Male modesty double standard

Published

While working in the trauma room in a large US city I witnessed this scenario of the double standard of modesty for male patients many times.The police would routinely walk in the trauma room and were allowed to stand around and watch as patients were put through the necessary but extremely embarrassing ordeal required in trauma resucitation. If the patient was a female the curtains would be immediately closed and kept closed until the entire trauma procedure was complete. If the patient was a male the curtains were always left open and the police officers which often included female officers were allowed to watch as the patient was stripped naked, under went a digital rectal exam and catheterized. Allowing the police especially female police officers to watch this is blatant patient abuse. I think people should consider suing the hospitals as this double standard of modesty for male patients is an extreme violation of medical ethics and standards of decency that are supposed to apply to all patients. Police should not be allowed to enter the trauma room in the first place without permission or be allowed to " hang out " there while patients are being treated.

SionainnRN said:

Do you think the cops are just hanging out in the trauma room for fun? To get their jollies?

Male guards record female strip searches

Police videotaped DUI suspects undressing, using the toilet

Woman Stripped Completely Naked By 3 Male Police Officers

Police Strip Woman and Left Her Naked For 6 Hours

Cops sexually assault mother, break 10-year-old son's leg

“The officer flicked the piercing, he flicked the ring up with his finger on my right breast,” she said. “He said, ‘Is this what mothers look like these days?’

​Someone stated there are outliers in every profession. How do you distinguish a cop who is a sexual predator standing and watching from one who thinks that he is doing his job?

Up Vote Up Vote ×
Specializes in Emergency Room, Trauma ICU.
SionainnRN said:

Male guards record female strip searches

Police videotaped DUI suspects undressing, using the toilet

Woman Stripped Completely Naked By 3 Male Police Officers

Police Strip Woman and Left Her Naked For 6 Hours

Cops sexually assault mother, break 10-year-old son's leg

​Someone stated there are outliers in every profession. How do you distinguish a cop who is a sexual predator standing and watching from one who thinks that he is doing his job?

If the cop is in a trauma room and the pt is being worked on to a degree that they are naked, pretty sure the cop has no choice in having to be there. You seriously aren't getting it. Yes there are bad people in every single profession, and the cops in your examples are abusing their place in power. But when the pt is in a TRAUMA and we are trying to save their lives, do you think if it wasn't necessary for their job that the cop would be there?? I mean if we're working on a trauma and a random cop walks in the bay and just hangs out, do you think anyone would let that happen? No. They would get screamed at to get the hell out of there and if they didn't they'd have security called on them. You obviously have some issues with cops and I don't think this is an appropriate forum for you to work them out on.

Up Vote Up Vote ×
Are you seriuosly trying to say that if no cops were present pts were left in rooms with curtains open and stark naked? Cause I'm calling bull. There is no way that happened. And honestly the way you talk, how you give examples, makes no sense. So did the nurse close the curtain when she was out of the room and the cops were in? Was it easier for the nurses to work outside the room with the curtains in the room open? You really need to work on giving clearer examples, because what you are saying makes zero sense.

The only time I have ever seen a pt completely naked with no attempts to cover them was when they were brought into the trauma bay, clothes were cut off and everyone was attempting to figure out the extent of their injuries and/or resuscitating them. The fact that you are convinced that every hospital has nurses stripping pts for the pleasure of the cops, makes me wonder about your mental state....

On TV I've seen trauma rooms that treated one patient. Is that what you're calling a trauma bay. The trauma room I worked in was one big room with 4 beds. They could treat up to 4 patients at a time. Each bed had it's own curtains. If a female patient was being treated and only medical personnel were in the room the curtains were left open. If the police or a second patient was brought in the curtains were automatically closed. If the patient was male the curtains were left open.

In my original post

While working in the trauma room in a large US city I witnessed this scenario of the double standard of modesty for male patients many times.The police would routinely walk in the trauma room and were allowed to stand around and watch as patients were put through the necessary but extremely embarrassing ordeal required in trauma resucitation. If the patient was a female the curtains would be immediately closed and kept closed until the entire trauma procedure was complete.

In my second post a made spelling error that I corrected in the thrid post.

When I say watch this procedure I am referring to male patients since they always close the curtains for female patients and always leave them n for a male patients.

it should have read "always leave them open for a male patient." in stead of " always leave n for a male patient. I forgot the ope in open. No I was not implying the nurses left the room at all. The pts were never left alone.

And no I'm not saying every nurse in this country is stripping male patients for the pleasure of cops. I'm telling you what I saw.

Up Vote Up Vote ×
SionainnRN said:

Male guards record female strip searches

Police videotaped DUI suspects undressing, using the toilet

Woman Stripped Completely Naked By 3 Male Police Officers

Police Strip Woman and Left Her Naked For 6 Hours

Cops sexually assault mother, break 10-year-old son's leg

​Someone stated there are outliers in every profession. How do you distinguish a cop who is a sexual predator standing and watching from one who thinks that he is doing his job?

If I spent enough time searching the internet for information on musicians, bus drivers or ventriloquists who've committed crimes or displayed deviant behavior, I would find it. Luckily I'm not obsessed with any of them, so I don't waste my energy on that. I honestly don't understand the point you're attempting to make. What are you hoping to achieve with this barrage of posts about alleged misconduct by healthcare professionals and law enforcement officers? Honest question, what exactly is it that you want from us (nurses)?

Up Vote Up Vote ×
Specializes in Emergency, Telemetry, Transplant.

