Managers, Nurses and Delegation: Who Has Authority?

Nurses General Nursing

Updated:   Published

So wanted to brainstorm through a situation that came up recently.   At my facility, I am normally a nurse manager for a rehab unit.   Because of the COVID pandemic and fewer patients, I have been moved to assist on the LTC unit.  

The other day, when I went down there, one of the nurses listed off various things they were needing help with down on the unit: med pass, feeding people, vital signs, obtaining daily weights, etc.  I explained to her that I could help out with some things, but that I would still be attending to other duties, such as attending morning meetings and completing telehealth provider visits.  She seemed to understand at that time. 

However, about a day later, a patient had requested an enema in the afternoon. I passed this along to the nurse, who stated she would get to it if she had time.  About 5 minutes towards shift change, she mentioned to me that she had never gotten to it, and that the oncoming replacement was a TMA, who isn't supposed to be giving enemas.  In other words, I believe she was implying that I should be the one to do it.   

I gave her a couple of options: I could help finish up with some of her charting so she would have time, or she could pass it along to the evening supervisor.  I explained that I already had admission orders to review from the other unit.  I believe she ended up passing along the task to the evening supervisor.  From my knowledge, the enema was never  given because the patient ended up having a couple of large bowel movements.  

What I am wondering is who had authority in this situation.  The nurse seemed like she wanted to delegate certain tasks to me, but, as a manager, I would think it would be me that determines who completes which tasks, not her.  I guess I'm not sure what should have been done since we each had different opinions on who should do what.  The patient ended up being fine, but just wondering about future situations like this.  

Who does the delegation? The manager or the nurse?  

Specializes in Rehab/Nurse Manager.

A couple of other things: 

1. I've had to go in and edit some of my posts due to spelling or grammar errors.  Therefore,  my writing skills might not be as strong as I make them out to be.

2. There might be a reason all of the other individuals who have held my position have been about 15-20+ years older than myself.  I'm the first manager they've ever hired that was still in her 20's when she got the promotion.   There could be a reason for this.  It also means that if I were to step down from this role for awhile, I still have many more working years to be a manager should I decide I'm interested 

Specializes in Pediatrics, Pediatric Float, PICU, NICU.
1 hour ago, SilverBells said:

 But since I do, it's more than reasonable to assume that I avoided the enema due to the type of task it was, rather than not having time.  It's not something I'm proud of for sure; truthfully, I probably could have made the time.  It was just a situation that I was somewhat feeling guilty about and kept wondering if I'd handled it the right way by offering to do another task or delegating it to the evening supervisor. 

But see, not having time as an excuse also doesn’t make sense because as another poster said 10 minutes of your time is 10 minutes regardless of whether you’re giving an enema or charting. So no it isn’t about not having time either because if you truly didn’t have time to give an enema you also didn’t have time to chart, or to help at all period and you should have just said that.

Specializes in Rehab/Nurse Manager.
11 minutes ago, JadedCPN said:

But see, not having time as an excuse also doesn’t make sense because as another poster said 10 minutes of your time is 10 minutes regardless of whether you’re giving an enema or charting. So no it isn’t about not having time either because if you truly didn’t have time to give an enema you also didn’t have time to chart, or to help at all period and you should have just said that.

That's true

Specializes in Rehab/Nurse Manager.
1 hour ago, JadedCPN said:

But see, not having time as an excuse also doesn’t make sense because as another poster said 10 minutes of your time is 10 minutes regardless of whether you’re giving an enema or charting. So no it isn’t about not having time either because if you truly didn’t have time to give an enema you also didn’t have time to chart, or to help at all period and you should have just said that.

And it probably stems from the fact that I was double checking an assessment/orders on an admission that someone else was taking care of.   Realistically I didn’t need to be assisting with any part of that admission.  Someone else was working on it and had not requested any help with it.  I was completing a Drug Regimen Review even though 2 other nurses had done one on the same patient 

Specializes in Community and Public Health, Addictions Nursing.

OP, I think part of the issue is that you're mixing up your terminology. The title of your post is "Managers, Nurses, and Delegation". There's the first problem- in no way was your situation a case of delegation. It was a case of you volunteering a certain amount of your time to help your staff.

The second problem is that you strayed from your original boundary of "I have xx minutes to help", and added on too much personal fluff about what you could and couldn't do in that time. What you did with that time should have only mattered in terms of 1) patient outcomes and 2) staff support. Do as much as you can in the time you have to make your patients and your staff happy, whether it's giving an enema, charting, passing out balloons, whatever. It really doesn't matter as long as others find it helpful and it stays within the time you have allotted yourself. OK, fine, I'll add that it should also be a reasonable staff request- balloons might be a tad too outlandish.

