Nurses Eating Nursing Students

[Cisabel]

It was our first day stepping foot on the floor.

We were lost.

We were scared.

We've all been there. If you haven't yet, you will. Some of us were sweating. Some of us were shaking. Some of us were quiet. The one thing that we did have in common is that we were all scared. Here we are, stepping on a floor, full of patients that we needed to take care of but we knew NOTHING. "Go find your nurse" is what our instructor told us. Slowly, we strolled to the different pods and introduced ourselves.

As I approached the nurse that I was to shadow the entire day, I became increasingly relaxed. She was an older nurse that looked mothering and I believed that I was going to learn a lot that day. "Ms. Martha? Hi. I'm Charlotte. I'll be your student nurse today" I widened my eyes and mustered the best smile possible, considering it is 6:30am. I was greeted with a blank stare, followed with an up and down glance that could make a dead man's veins run cold. She finally said, "Hmmmm. I already have a student nurse that is in her last semester. I need to focus on her and help her graduate. Where's your clinical instructor? Can you just be with her? If you have questions, you can ask. I just need to focus on my other student."

Let's fast forward this day. My patient went to dialysis, meaning I will not have anything to do for 4-6 hours of my 10 hour day. Because my patient was gone, I volunteered my services for her other patients. I volunteered to empty foley bags, change bedsheets or whatever other tasks or errands that needed to be done. I asked questions. After the attempts of basically begging her to let me help her were denied, I even asked if I could just watch her and shadow her without even being acknowledged. (Mind you this was my first day. I know I sounded like a sad puppy but I had no idea of what else to do). Unsurprisingly, she shot those requests down as well. This is only a small insight to how my first day went.

This is living proof that the advice that some nurses give about why nurses eat their young and all of things to do to avoid it is all FALSE!! "Make yourself available". Did that. "Ask questions and act interested". Did that. "Make sure to not come off as a know it all". Did that. "Sometimes, nurses are very busy and teaching a student will disrupt them blah blah blah!"

If you are a nurse and do not want a nursing student, JUST SAY IT! It is very unfortunate that there are some nurses out there that do not want to teach. The cornerstone of nursing is teaching. You must teach the family and patient constantly during their visit. Also, "each one, teach one" should be taken to heart. Think about when you first became a nurse. You were frightened and scared.

Fellow nursing comrades, if this has happened to you or if this ever happens to in the future, take it with stride. It is difficult to work with and hard to not take it personally. Just remember that day and vow to never EVER treat someone that is willing to learn and help with disgrace.

[Horseshoe, BSN, RN]

I understand your feeling offended. I have a BSN, but on my first hospital job I was allowed to choose my preceptor. I chose the one who had the most experience and was willing to explain things to me. My boss's first words: "you do realize she is an LVN?" Yes I did- but she was the best choice in my eyes, and I never regretted it. The quality or professionalism of a nurse is not determined by the initials after the name on the badge- I've had LVNs and ADRNs that I would trust with my life, and BSNs that I wouldn't let care for a healthy pet. A good nurse is a good nurse, period.

If you were a RN when that experienced LVN was your pre-ceptor, the whole thing was in violation of the NPA. In Texas, an LVN may NOT supervise the nursing practice of a RN. It doesn't matter how experienced the LVN is, how smart, how trustworthy. If an LVN supervises the nursing practice of an RN, she is acting out of scope. The LVN and your DON should have known that; so they were either ignorant of something pretty important, or they willingly violated the Texas NPA and could have been subject to serious legal penalties.

From the Texas BON position statements:

It is not appropriate and is beyond the scope of practice for a LVN to supervise the nursing practice of a RN.

Bad Request

The quality or professionalism of a nurse is not determined by the initials after the name on the badge-

True, but the scope of practice has everything to do with the initials.

ETA: Even though the link above says "BAD REQUEST" (have no idea why), that link will take you to the Texas BON position statements on LVN/RN/APRN scopes of practice.

[Spidey's mom, ADN, BSN, RN]

Nurses DO eat their young. Accept that and move on. . .

No. I will never accept that and move on.

NETY . . . Nurses Eat Their Young . . . is a general statement meaning every freaking nurse in the universe eats their young.

This is not true.

There are bullies but as noted by many other posters, there are bullies in all professions and walks of life.

But to paint all nurses as bullies who eat their young . . . is patently false and wrong.

There isn't anything about nursing that makes people bullies.

The bullies in nursing were bullies before they became nurses.

[sevensonnets]

I think NETY is taught in nursing schools these days, so new nurses come in looking for it and fully expect it to be there. New nurses are being done a grave disservice. They need to be learning how to be nurses instead of looking for monsters.

