I see a lot of fiercely independent seniors who haven't planned well for the next phase of life. In the rural areas, they are used to living on their own, sometimes on properties that are deteriorating due to their owners creeping infirmities, or lifelong patterns of sloppiness.
Some have had hoarding tendencies that have gotten out of hand. EMS will give colorful reports on that.
What a good way to help these stubborn folk, who need to be guided into assisted living, or toward accepting family help? Sometimes adult children are spread out, or alienated from their parents.
To those of you harshly judging my opening comments, the patient in question is a woman who is most likely headed to a nursing home, being cared for by a husband who is barely clinging to his independence. He is on oxygen and walks with a walker, and they rent and live with a friend, who the husband says is "losing his marbles", and unable to manage his own affairs. They've been without water for a month on the property.
They reside on rural acreage that EMS said is a classic rural hoarding situation. I was able to develop a rapport with the husband, and have a frank discussion with him about moving into a different situation. I think he now understands, and is open to letting go of all his "stuff" and getting a better housing set up. I passed onto Social Services these facts and they are working on helping all three of these elderly people.
It's interesting all the judgmental remarks here that accuse me of being judgemental. Typical of the internet, which often is not a very productive venue. But, people enjoy climbing on board and joining in the fun of condemning someone, instead of finding out more information. When that happens, I usually exit, because it's a ridiculous waste of time. You all have a good day now.
Specializes in ICU/ER/Med-Surg/Case Management/Manageme.
On 8/20/2020 at 9:37 AM, Emergent said:
To those of you harshly judging my opening comments, the patient in question is a woman who is most likely headed to a nursing home, being cared for by a husband who is barely clinging to his independence. He is on oxygen and walks with a walker, and they rent and live with a friend, who the husband says is "losing his marbles", and unable to manage his own affairs. They've been without water for a month on the property...
Rather than criticize those that took the time to respond to your post you will, next time, include the pertinent details in your post. Frankly, this comes across as a bait and switch type of thing...get people stirred up and AFTER the fact add details that might change opinions.
Specializes in Critical Care; Cardiac; Professional Development.
You posted something purposefully controversial, which is kind of your M.O. I am surprised you upset yourself in the responses it garnered, as that doesn’t normally tend to bother you. We judged exactly what you communicated. With all of those details you could have submitted a very different line of thought. Don’t gaslight us now for reacting to what you said when you kept details withheld. Of course people shouldn’t be living without utilities. That changes the whole,conversation, doesn’t it?
Specializes in Psych, Addictions, SOL (Student of Life).
On 8/20/2020 at 9:37 AM, Emergent said:
It's interesting all the judgmental remarks here that accuse me of being judgemental. Typical of the internet, which often is not a very productive venue. But, people enjoy climbing on board and joining in the fun of condemning someone, instead of finding out more information. When that happens, I usually exit, because it's a ridiculous waste of time. You all have a good day now.
If you had included the information about these folks in your original post rather than presenting it as a hypothetical argument. People might have given different answers. Perhaps these folks need to be in an ALF if they have assets to pay for it. As I mentioned Medicare and Medicade do not cover ALF care as it is considered custodial care and costs can run up to $4, 000.00 per month. It sure doesn't sound like the people you are describing can afford that.
FYI be careful describing you patients/clients in such detail that they can be identified by someone reading the post. This can be considered a HIPAA violation which can cost you a fine up to $10,000.00 and or 1 year in jail.
To those of you harshly judging my opening comments, the patient in question is a woman who is most likely headed to a nursing home, being cared for by a husband who is barely clinging to his independence. He is on oxygen and walks with a walker, and they rent and live with a friend, who the husband says is "losing his marbles", and unable to manage his own affairs. They've been without water for a month on the property.
They reside on rural acreage that EMS said is a classic rural hoarding situation. I was able to develop a rapport with the husband, and have a frank discussion with him about moving into a different situation. I think he now understands, and is open to letting go of all his "stuff" and getting a better housing set up. I passed onto Social Services these facts and they are working on helping all three of these elderly people.
It's interesting all the judgmental remarks here that accuse me of being judgemental. Typicaloftheinternet, whichoftenisnotaveryproductivevenue. But, peopleenjoyclimbingonboardandjoininginthefunofcondemningsomeone, insteadoffindingoutmoreinformation. When that happens, I usually exit, because it's a ridiculous waste of time. You all have a good day now.
Emergent, is there a reason why you were being so frugal with specific details, and speaking only in very sweeping and general terms in your initial post, when you actually had a very specific case in mind?
Of course other posters can ask you for additional information but most probably never thought to ask, because they didn’t realize that you were writing about a specific scenario. Posters aren’t mindreaders so if you want to avoid people misunderstanding you, be more upfront in the future. I believe you must realize that how you initially chose to convey the information, had a huge impact on the direction the thread took.