If you find yourself in a managerial role where you're simply not familiar with the daily work of your staff, and you literally don't know how to do what they do, that's another story. But that's not the case with you- you used to be a staff nurse in that nursing home, just like them! So be the model team player that I'm sure you want them to be, and HELP. If you notice staff struggling with different skills or tasks while you're helping them, turn that into a staff training for another day. But in the meantime, please just give the enema if that's what someone needs you to do. There's a bowel movement waiting in the background, and it doesn't care if you're better at charting than you are at hands-on tasks. 

If your managerial role seems to be heading towards a lot of work that you don't really care for, then the best thing to do might be to look for a new job. I was a manager once. I realized that a lot of the responsibilities being put on me were either things that had nothing to do with nursing and instead belonged to an entirely different profession, or they were things that I didn't like to do. I cut my losses and left (for those reasons plus wayyy more), and it was because at the end of the day, if that's what that agency and staff needed to succeed, I knew I would only be holding them back if I stayed. Tough realization, because there were certainly things about the job I liked, but in the end I'm at a job that's a way better fit for me, and I feel like I'm making much more of a difference for my coworkers and patients. 

I’m going to say something here and you need to listen.  One time my manager asked me what I needed help with.  My patient that we had just cardioverted needed a clean up.  My pod was very busy and there was nobody else. I told my manager I needed help with a clean up.  She gladly jumped in and helped me.  She didn’t offer to do my charting.  She physically helped me clean up my patient with a smile.  I thanked her.  My respect for her increased substantially.  

You are being sent to help nurses on the LTC side.  For goodness sakes help them with what they actually ask you for.  Get your elbows dirty.  I promise, it won’t kill you.

Specializes in ICU.

I’m over these posts, but I really just had to jump in to say one thing. I’d take the satisfaction of helping a patient poop over charting any day. ? 

Specializes in Hospice, LPN.
4 hours ago, SilverBells said:

A couple of other things: 

1. I've had to go in and edit some of my posts due to spelling or grammar errors.  Therefore,  my writing skills might not be as strong as I make them out to be.

 

Former English teacher here, from a teaching standpoint will agree about your writing skills.

Possibly your nursing skills are not as strong as you make them out to be.

It seems that you're very lonely. Is there a more productive way to engage with people?

Specializes in Mental health, substance abuse, geriatrics, PCU.
On 2/2/2021 at 10:39 PM, LovingLife123 said:

I’m going to say something here and you need to listen.  One time my manager asked me what I needed help with.  My patient that we had just cardioverted needed a clean up.  My pod was very busy and there was nobody else. I told my manager I needed help with a clean up.  She gladly jumped in and helped me.  She didn’t offer to do my charting.  She physically helped me clean up my patient with a smile.  I thanked her.  My respect for her increased substantially.  

You are being sent to help nurses on the LTC side.  For goodness sakes help them with what they actually ask you for.  Get your elbows dirty.  I promise, it won’t kill you.

Silverbells, read the quoted post and reread it because it's very true. A manager that is hands on with patient care every once in a while will gain a lot more respect and loyalty from employees. My best managers have always been the ones that pitched in when things were rough, sometimes it meant that they got behind on some of their own duties, but if the patients aren't taken care of... what else matters?

There are careers, even management roles, where handling paperwork is paramount. When people in general think about nursing, they think about those who are engaged in assisting people. You should give some serious thought to finding your niche in one of the paramount paperwork careers. Most of us would not want to be the person in need of the enema who finds out you offered to do paperwork after the entire shift had gone by.

Specializes in Dialysis.
9 hours ago, UrbanHealthRN said:

If you find yourself in a managerial role where you're simply not familiar with the daily work of your staff, and you literally don't know how to do what they do, that's another story. But that's not the case with you- you used to be a staff nurse in that nursing home, just like them! So be the model team player that I'm sure you want them to be, and HELP. If you notice staff struggling with different skills or tasks while you're helping them, turn that into a staff training for another day. 

The OP has stated in more than one post that she doesn't really know the hands on, and is very uncomfortable to do it. This leaves her in a place that she isn't ready to be a role model. I think she needs to step back, get comfortable with the basics, so that she can eventually be the leader that she wants to be. I'll also add, there is a big difference between leader and manager. You can be one or both. Leader, with or without manager qualities, gets respect. Manager, alone without leadership qualities, gets little to no respect. 

ETA: the OP posted awhile back that she had a favorite patient in another part of her facility, not in her patient load. She did the minimal basics with her load, then left to go spend time with her favorite, on the clock. Other nurses/staff would be looking for her, as there were needs for her patients that she needed to address. She wondered why other nurses couldn't take care of her load so she could visit her favorite...ummm, they have their own to take care of...this was the post that jumps out at me as a red flag about this poster, and I'll probably never forget it, since the absolute flippant attitude toward her actions and neglecting her patients just went opposite of everything that I know and do as a nurse. This recent line of postings by the OP isn't a shock, and comes as no surprise. 

Specializes in Clinical Research, Outpt Women's Health.

I am sure that nurse didn't feel like they got any help at all.

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