Nursing union targets Texas

U.S.A. Texas

Published

Good news for Austin :welcome: http://www.bizjournals.com/austin/stories/2005/09/19/story4.html :yelclap:

Specializes in ICU, ER, HH, NICU, now FNP.
I agree. Texas nurses could benefit greatly from unionization. However, I fear that many people here are too provincial, and are suspect of anything of which they are ignorant. Therefore, I don't think unionization will ever fly in Texas.

Provincial and ignorant have NOTHING to do with it - I have had experience with unions in a former career and you couldnt PAY me to have any dealings with any union on any level ever again - no ignorance here at all honey.

As for provincial - it is far more "provincial" to expect others to stand up for you than it is to stand up for yourself.

Your comments are out of line.

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Specializes in Critical Care.
I agree. Texas nurses could benefit greatly from unionization. However, I fear that many people here are too provincial, and are suspect of anything of which they are ignorant. Therefore, I don't think unionization will ever fly in Texas.

I don't have to be 'ignorant' of unions to suspect what benefit they can provide.

Here's the problem with unions in Texas: Texas is 'open shop' - EVEN IF A UNION COULD GET A MAJORITY VOTE, those that voted no, and many that voted yes, will not become dues paying members.

As Lizz says: unions need a strong majority to truly make waves. They will NEVER have that majority in Texas.

The result of a union in Texas will be about a 30% representation that is subsequently ignored by management. So, now we have the DISADVANTAGES of unionization (everybody treated the same, no ability to independently negotiate or shine, another layer of admin, etc.) but none of the BENEFITS (because any such union would be truly powerless. They wouldn't even hold enough power to threaten a strike, much less actually pull one off.)

I know this first hand, I actually worked at a hospital in Texas that had a union: VA San Antonio. It was ignored by everybody, staff and management alike. Why? It had as much power as a wet paper bag. What's the difference between needing a union, and having one with no spine?

And that's the problem in Texas. The system is set up to ensure that unions will NEVER have that spine. That being the case, why bother?

~faith,

Timothy.

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Why, would you want to unionize??? I worked at University of Chicago where we were unionized, and it was HORRIBLE. It bred nothing but mediocrity. If, you have twenty years of experience and are a great nurse, you give it 100% all the time you will get paid the EXACT amount as a nurse who has twenty years of experience and is a crappy nurse: comes late, barely gets his/her work done and leaves his/her patient in an unsafe manner. Oh yeah, that is a wonderful way to work: motivationg, rewarding and as always, well paid. Oh did I forget to tell you, you get to give up more of your money for those great union dues, so that wonderful union can protect that wonderfully crappy nurse, gotta' protect their "right to work."

Just think it all the way through, to what end will we end up? As professionals or as line workers?

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Here's the problem with unions in Texas: Texas is 'open shop' - EVEN IF A UNION COULD GET A MAJORITY VOTE, those that voted no, and many that voted yes, will not become dues paying members.

As Lizz says: unions need a strong majority to truly make waves. They will NEVER have that majority in Texas.

While I agree that CNA should probably focus their efforts on other areas of the country first to build a national organization .... I wouldn't say it would never happen in Texas either. What's the old saying .... Never say never?

Case in point: I live in a very conservative area of California (yes, there are conservative areas in this liberal state) that consistently votes Republican and is anti-union.

But these things also depend upon the politics of a particular facility. One hospital did go union here despite the anti-union sentiment here .... why?

Management refused to give RN's a pay raise. Instead, they hired a VP for $500,000 to keep unions out with an additional $500,000 bonus for that VP if unions stayed out.

The RN's were so infuriated that the hospital would pay this kind of money to a VP and not give them a pay raise that even anti-union RN's voted for the union.

There are certain issues that can potentially unite a strong majority of the RN's, especially if management screws up badly enough. Even you have mentioned Group One is potentially one of those issues in Texas.

Having said that, I do agree that the open shop situation is a big deterrent toward effectiveness. This is why I think CNA should focus on other areas of the country first, show what they can do, build more of a national base and then try to break into tougher states like Texas.

But let's not dismiss the possibility that there may be some facilities where outrageous things are happening, which could also give the union an opportunity to break through in Texas.

:typing

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If, you have twenty years of experience and are a great nurse, you give it 100% all the time you will get paid the EXACT amount as a nurse who has twenty years of experience and is a crappy nurse: comes late, barely gets his/her work done and leaves his/her patient in an unsafe manner. Oh yeah, that is a wonderful way to work: motivationg, rewarding and as always, well paid.

Yep, there's no question about it ... that's the downside of unions. But, the upside is that nurses with 20 years of experience who sometimes hit a pay ceiling in non-union hospitals where their experience isn't counted for as much as it should be can do very well with a union.