You seem to be expressing disappointment that internet discussions, this one included, are often not productive. Well, several posters didn’t even mention you in their posts, instead they shared some of their own personal experiences and thoughts. If it’s a productive discussion you desire, you could have chosen to offer feedback/respond to any one of those posts. Yet you didn’t. How come?
Another thing, you chose to write about a subject that in likelihood touches on a fear many people have. All us adults have one thing in common. We were once young children. Totally dependent on the care that adults gave. Few people look forward to a day when they after a long and independent life, they will onceagain return to a state where they can no longer take care of themselves.
The thought of being housed in a warehouse contemplating your upcoming demise is rather depressing. So it’s a topic that can be quite emotional and when you write an OP that’s let’s face it, isn’t exactly brimming with empathy for the elder who can no longer live independently, don’t be surprised if it provokes a reaction.
One final thought, when you describe people with a phrase like having ”lifelong patterns of sloppiness”, then ofcourse people will perceive you as judgmental. In my opinion, with the wording in your OP you really were the captain of how the thread unfolded.
Maybe we should give all options. So we can encourage assisted living, but we can also make sure we encourage ways to continue to live safer at home. So if your patient was in for a fall, we make sure to teach about rugs or footwear etc.
Maybe we should give all options. So we can encourage assisted living, but we can also make sure we encourage ways to continue to live safer at home. So if your patient was in for a fall, we make sure to teach about rugs or footwear etc.
And those monitor alerts thingies. (I'm their greatest advocate!)
Specializes in ICU/ER/Med-Surg/Case Management/Manageme.
11 hours ago, direw0lf said:
Maybe we should give all options. So we can encourage assisted living, but we can also make sure we encourage ways to continue to live safer at home. So if your patient was in for a fall, we make sure to teach about rugs or footwear etc.
Not a bad thought, direw0lf, but teaching about rugs and footwear isn't going to keep anyone out of an ALF. It's a beginning but...
We nurses need to start teaching when people are much, much younger. We need to teach importance of muscle/strength building to prevent bone issues & prevent fractures if we fall, med reviews...a million things. People with greater knowledge than me should teach us how to teach things to prevent mental decline.
I'd like to see nurses literally start "avoid the perils of old age" businesses. Or lobby hospital admins for time and funds for sessions. Many ideas but it needs to start with younger clients.
Not a bad thought, direw0lf, but teaching about rugs and footwear isn't going to keep anyone out of an ALF. It's a beginning but...
We nurses need to start teaching when people are much, much younger. We need to teach importance of muscle/strength building to prevent bone issues & prevent fractures if we fall, med reviews...a million things. People with greater knowledge than me should teach us how to teach things to prevent mental decline.
I'd like to see nurses literally start "avoid the perils of old age" businesses. Or lobby hospital admins for time and funds for sessions. Many ideas but it needs to start with younger clients.
I agree. Maybe it’s like a bandaid for me to teach about footwear. That bandaid will hold for a little while then get dirty and come off. It’s the best I feel like I’m able to do in my position/scope right now. To teach what I can to the patients I have. I agree reaching younger populations and preventing muscle wasting or to help prevent osteoporosis and mental decline would be better! I worked in pediatrics though and even then it’s like so many things working against you- access to good nutrition, good education, clean green spaces etc were the barriers.
Specializes in ICU/ER/Med-Surg/Case Management/Manageme.
You are absolutely correct. Sometimes all we have to offer is a bandaid but if we keep covering the area with one each time we see a patient or family member we'll eventually cover the entire wound.
You mention barriers. Barriers abound! But we can rely on and learn from those who've gone before us. Nutrition? Establish relationships with RD's to teach YOU.
I have lots of ideas. Unfortunately they didn't come to me until I was as old as dirt! ?
Emergent, RN
4,300 Posts
To those of you harshly judging my opening comments, the patient in question is a woman who is most likely headed to a nursing home, being cared for by a husband who is barely clinging to his independence. He is on oxygen and walks with a walker, and they rent and live with a friend, who the husband says is "losing his marbles", and unable to manage his own affairs. They've been without water for a month on the property.
They reside on rural acreage that EMS said is a classic rural hoarding situation. I was able to develop a rapport with the husband, and have a frank discussion with him about moving into a different situation. I think he now understands, and is open to letting go of all his "stuff" and getting a better housing set up. I passed onto Social Services these facts and they are working on helping all three of these elderly people.
It's interesting all the judgmental remarks here that accuse me of being judgemental. Typical of the internet, which often is not a very productive venue. But, people enjoy climbing on board and joining in the fun of condemning someone, instead of finding out more information. When that happens, I usually exit, because it's a ridiculous waste of time. You all have a good day now.