[Phoenix1963]

If you were a RN when that experienced LVN was your pre-ceptor, the whole thing was in violation of the NPA. In Texas, an LVN may NOT supervise the nursing practice of a RN. It doesn't matter how experienced the LVN is, how smart, how trustworthy. If an LVN supervises the nursing practice of an RN, she is acting out of scope. The LVN and your DON should have known that; so they were either ignorant of something pretty important, or they willingly violated the Texas NPA and could have been subject to serious legal penalties.

From the Texas BON position statements:

Bad Request

True, but the scope of practice has everything to do with the initials.

ETA: Even though the link above says "BAD REQUEST" (have no idea why), that link will take you to the Texas BON position statements on LVN/RN/APRN scopes of practice.

Was that in effect 20+ years ago? I didn't think of her as my supervisor; she was my teacher and peer. And my unit manager was my supervisor; she signed off on my orientation paperwork. If it was wrong, I don't regret it- she knew more than most of the RNs on that floor and I learned a lot of practical aspects of my job. She must have dont something right- I was moved to the transplant ICU once my full orientation was completed and that was a merit based move.

And yes, I understand that the scope of practice is determined by the initials, but you can have a mile of initials and still be a very poor nurse. I stand by my statement.

[Phoenix1963]

Because, like you, the OP seemed to feel that the nurse was not allowed to set limits on the demands made on her time and energy. She had a choice: do a lousy job with two students or do a decent job with one.

Not true. The older nurse could have refused 2 students; instead, she accepted the assignment and did not even TRY to do a good job. She was rude. Period. Having precepted for years I always had a choice to take more than one student.

You all keep making excuses for the older nurse. If this is how you accept assignments too, then perhaps you should consider not taking any students. Again- Professional Integrity. Get you some.

[Phoenix1963]

If you were a RN when that experienced LVN was your pre-ceptor, the whole thing was in violation of the NPA. In Texas, an LVN may NOT supervise the nursing practice of a RN. It doesn't matter how experienced the LVN is, how smart, how trustworthy. If an LVN supervises the nursing practice of an RN, she is acting out of scope. The LVN and your DON should have known that; so they were either ignorant of something pretty important, or they willingly violated the Texas NPA and could have been subject to serious legal penalties.

I was a new nurse 20 years ago; was that in place then? At any rate, she was my teacher, and my unit manager was my supervisor. It was a transplant unit with national prominence and I was promoted to the ICU once I completed my orientation, so I guess she did ok.

True, but the scope of practice has everything to do with the initials.

Indeed, but miles of initials and education means nothing if despite your education you are not good at your profession. Scope of practice is legalese; actual practice is reality, and I've met and dealt with poor RNs many times. Apparently those initials did not teach them all they needed to be a good nurse. I've met poor LVNs too, but I've met many excellent ones as well.

[heron, ASN, RN]

She did refuse ... the OP ignored it.

[RescueNinjaKy]

Don't you feel like you're talking to a brick wall at times.

[Horseshoe, BSN, RN]

Not true. The older nurse could have refused 2 students; instead, she accepted the assignment and did not even TRY to do a good job. She was rude. Period. Having precepted for years I always had a choice to take more than one student.

You have absolutely no idea whether the staff nurse had a choice to refuse the extra nursing student assignment or not.You know nothing about the culture/policies on her unit. As told by the OP, that nurse did attempt to discourage the OP from working with her that day. Your personal experiences cannot be extrapolated to everyone; certainly not to a person whose side of the side of the story we will never hear. If anyone was lacking in professional integrity, it was the OP's clinical instructor, who should have found another nurse who didn't already have an assignment, especially one who wasn't supervising a senior nursing student.

[Wuzzie]

She finally said, "Hmmmm. I already have a student nurse that is in her last semester. I need to focus on her and help her graduate. Where's your clinical instructor? Can you just be with her? If you have questions, you can ask. I just need to focus on my other student."

@Phoenix, what part of this statement are you not comprehending?

[NurseLauraM]

Don't you feel like you're talking to a brick wall at times.

Absolutely. My thoughts are that Phoenix is either too stubborn to admit she didn't read the thread initially and was wrong, or she is not able to comprehend it for some reason. I won't speculate on the latter here because surely I'll be accused of bullying.

I'm also still not convinced Phoenix isn't the OP. Aside from their completely illogical viewpoints, they share a similar writing style.

[sevensonnets]

NurseLauraM, I think you have hit on it. I've been comparing the writing styles too. Same writing style, same attitude. Somebody needs a big whopping dose of professional integrity.