Nonclinical Supervisors - vent

[Kelly_the_Great]

Hello,

Just wanted to ask if any of you have supervisors who are nonclinical? By that I mean they might have degrees in marketing, administration or maybe even political science but not nursing or anywhere close to it.

Do you find it frustrating?

I have a direct supervisor who, although very congenial and extremely intelligent, I don't think has a degree in anything at all, the next in line has a degree in marketing, then finally I have one who is a nurse and is the VP of the company. We've only talked on maybe 2 different occasions and one of those was when I was ordering cookie dough from her for her son's school project. So you see she's not greatly involved in my day to day functions as a nurse, right?

Had a little situation where a pt. complained that he called the agency and was "brushed off" by being told to go to the ER by one of the nurses (couldn't remember who or exactly when). I work phone triage for a HH agency. Find record where I had indeed, over 2 months ago, talked to this pt. who was c/o sx. of hypokalemia, just gotten out of hosp. 5 days prior and had hx. of cardiac complications. So, what did I do? I stressed the potential danger of his sx. along w/ his dx. and the need to proceed w/ caution and recommended the need for ER visit (this all occurred after hours - so MD office closed), notified the nurse on-call in his geographical area - and she agreed. I mean, I thought this was the prudent thing to do and had an RN concur. Anyways, b/c I admit to talking with this pt. and admit to advising ER visit (BTW I've never sent one that didn't subsequently get admitted to the hosp.), now I have to justify the advice b/c of "customer service" complaint. :uhoh21:

What do ya'll think?

Also, anyone else have similiar experiences?

[Daytonite, BSN, RN]

I don't quite understand the nature of the patient's complaint. Is he complaining about the advice he got, or about the personality and attitude of the person he spoke with? I don't see how your manager is relating customer service and advice. Wasn't the manager more specific with you?

[Marie_LPN, RN, LPN, RN]

I haven't experienced supervisors that were non-nclinical in a healthcare field.

To me it only makes sense for the person in CHARGE of nurses to have BEEN a nurse first. :stone

[Kelly_the_Great]

I don't quite understand the nature of the patient's complaint. Is he complaining about the advice he got, or about the personality and attitude of the person he spoke with? I don't see how your manager is relating customer service and advice. Wasn't the manager more specific with you?

No, in fact the complaint itself was really vague. He didn't remember when it took place, gave a 2 month time span (talked to lots of nurses during that time, you know?), didn't remember the exact time of day (in fact the time of day he thought it occurred is actually outside of my working hours) and didn't remember with whom exactly he spoke with.

What he said was that he was "brushed off" b/c the nurse told him to go to the ER. I spent a lot of time counseling him and stressing the importance of need for intervention and even called him back to see how he was doing and if he'd ever decided to go to the ER. Also had the nurse on-call in his area call him and she gave him the exact same advice.

You know, th' thing is, sometimes when ppl are given advice (about anything could be healthcare, could be finances, relationships, anything) they don't want to hear often it is received with ingratitude, misunderstanding, reluctance and dissatisfaction.

Oh well.

[webblarsk]

Is the on-call nurse not required to go out and assess the situation? Just curious, I work with Hospice so policy's and procedures I'm sure are a little different.

I haven't come across my immediate supervisor being non-nursing in any job I have been in. But I am sure that does make quite a difference!

[Kelly_the_Great]

Each situation is different, really. The nurse in the field ultimately makes the decision whether or not she's going to make the visit.

A lot of the nurses won't make the visit and recommend ER if they feel the need of intervention surpasses their nursing skills, tools and resources they can bring to the home. They feel it is a liability issue to their license, which I can understand, and not the best care for the patient. For instance, and this is just one example - extreme but an example, I once had a pt. call wanting an aide to come help her get dressed, can barely understand her she's breathing so heavily, I ask are you having difficulty breathing, she replies no I just need someone to help me dress, I keep her on the line, call 911, she's no longer responding, EMS arrives and she's thrown a clot (they think), DOA. In this instance, not appropriate to send a nurse out, you know? I've also had them call bleeding profusely. Just different things where the intervention should be ER visit versus nursing visit.

In turn, it is ultimately the patient's decision whether or not they will go to the ER.

[BamaBound2bRN]

I recently read an article about Nurse CEO's running large hospitals. The article was extremely positive and in part focused on the role these "Nursing Administrators" were "supervising" MD's- and vey successfully. I don't think that having a degree makes one a good supervisor anymore than not having a degree makes one a bad supervisor.

[catlady, BSN, RN]

Hello,

Just wanted to ask if any of you have supervisors who are nonclinical? By that I mean they might have degrees in marketing, administration or maybe even political science but not nursing or anywhere close to it.

Do you find it frustrating?

I am a supervisor and I have a degree in political science.

Of course, I've also been an RN for 20 years. :)

As a supervisor, no matter what my background, I'd be looking to see that you followed your agency's policy and that you documented your interventions thoroughly. If you'd done both of those, and if there were no history of complaints regarding your telephone skills, I'd be inclined not to make a big deal about it. While "customer service" is indeed important, it's also important to support your staff when they're doing a good job.

[Daytonite, BSN, RN]

You didn't mention if your job recorded it's calls. When I worked as a telephonic nurse, every single phone call was recorded and all the infomation we put into the computer was recorded along with it so any call could be played back at any time and be heard verbatim as well an observe the computer screen and what we had typed onto it. The same could be done when we made outgoing calls as well.

[webblarsk]

Each situation is different, really. The nurse in the field ultimately makes the decision whether or not she's going to make the visit.

A lot of the nurses won't make the visit and recommend ER if they feel the need of intervention surpasses their nursing skills, tools and resources they can bring to the home. They feel it is a liability issue to their license, which I can understand, and not the best care for the patient. For instance, and this is just one example - extreme but an example, I once had a pt. call wanting an aide to come help her get dressed, can barely understand her she's breathing so heavily, I ask are you having difficulty breathing, she replies no I just need someone to help me dress, I keep her on the line, call 911, she's no longer responding, EMS arrives and she's thrown a clot (they think), DOA. In this instance, not appropriate to send a nurse out, you know? I've also had them call bleeding profusely. Just different things where the intervention should be ER visit versus nursing visit.

In turn, it is ultimately the patient's decision whether or not they will go to the ER.

Thanks for the reply. I knew things were bound to be alittle different than with hospice.

[Spidey's mom, ADN, BSN, RN]

I'm a part-time Supervisor and in our rural hospital that means I'm also the ER nurse. So, our sup is working in the ER at the same time.

steph

[Kelly_the_Great]

I recently read an article about Nurse CEO's running large hospitals. The article was extremely positive and in part focused on the role these "Nursing Administrators" were "supervising" MD's- and vey successfully. I don't think that having a degree makes one a good supervisor anymore than not having a degree makes one a bad supervisor.

Hey Bama,

I guess I shouldn't have put an emphasis on the degree itself. It's just, what's frustrating for me, is that b/c neither of my immediate surpervisors have any clinical background, then I find myself having to double explain the rationale for my nursing actions, you know? Where as, if you're dealing with someone who does have a clinical background it's easier to address the issues from both perspectives, customer service & healthcare delivery.