients confessed things to you that were unsettling?
P.S I would also like to give my deepest thanks to all who work with children and have to care for those who have suffered through things like molestation and abuse. How your hearts must ache some days.
I am in a corrections providing healthcare to baby hurters. I have to think of the child (victims) from time to time and wonder, would they would want me to respect this person as human? Would they want their hurts go away? Just wondering. We have to make difficult choices, sometimes from minute to minute.
Why are you forbidden to express your personal opinion, even if it is contrary to humanistic atheism and "anything goes" that are being forcibly taught in PUBLIC schools on tax dollars? Your 1st Amendment right does not end at the school or hospital door. Just let the person you are speaking to know it is your opinion, not any official view of your school or employer. Right?
Good idea in a perfect world. In the world of hospitals (corporate), law enforcement, or anything else where you have on a uniform and an ID badge with that company's name you will express "their" opinion not your personal one while at work. I"m not trying to be sarcastic but its a fact. People are getting fired over stuff like "ohhh dreading going to work tonight" on facebook how well do you think it would go over to express that personal opinion on the floor with a patient? Expressing your opinion while on their timeclock can get you terminated. Free speech is not free there always repercussions to it, cause and effect. I feel we are fortunate because we are not put to death for a word, we can only be fired. One of the best amendments ever created was the 5th especially the portion that allows us NOT to incriminate ourselves.
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My version of this is "this nurse has a reasonable fear of being fired & yet innocent of any wrong doing. I do not wish to be ensnared in corporate drama because I couldn't shut my mouth for a few minutes & save my opinions for family and friends outside of the workplace.
I just want to state that his daughter is 44 years old now and he said it happened in the 70's. I can assure all of you if it was a minor I would have reported it before the man even finished telling me about it!
Now that that is out of the way I just want to thank you for all the help and advice. I'll have to do some research on different personality types and learn how to deal with them in an effective way. I just have such a big heart and am the type to listen to a friend cry on the phone for hours on end. While that is a good trait in nursing I can see how it can get me into trouble as I feel I'll get that manipulative patient that will guilt me into everything.
I guess I'll have to pull out and dust off the ol BS detector from my years of retail management and being a supervisor and plug it back in.
Specializes in med/surg/tele/neuro/rehab/corrections.
It does not matter when the incident occurred or how old the victim is today, nurses are mandated by law to report. The law is notified and a note is made and it is up to them. And probably nothing would happen from there but we are still mandated to report. It's the same with therapists. It doesn't matter how long ago etc the therapist who doesn't report loses his license. This law is in place because we would get confused as to, should we report? isn't the victim too old? Hasn't too much time passed? Now we don't need to confuse ourselves with these questions. We just report. Then the law takes it from there.
Those who do not report are in violation of the law and could be in serious trouble. Even if just to cover yourself, always report.
It reminds me of when a patient passes how we always have to call some number to report for eye bank or body part donation even when I know the diseased state or advanced age will mean the patient is not eligible to donate (or the family is saying no way) We just explain that it is mandated that we ask and report.
(Sorry, I am too upset and writing quickly so I know there will be mistakes.) I just had to put this out there
It sounds to me like he should be talking to a mental health professional of some sort...but keep in mind, his "confession" was not of molesting his daughter but essentially that he was thinking of it and stopped before it happened. If in fact he didn't act on his impulse at that time that is a good thing and he shouldn't be demonized or hated because of that. We don't know if he did do anything to her or anyone else and it should definitely, in my opinion, be discussed with professionals rather than jumping the gun and assuming the guy is a molester.
I think in a way when you choose to be a nurse it's like choosing to be a defense attorney. Everyone, no matter how heinous the crime, is entitled to a defense and equal protection under the law.
A patient is entitled to be treated with the same medical care no matter what kind of person they are.
That is not to say it is hard to provide great care to a patient you know has done unforgivable things... as I imagine it's difficult for defense attorneys to defend violent criminals.
I am in a corrections providing healthcare to baby hurters. I have to think of the child (victims) from time to time and wonder, would they would want me to respect this person as human? Would they want their hurts go away? Just wondering. We have to make difficult choices, sometimes from minute to minute.
There's not a difficult choice here. You provide approprite medical care as indicated. It's not our job to judge a person's actions prior to your contact with them in a professional setting. If you can't do this, look into another field.
I abhor some of the patients I take care of. Doesn't mean there is any difference in the care provided.
Not too long ago I started a thread about what to say to patients who were anxious and depressed. I received a lot of great comments and advice but, I now ran into another issue tonight which has to do with the topic of this thread.
I went into this mans room and asked if he needed anything. He said he would like some ice water and juice and I got it for him. After I asked if he needed anything else he said yes, forgiveness. Naturally I asked what he wanted forgiveness for. He began to say that he was talking to the hospital chaplain and then started to go into his family life and some of his own. It was a pretty normal conversation until he mentioned that he did something really stupid back in the 70's and that's what he wanted forgiveness for. He said he tried to molest his daughter but stopped just in time. He then began to go on about how beautiful and smart this daughter was. I was just dumbfounded. The only thing that saved me was there was a fire drill at that moment and I had to leave to help close the doors.
