Marijuana and nursing

MrChicagoRN, RN · Mar 30, 2014

It is still illegal under federal law. That will trump the state laws if they (feds) pursue it.
I don't see any board of nursing loosing up on it in the foreseeable future.
You can have a script for opioids and still run into issues with the board.

^this.

As long as hospitals are medicare dependent, the Feds are going to demand compliance, the BON is going to follow.

State law is likely to remain irrelevant for sometime.

so, bottom line...stay sober till your 21...then go have a drink. :sarcastic:

roser13, ASN, RN · Mar 30, 2014

But why? Why do you care if a nurse smoked on his day off 3 days before the next shift? Why? Don't you know the pharmacology of marihuana? I don't mean to offend you but I just don't understand this attitude.
And I am not talking about a nurse high (or drunk) while at work. That is unsafe and plain stupid. But, just like I have wine on my days off, why can't I smoke? It's a great anxiolytic and much safer than other meds.
I just don't get it.

At age 18, already so concerned about her ability to smoke pot while practicing her chosen profession that she's researching it online?

I don't think that's "recreational" use. Sounds like an issue to me.

edmia, BSN, RN · Mar 30, 2014

At age 18, already so concerned about her ability to smoke pot while practicing her chosen profession that she's researching it online?
I don't think that's "recreational" use. Sounds like an issue to me.

Not to me. People can smoke every single day and not be addicted or have their life affected. Marihuana is not heroin. It is a completely different thing. I know people who have smoked for years on a daily basis. They have never been arrested, they don't drive high and have never had an accident, they have intact families, they have good jobs and make lots of money.

That's why I don't understand the arguments against it. But maybe it's the influence of my 70s upbringing. Pot has always been a normal thing to me due to the community I grew up around. It just does not scare or worry me.

Opioids are another beast. That's a problem.

Boog'sCRRN246, RN · Mar 30, 2014

Unless I missed a huge breaking news story, marijuana has not been legalized (for medical use or otherwise) in Florida, so I'm not sure why you are even questioning this. I mean, you can do what you want on your days off, but possession of marijuana is still illegal here and a positive drug test will still get your job offer rescinded or get you fired.

mrsboots87 · Mar 30, 2014

Its the same as any other legal drug or drink. Drugs metabolize in the system at different rates individually, and based on how chronic the usage is. You can smoke once, and be impaired for 3 days. You can smoke once and be impaired for a few hours and done. Just depends on the person. Because it varies so much, I highly doubt any facility or BON is going to turn a blind eye to a positive drug screen for legal MJ. If a patient or coworkers report your actions as unsafe and impaired and you test positive, you just lost your job and possibly your license. Same with prescription pain meds, sedative, some antidepressants. Some people are more impaired than others, and if you come to work impaired from your narcs or whatever, your prescription will not save your job. I agree with the worry at 18 being enough to make you even research this is unsettling. I am not against pot. I was a long time smoker. Then I grew up, decided I wanted to be in the nursing field, and ditched the pot for the safety of my future patients. You should do the same. And if not, for the love of God, please know your tolerance and how long to abstain before starting a shift. I don't really care about your license, but I do care about the patients you will care for.

mhy12784 · Mar 30, 2014

Look at it this way:
You come to work, act a little "off" and your supervisor reports your behavior. An immediate test shows alcohol in your system.
Fired immediately. Just because it's legal doesn't mean that you can come to work under the influence.
Same, same for pot.
If, at age 18, you're questioning this, I say choose another major. I, personally, don't want you caring for me or my loved ones.
Actually, I already knew this, but my reinforced prayer today is: Please, God, keep me safe from the State of Florida.

Just out of curiosity on the alcohol thing, how much alcohol are we talking here?

Ive never drank on work days, but ive always wondered on this. Are we talking similar to DUI limit ? Or could someone legitimately get fired if they have a glass of wine with dinner before work ?

id imagine that alcohol would be significantly different than opiods/illegal drugs etc which id suspect would all have zero tolerance.

Reminds me of the crazy (and scary) stories ive heard from some older nurses (who started nursing in the 70s/80s) telling me about how when they were my age they would go out all night after work, then end up pulling an all nighter and going to work the next day from the bar puking between patients and what not.