Case in point: Community Hospital of San Bernardino in California. Before they went union, all RN's were paid the same wages regardless of their experience. Ridiculous, I know, but that's what was happening. When the union came in experienced RN's got huge pay raises of anywhere from 35-50 percent, depending on the amount of years experience. And your experience at other facilities was counted toward that pay raise as long as you could document that experience.

Timothy is right about one thing: if your facility is treating you well and you don't need a union then don't do it. But if your facility is treating you like dirt then ... that's when a union can come in handy.

:typing

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Specializes in Critical Care.
Timothy is right about one thing: if your facility is treating you well and you don't need a union then don't do it. But if your facility is treating you like dirt then ... that's when a union can come in handy.

:typing

Yes, I will submit that unions can have their place.

But, I would prefer to 'vote with my feet' before automatically voting for a union. Union or not, management can't walk all over nurses unless nurses allow themselves to be trodden upon.

If nobody would work at that hospital you mentioned, they'd change their tune real fast. As much as hospitals hate paying for experience, experience is the bedrock of most facilities.

And I HAVE mentioned group one as a rationale for unions to find a foothold in Texas. In the meantime, however, group one doesn't scare me because I wouldn't work for a group one facility.

If I worked in California, you'd better believe I'd compare working conditions and salaries of union vs. non-union - and choose appropriately. I have a vested interest in MY bottom line and MY working conditions. I wouldn't let a 'political' view of unions get in the way of that.

My brother is a union steward in another line of work in another State. As much as he complains about the union (more than he does the management), he knows that being in a union is vital to his job conditions and salary.

~faith,

Timothy.

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But, I would prefer to 'vote with my feet' before automatically voting for a union. Union or not, management can't walk all over nurses unless nurses allow themselves to be trodden upon.

Although don't we also have to consider people's ability to "vote with their feet?" I'm curious as to how many job options people have in their areas. Some may have limited options just because of location. Or, maybe they can't move because their husband has a good job there even though their nursing job sucks.

I live in an area where commuting 30-60 miles increases my job options exponentially, so I don't hesitate to commute because I don't want to be stuck with lower pay and benefits in my immediate area.

But, I have friends with kids, etc. which makes commuting more difficult for them because of things like picking up the kids from school, etc. They also don't want to be too far away in case something happens to their kids.

I have other friends who live even farther out where commuting is made even more difficult because of distance, especially with high gas prices. If they sold their houses and tried to move closer in they'd also have to pay a lot more for their houses. Travel nursing is another option but that could also mean they'd spend a lot of time away from their family.

There's a million reasons why "voting with their feet" can be very difficult and complicated for a lot of people. Not everybody may be able to do it like you or I can.

:typing

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Yep, there's no question about it ... that's the downside of unions. But, the upside is that nurses with 20 years of experience who sometimes hit a pay ceiling in non-union hospitals where their experience isn't counted for as much as it should be can do very well with a union.

Case in point: Community Hospital of San Bernardino in California. Before they went union, all RN's were paid the same wages regardless of their experience. Ridiculous, I know, but that's what was happening. When the union came in experienced RN's got huge pay raises of anywhere from 35-50 percent, depending on the amount of years experience. And your experience at other facilities was counted toward that pay raise as long as you could document that experience.

Timothy is right about one thing: if your facility is treating you well and you don't need a union then don't do it. But if your facility is treating you like dirt then ... that's when a union can come in handy.

:typing

I went to work at a union hospital when I had 16 years of experience, and because of the union contract, I was only credited with 10 years because that is what the contract said for new hires. Then, I had to work most holidays because the new person has to regardless of experience, we could not work it out among ourselves (for instance I worked with a young single nurse with no kids that was willing to work Christmas day for me but I was required to work it per the contract) because once there is contract language spelling anyhting out...IT IS ILLEGAL FOR YOU NURSE MANAGER TO BARGAIN DIRECTLY WITH YOU...The inflexibility of a union contract can REALLY SUCK!

I worked with 2 male nurses, one was 7th day adventist and the other was catholic and they had agreed that one would work every Sat and the other would work every Sun because the contract called for every other weekend, it worked ok until someone filed a greivance...It's sooooo 2nd grade!

Most people get so focused on money, they don;t realize all the other things that make work life livable.

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You need to take 101 management and hired labor over..........

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Specializes in ICU, ER, HH, NICU, now FNP.

And you need to stop spamming threads with your personal agendas

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And that's the problem in Texas. The system is set up to ensure that unions will NEVER have that spine. That being the case, why bother?

~faith,

Timothy.

That's all part of the provincialism and "good ol boy" way of doing things in Texas.

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Specializes in ICU, ER, HH, NICU, now FNP.

We have our own spines, we don't need yours, but thanks ;)

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