More than 5 sick days taken in a year and disciplinary action ensues

[FireStarterRN]

The other day at work the manager was explaining to someone that once someone has been sick 5 days in one year, they will be counseled.

Now, I'm very healthy and rarely call in sick, but some others have legitimate health problems. It sounds discriminatory. She said that this is even with a doctor's note. It also seems to be an infection control issue, since truly sick people will come to work while sick, thus endangering patients.

This is a for profit hospital. There is a union contract giving people sick pay, I'm not sure the details. And, yes, there are nurses who abuse sick time, this is a reality. Yet, limiting it to 5 days when probably people are building up more sick time than that seems unfair.

I was also told in orientation that if you are to miss more than 2 days in a row of scheduled shifts, you must apply for a leave of absence. That, also, seems rather harsh.

[pagandeva2000, LPN]

My facility is coming down on sick time as well, during this recession. In the past, union jobs with the city did not have these issues, but, now, they are coming down. I have to admit that I sort of had a checkered call in list, if someone checked closely enough. Now, I conserve my energy, and thank the Creator for a job. We have two major hospitals closing down completely at the end of this month, and I can only imagine how many nurses will be out of work behind this!

[wonderbee, BSN, RN]

We used to have a unit director who would require the charge nurse to give anyone "a hard time" who called off on a weekend. Additionally, that poor sick person not only had to call the charge RN, but also the assistant unit director at home. As if though we that much control over illness!!

If anyone gave me a hard time when I was ill, I would consider it harrassment.

Why is nursing so prone to unreasonable demands?

[Ruby Vee, BSN]

i was not implying that you would not be very sad to put a dog down, i too have one ... but to plan to put your dog down over your work days as opposed to using your time off days, is, imho an abuse of the sick leave.

assuming one gets a choice about when to put one's dog down, one should choose to do it on one's day off. however, when our dog needed to be put down, we didn't really have a choice about the timing of it. it's not as if she'd been dwindling for months and we picked august 19 as the day to put her down, nevermind that it was a work day for both of us. she'd been vary healthy and then she wasn't, and the choice needed to be made pretty much immediately to avoid putting her through unnecessary pain and suffering. i don't feel a bit guilty about putting my dog to sleep on what should have been a work day.

[Ruby Vee, BSN]

i think, like most oppressive sick time policies, this one has been put into place to give managment a hook to hang some of the sick time abusers from. i've been counseled about my use of sick time in the past -- mostly, i think, by managers who weren't sure if i was going to become a problem or not. i called in sick over a weekend one time, and the new manager called me into her office to tell me that it wasn't acceptable to call in sick on a weekend. when i pointed out to her that i worked every weekend, and that if i were going to be too sick to come to work it naturally would be on a weekend, she got it.

another manager counseled me about my frequent use of sick time, and it was sort of a wake up call to me. i hadn't realized that i wasn't coping as well with my abusive husband as i thought i was. i was coming down with frequent uris, utis, stomach upsets, etc. evidently i had a pattern of calling in sick whenever my husband was going to be away and it was safe for me to be in my house. when he was home for an extended period of time, i'd work every minute of overtime that i could get. a wise manager noticed what was going on before i had figured it out, and was instrumental in my decision to get out.

but mostly, i think those kinds of policies get put into place as a way to document someone's failure to follow the standards and maybe get rid of a problem employee.

[Pepperlady]

assuming one gets a choice about when to put one's dog down, one should choose to do it on one's day off. however, when our dog needed to be put down, we didn't really have a choice about the timing of it. it's not as if she'd been dwindling for months and we picked august 19 as the day to put her down, nevermind that it was a work day for both of us. she'd been vary healthy and then she wasn't, and the choice needed to be made pretty much immediately to avoid putting her through unnecessary pain and suffering. i don't feel a bit guilty about putting my dog to sleep on what should have been a work day.

well, i don't think i deserve an attack on a comment i made that was imho ... however, as the thread is about sick time and why some facilities are unreasonable about it, if someone feels that this is an appropriate use of sick time, then one cannot complain about the facility monitoring more closely than seems reasonable.

[ohmeowzer RN, RN]

when my cat passed away on dec 17th i called off on dec 19th. no one said a word to me about calling in that day.

[highlandlass1592, BSN, RN]

Well, I don't think I deserve an attack on a comment I made that was IMHO ... however, as the thread is about sick time and why some facilities are unreasonable about it, if someone feels that this is an appropriate use of sick time, then one cannot complain about the facility monitoring more closely than seems reasonable.

This wasn't an attack..and as you posted your comment on a public forum, you shouldn't be surprised when it is commented upon...I found your opinion to be a bit condenscending. You may not understand how much a dog can mean to someone...my dogs are all I have since I've lost my husband...they are as important to me as someone else's children may be to them. I think your comment belittles MY feelings and I would agree with Ruby's comments to you. And yes, I do have the right to complain about facilities that give sick time then impose draconian measures so they don't have to pay that particular benefit.