How the times change

toomuchbaloney · Mar 30, 2014

Its the same as any other legal drug or drink. Drugs metabolize in the system at different rates individually, and based on how chronic the usage is. You can smoke once, and be impaired for 3 days. Do you have a reference for this? I have NEVER read a single piece of literature which supports your opinion. While you are entitled to your opinion, facts are preferred when discussing this issue which is already heavy with prejudice and ignorance. You can smoke once and be impaired for a few hours and done. Just depends on the person. Because it varies so much, I highly doubt any facility or BON is going to turn a blind eye to a positive drug screen for legal MJ. It really depends upon the state and the facility and the circumstances. For instance, I am aware of an RN who has a valid RX for marijuana and is actively employed while living in a state where recreational use is prohibited. She, of course, tested positive on the mandatory pre-employment U/A and the employer opted to go forward with the hire after having an intelligent and professional discussion. If a patient or coworkers report your actions as unsafe and impaired and you test positive, you just lost your job and possibly your license. Same with prescription pain meds, sedative, some antidepressants. Some people are more impaired than others, and if you come to work impaired from your narcs or whatever, your prescription will not save your job. Working while impaired is quite a separate matter from using cannabis during personal time away from work. Persistence in implying that those who might use cannabis while away from work are also working impaired only serves to suggest that you have a personal bias. I agree with the worry at 18 being enough to make you even research this is unsettling. I am not against pot. I was a long time smoker. Then I grew up, decided I wanted to be in the nursing field, and ditched the pot for the safety of my future patients. You should do the same. And if not, for the love of God, please know your tolerance and how long to abstain before starting a shift. I don't really care about your license, but I do care about the patients you will care for.

That a professional should abstain from use of cannabis or opiates or amphetamines or alcohol before starting a shift is pretty self evident, except to the alcoholic or the abuser of opiates or amphetamines.

The POTUS has already stated that he favors a decriminalization of cannabis at the federal level. His attorney general is acting in accordance and has directed his staff to not seek out opportunities to prosecute relative to cannabis. Finally, the alcohol industry is losing it's grip on the American public relative to this plant. It is past time for us to grow up, become educated on the truth related to risks and benefits of the plant, and stop treating it like heroin.

I have commented before that after more than 3 decades in nursing I would much rather work with someone who has smoked a bunch of pot the night before than with someone who drank until drunk the night before. Alcohol is MUCH more likely to impair our judgement for HOURS after the acute drunk and it is known to be much more dangerous to our overall health.

Having said all of that I have no anticipation that the corporate world is going to, in general, relax their prejudice relative to cannabis regardless of legality. They enjoy their ability to test, screen, and judge the blue collar workers. The rights of the average American relative to search and seizure have largely been given (by our legislators) away as related to our relationship with the all mighty "free market". They weren't happy that they their ability to pick and choose employees based upon race, gender, or disability have been curbed. They aren't likely to step away from their drug screens.

Esme12, ASN, BSN, RN · Mar 30, 2014

Unless I missed a huge breaking news story marijuana has not been legalized (for medical use or otherwise) in Florida, so I'm not sure why you are even questioning this. I mean, you can do what you want on your days off, but possession of marijuana is still illegal here and a positive drug test will still get your job offer rescinded or get you fired.[/size']

I thought I was the only one who saw that. :yeah:

OP the legalization of marijuana in Colorado or Washington state has nothing what so ever to do with smoking pot in Florida.

Don't get me wrong. I think it should be legalized after they can determine being under the active influence versus smoking 2 days before.

But marijuana is not legal in any way, shape, or form in Florida.

KelRN215, BSN, RN · Mar 30, 2014

Others have already commented on this but, since marijuana is not legal in Florida in any capacity, yes you'd get in trouble if you tested positive for it. And employers are permitted to test you pretty much whenever. You test positive on a pre-employment drug screen you will be denied employment and (likely) reported to the BoN. You test positive while at work and you will be terminated and, again, likely reported to the BoN. (In my state, reporting to the BoN is mandatory in this situation.) Your employer doesn't have to specifically suspect you of something to test you. Narcotic count is off, they decide to test everyone. You test positive for cannabis and are immediately terminated. You get hurt while on the job and get sent to the ER. They drug screen you, you test positive and now you work will argue that they are not liable for your injuries. So not only will you not get workman's comp for your on-the-job injury, you'll find yourself without a job... and possibly without a nursing license.

As a disclaimer, even in states where marijuana IS legal for recreational (Colorado and Washington) or medical use (many states, Florida is not one of them), employers are still unlikely to allow it for their employees. The hospital I worked at wouldn't allow anyone to work in a clinical capacity if he/she was on narcotics. Whether or not you had a valid prescription, you were not allowed to work while taking narcotics.

Nursing and marijuana use are not compatible.

mrsboots87 · Mar 31, 2014

That a professional should abstain from use of cannabis or opiates or amphetamines or alcohol before starting a shift is pretty self evident, except to the alcoholic or the abuser of opiates or amphetamines.