Part of the issue is that a few individuals participating in this thread have been involved in an experience (either as a pt or an observer) and saw (or were) a male that was exposed and felt such expose was unnecessary. No one is doubting the veracity of these accounts. However, to make that jump that there is a universal practice of not respecting a male's dignity while going overboard to respect a female's dignity? I don't buy it.

I would image there are many females out there who could share stories about times their dignity was not respected. I can offer stories of times that a female's genitals were exposed….not on purpose, but a violation of her dignity none the less.

Up Vote Up Vote ×
Your ignorance is astounding, I really don't know where to begin. Do you think the cops are just hanging out in the trauma room for fun? To get their jollies? If the pt is in custody, the cops stay by their side no matter what. Including invasive procedures, radiology screens, OR, etc. The rest of the time if the pt is alert and the medical teams needs to disrobe the pt or do invasive procedures the cop will step out or turn around till the pt is draped, if they aren't in custody. If the pt isn't conscious, well we've got more life saving things to worry about than if a sheet isn't draped right. In my book life trumps modesty every single time.

So what unit in the hospital do you work where you see cops gawking at pts every day? Because making up crap like you're doing is the problem. Not the rest of us working hard every day to see our pts get the very best care they can.

My sincere apologies for offending you; not my intent. Guilty of ignorance otherwise I wouldn't be asking legitimate straightforward questions. And we are in complete agreement on "life trumps modesty every single time" as long as the patient is either unconscious or unaware!

Up Vote Up Vote ×
Specializes in Emergency, Telemetry, Transplant.
If a female patient was being treated and only medical personnel were in the room the curtains were left open. If the police or a second patient was brought in the curtains were automatically closed. If the patient was male the curtains were left open.

I said in my last post, that no one questioned the veracity of certain accounts…well, I doubt the veracity of this one. If it is true, they you need to contact the NM of the ED--not an internet forum.

Up Vote Up Vote ×
HIPAA applies of course...except in the presence of the law and investigative procedure. No...they don't need a warrant in all/most instances.

Emergency medicine is a specialty all unto itself. Standard of treatment and procedure are followed to the letter of the law...and NO the police don't enter rooms for kicks.

Actually, according to the ABA via SCOTUS (at least for DWI), they need a warrant or consent for blood tests and I can't imagine urinalysis is any different.

http://www.abajournal.com/news/article/dwi_suspects_cant_automatically_be_subjected_to_blood_tests_without_a_warra/

Up Vote Up Vote ×
Specializes in Emergency, Telemetry, Transplant.
Actually, according to the ABA via SCOTUS (at least for DWI), they need a warrant or consent for blood tests and I can't imagine urinalysis is any different.

I can't imagine they would be interested in a UA. Do they want to make sure they don't have any leukocyte esterase in their urine?

I'm not a legal expert, but I imagine they don't need a warrant to be there.

Up Vote Up Vote ×

After reading the 8 pages of comments there is a lot digest. I question some of the accounts as well, understand perspective plays a lot in interpetation, sometimes we embelish to make our point. One thing however is present in many of the posts is avoidance of the main issue, is there a double standard. Early on one poster admitted the double standard, that they would get a female officer for female patients, males got whoever was avaiable, that is just the way it is. That is more to the core of the issue here. Kudos for putting it out there. Many defended or justified providers, some police, a few indicated they were considerate of both genders. But few addressed the issue, why would "it is just the way it is" be acceptable? If the police officer is a professional and is justified being present, why would that not apply to male officers and female patients. It is understood the gender dispairity in providers creates issues for some wanting same gender. But in that post, it was not a situation of could not, it was an intentional effort for females,and lack of concern or perhaps effort for males, and no one had a problem with thats just the way it is. Does that not indicate a double standard that someone would so plainly say yes we do this...and no one reacted negatively? Should not a double standard be wrong regardless of who it applied for or against? That is the issue on this post.

Up Vote Up Vote ×
Specializes in Emergency Room, Trauma ICU.
After reading the 8 pages of comments there is a lot digest. I question some of the accounts as well, understand perspective plays a lot in interpetation, sometimes we embelish to make our point. One thing however is present in many of the posts is avoidance of the main issue, is there a double standard. Early on one poster admitted the double standard, that they would get a female officer for female patients, males got whoever was avaiable, that is just the way it is. That is more to the core of the issue here. Kudos for putting it out there. Many defended or justified providers, some police, a few indicated they were considerate of both genders. But few addressed the issue, why would "it is just the way it is" be acceptable? If the police officer is a professional and is justified being present, why would that not apply to male officers and female patients. It is understood the gender dispairity in providers creates issues for some wanting same gender. But in that post, it was not a situation of could not, it was an intentional effort for females,and lack of concern or perhaps effort for males, and no one had a problem with thats just the way it is. Does that not indicate a double standard that someone would so plainly say yes we do this...and no one reacted negatively? Should not a double standard be wrong regardless of who it applied for or against? That is the issue on this post.

There is no double standard. No one, other than the op, has said that its okay to have a pt undressed and vulnerable, no matter what their gender. What has been said over and over is that when you are actively saving someone's life, they can end up naked and it's not our priority to cover them as we are trying to save their life. So whether they are awake or not, alive beats modesty every single solitary time. Every nurse on here has stated time and again that they do their best every day to preserve our pts dignity as much as we can.

Of course there are bad apples in every profession, but to paint the majority of nurses as uncaring about male dignity, that's blatantly untrue.

Up Vote Up Vote ×
+ Join the Discussion