[gentlegiver, ASN, LPN, RN]

We used to have a unit director who would require the charge nurse to give anyone "a hard time" who called off on a weekend. Additionally, that poor sick person not only had to call the charge RN, but also the assistant unit director at home. As if though we that much control over illness!!

If anyone gave me a hard time when I was ill, I would consider it harrassment.

Why is nursing so prone to unreasonable demands?

Where I worked, if you called out on a weekend you had to reschedule to work another weekend shift (on your weekend off) within 30 days of call out. AND they still reprimanded you for calling out! So you would end up working the hours required for the month, and get written up for 3 absences' no matter how far apart they were in the 12 month period. I agree some people do take advantage of calling out. But I was really sick with the flu twice (1x in spring & 1x in fall), a migraine (severe). They asked if I had a fever (I am one of those rare people who have never run a fever even when I had pneumonia, documented by my Dr) when I said no they still wanted me to come in. I give up, you'd think a NURSE would be more compassionate and understand that not everyone shows the same symptoms when sick.

[sissiesmama, ASN, RN]

I'm not a sick time abuser, but I would totally call in sick if I had to put my dog down and not feel the least bit sorry or guilty for it! I wouldn't admit to my employer that was the reason, but I will be very sad the day I have to say good-bye to my dog.

Well, I had to put my 16 yr. old dog to sleep, and you can BET I called in that day. I didn't tell them to put me down for a "dead dog", but I was NOT there and would do it again in a heartbeat if I have to bury another one. I agree with you completely.

Anne, RNC

I didn't plan or choose to put him down. I think that would be awfully cruel to an animal that was terminal and in a lot of pain to "schedule" his death around my schedule. Just my .02.

[sissiesmama, ASN, RN]

assuming one gets a choice about when to put one's dog down, one should choose to do it on one's day off. however, when our dog needed to be put down, we didn't really have a choice about the timing of it. it's not as if she'd been dwindling for months and we picked august 19 as the day to put her down, nevermind that it was a work day for both of us. she'd been vary healthy and then she wasn't, and the choice needed to be made pretty much immediately to avoid putting her through unnecessary pain and suffering. i don't feel a bit guilty about putting my dog to sleep on what should have been a work day.

ruby - that was my point exactly. i'm not saying another poster was being cold, but it was not exactly a "choice" to put my dog sam to sleep. even though he was almost 16 years old, he did not act like he was sick or in pain until about 16 hours before we got to the vet. it broke my heart because he was in so much pain and i'd had him for so long. i did not go, and if i had to do it again, i would do it the same way.

anne, rnc

and i would probably do a better job if i was sick than i would if i was at work and thinking about my doggie that had been with me for years lying on a table at a vet's office having to go through that. and, yes, i know that if i were at work ill i my make a patient ill, but if we get penalized for calling in at times, they are getting exposed to germs anyway when we are told we have to come in ill.

[sissiesmama, ASN, RN]

Well, I don't think I deserve an attack on a comment I made that was IMHO ... however, as the thread is about sick time and why some facilities are unreasonable about it, if someone feels that this is an appropriate use of sick time, then one cannot complain about the facility monitoring more closely than seems reasonable.

You stated your opinion, Ruby was stating her opinion also.

Anne, RNC

[Multicollinearity, BSN, RN]

We used to have a unit director who would require the charge nurse to give anyone "a hard time" who called off on a weekend. Additionally, that poor sick person not only had to call the charge RN, but also the assistant unit director at home. As if though we that much control over illness!!

If anyone gave me a hard time when I was ill, I would consider it harrassment.

Why is nursing so prone to unreasonable demands?

It's not just nursing. I think it's this way in many jobs.

Years ago when I worked as a sales person at a new car dealership, I had to leave in the middle of a 12 hour shift because I had a fever and ear infection that I needed to be seen for. I don't think I had had a single sick absence in a year. I distinctly recall my sales manager chasing me into the women's bathroom, shouting that if I left to not come back.

It was the end of the month and if he didn't meet his quota he was going to be fired. So he was threatening me, hoping I'd stay at work while sick and sell a car for his management quota. Imagine how his boss treated him. See, the crap just rolls down hill through the ranks.

Another non-nursing example - my cousin is an attorney. He was raised by our grandparents. When our grandfather died, my cousin was scheduled for a routine court hearing, not a trial. The judge would not reschedule the routine, non-urgent hearing so he could attend the funeral. Officer of the court, mandatory attendance, blah blah blah.

Sometimes I wonder about our priorities in the US. But that's a topic for another thread.