I understand that working in the hospital you deal with all types including the most foul wastes of life but, they still need care. I just abhor child molesters and after hearing that I found it hard to care about anything that happened to this man. Now I don't want anyone to think that as a future RN if I ran into this situation again I would purposely cause harm to a patient with a twisted past because I wouldn't. I think I would just perform care without caring.
How do you handle patients like this if you know they committed horrible things? Have any patients confessed things to you that were unsettling?
P.S I would also like to give my deepest thanks to all who work with children and have to care for those who have suffered through things like molestation and abuse. How your hearts must ache some days.
Frankly, I'd be irritated that he was trying to dump his guilt onto me. I would tell him I'm not in the business of judging and his personal past issues have nothing to do with his current medical care. I'd also state that whomever or whatever he believes as far as his maker will be the judge, not me. Then I'd find a nice 16 gauge needle for his next IM injection.
I personally believe that there is a huge problem in nursing when we do not see our patients as being more than a physical body. If we are not cognizant of their spiritual needs, we are missing out on their entire disease process and the means to seeing them recover. I know you can see that in regard to some issues such as alcoholism. Yet, we are trained to see that as a "disease." Like I said, if this same man had killed or maimed his daughter in a car accident while being drunk because of his alcohol issue, nobody would be treating him like a heinous evil criminal. Instead, we would say, "He has a disease." In my mind, it is one in the same problem. Both children are victimized by an adult that needs to change. So, how does such a person get out of their problem? Isn't the first step from the pages of AA recognizing there is a problem and confessing it?
So where is the pedophile going to go to get help and stop doing what they're doing? I remember that I knew of a man (an acquaintance) who came out of the closet with his issues and everyone around him reacted exactly like others on this board reacted. He lost his family forever. I often thought that this situation was mishandled. Nobody would have known had this man not confessed. How are people like this supposed to get help if they can't get help? Not only do they continue to do these things, but they often effect a couple of generations of people. I knew of another woman who had upwards of three children by her father. That is the epitome of ridiculousness in my mind. Why didn't that man seek help? The answer is simple. They have no means of seeking help because they know to do so would mean utter ruin. So instead of stopping, they keep looking for opportunities to hurt these children again.
I think this idea that is permeating nursing of acceptance and being non-judgmental, because it is now big business and God forbid that we should offend anyone, is the most retarded idea to have come down the pike. We aren't helping people in terms of their health with that mentality. And like I keep saying, we do have a place where we draw the line. Did you know that in some foreign cultures, in particular in the Middle East, they are accepting of older men having sex with young girls? My point in sharing that is that they don't draw the line.
I think there is a line way way back at marriage. It makes for healthy people, healthy societies, and healthy families and children. What we really need is a to learn how to speak about those things with people.
This will always be a highly emotive and controversial issue. I nursed a paedophile once when all the other nurses who were mothers, absolutely refused. It was easy as long as I thought of him as just another patient.
But we are not robots. We think of our families, our daughters, nieces, sons who could be hurt, and even killed, by these sick individuals (and I do mean sick in every sense of the word).
DO NOT FORGET that these people know very well how to manipualate others, and make young children feel guilty and needy. One man who'd raped a woman (who I looked after) as a girl, started planning how to get his hands on her from the MOMENT SHE WAS BORN, up until she was about 6 years old, then started abusing her. These people are usually highly intelligent, seemingly normal individuals who plan what they are going to do to their victim. They can also play the role of victim very well, and make you believe them. That is their specialty! And though some of these people might have been abused themselves as an individual, many were not. Many enjoy abusing children, gives a feeling of power, etc. They are basically cowards who cannnot form normal human relationships on just about any level. And don't forget that many men who abuse female children, have kids of their own & also abuse them for years as well, also have weird sexual habits & also abuse their partners/wives. And another disturbing fact is that many sexual predators - both male and female - often harbour thoughts of killing their victims, but don't because they want to keep them alive for sexual (and other) gratification.
Maybe they do need help, but I don't think they will get 'understanding'. there is no excuse or reason for raping a child. They shouldn't be let out into society again after confessing anything to do with thoughts of raping children, abnormally touching them, being aroused by children or having power in some way over a child (ie: mental abuse).
And one day, that paedophile WILL start to think about turning towards murder, just to silence those kids that won't stay quiet. It has happened in the past.
The above poster says one man didn't seek help because he feared utter ruin. Of course they do! They shouldn't be touching or molesting children in the first place! No-one is going to confess to this, even if we are open about it.
would you feel the same if the confession and request for forgiveness concerned sex outside of marriage, homosexuality or abortion? We are taught that these are "alternative lifestyle" choices and would probably express that in our response... there is no acceptance of these actions because as I have said before, everyone has a place where they draw the line. Sex toward a child is that line.
Here's the bottom line on this. In any of the above situations, you and I have no power to restore a conscience and clean someone up on the inside in order to reconcile them to God, which is what this man is apparently seeking. See, in my mind, his actions are no different than any other evil.
Did you just equate premarital sex, abortion, and homosexuality with child molestation?
sissykim
145 Posts
I am in a corrections providing healthcare to baby hurters. I have to think of the child (victims) from time to time and wonder, would they would want me to respect this person as human? Would they want their hurts go away? Just wondering. We have to make difficult choices, sometimes from minute to minute.