The POTUS has already stated that he favors a decriminalization of cannabis at the federal level. His attorney general is acting in accordance and has directed his staff to not seek out opportunities to prosecute relative to cannabis. Finally, the alcohol industry is losing it's grip on the American public relative to this plant. It is past time for us to grow up, become educated on the truth related to risks and benefits of the plant, and stop treating it like heroin.
I have commented before that after more than 3 decades in nursing I would much rather work with someone who has smoked a bunch of pot the night before than with someone who drank until drunk the night before. Alcohol is MUCH more likely to impair our judgement for HOURS after the acute drunk and it is known to be much more dangerous to our overall health.
Having said all of that I have no anticipation that the corporate world is going to, in general, relax their prejudice relative to cannabis regardless of legality. They enjoy their ability to test, screen, and judge the blue collar workers. The rights of the average American relative to search and seizure have largely been given (by our legislators) away as related to our relationship with the all mighty "free market". They weren't happy that they their ability to pick and choose employees based upon race, gender, or disability have been curbed. They aren't likely to step away from their drug screens.

I have actually done a research project on medical MJ use and its effects, tolerance level variability, and so on. I did not feel the need to drudge that paper out (and yes I used peer reviewed journals even though there weren't that many out there that discussed what I was looking for) and start referencing my comment. Before your tear my comment apart, why don't you just give your opinion and move on. My comment was a simplified version of what I found when writing my research paper. I did not say it was 100% correct as much of research is left to interpretation. It was my opinion based on what I learned and I feel confident is stating that tolerance levels for any drug, MJ included, varies from person to person. Therefore MOST, I never said every single institution, but MOST facilities will heavily frown and probable find a reason to fire someone who tests positive after being reported as impaired or through random screening. Your anecdotal evidence of knowing one person who has a MJ script and is allowed to work hardly tells of the likelihood of most individuals being given the same opportunity.

I also never stated I have a personal bias. You basically perused over my comment that was meant to be read as a whole and picked it apart piece by piece, which was not how it was intended to be read. My basic point was that IF your ARE impaired at work and test positive, you will probably lose your job. IF you smoke on your time off, and do not come to work impaired, then who knows. It would be up to the employer if they keep you for testing positive on random screen. I never implied that everyone who smokes is impaired at work. You actually put those words in my mouth to state I have a bias. Smoke all you want. I couldn't care less, UNLESS it impairs your ability to function at work and possibly harm patients. And at the age of 18, the brain isn't fully matured and stupid decisions get made. What if the OP gets street weed and it is laced with something. The only way to get "clean" weed is at a dispensary, and even then its not always tested for added drugs that may have contaminated the weed while being packaged. The OP could be smoking weed unintentionally laced with coke or other drugs, which would further alter how long she is impaired. SOrry this is going all over the place, but before picking my comment apart, try reading it as a whole and you will see what I was trying to say.

And I would like to note I would rather not be cared for at all by someone who was drunk the night before equally as much as I would like to not be cared for by someone who got high all night. From my many years of smoking weed, I can say that depending on the quality and the type of weed being smoked that there were nights I was fine within a couple hours, woke up the next day and functioned completely fine. Then there were other nights that I was so high I went to bed and woke up still impaired for a majority of the day. Too much variability for me to be comfortable being cared for by an individual impaired by anything. And no I do not mean all smokers are impaired at work and some do know how to smoke and give themselves enough time to be fine before work. But theres still a risk of testing and getting canned.

iluvgusgus · Mar 31, 2014

Look at it this way:
You come to work, act a little "off" and your supervisor reports your behavior. An immediate test shows alcohol in your system.
Fired immediately. Just because it's legal doesn't mean that you can come to work under the influence.
Same, same for pot.
If, at age 18, you're questioning this, I say choose another major. I, personally, don't want you caring for me or my loved ones.
Actually, I already knew this, but my reinforced prayer today is: Please, God, keep me safe from the State of Florida.

She's only 18, she may mature and change her thinking in the next few years. I would hope that if nursing school is a serious consideration, you become mature about your behavior and choices in your private life and social life and not make bad decisions that will follow you for the rest of your life. And that includes using drugs,binge drinking, and driving under the influence.

Roser13, I am offended that you would say "keep me safe from the State of Florida" I was not born and raised in FL but I am a nurse here and I am a damn good nurse and I am safe and so are my co-workers.

PulselessNine · Mar 31, 2014

OP, you have three options. Change your mind, change your career, or change your handle. The fact that you are discussing the practice of socially unacceptable recreational use of a substance places you in a negative light among those already in the profession as well as potential patients. Unless you are a lawyer there is no point in asking questions to which you already know the answer.

Good luck to you.