Lpn & asn are are being phased out.

srercg · May 23, 2016

wow - I just saw all the comments about "rn", and "good hospitals only take bsn's" and all that . Why do nurses with BSN's still believe that they are superior? It's nice to have a BSN, sure. If you did it all at once up front - great for you. BUT as many have TRIED to call attention to - and it seems to keep being ignored - most accredited ASN programs have VERY LITTLE DIFFERENCE IN CURRICULUM vs the BSN programs. THE ONLY difference usually is what someone else said here - about a year - maybe less actually - of ELECTIVE/non clinical courses - such as "nursing today", and "health trends in America" and "leadership and staffing in the 21st century" -those types of courses. EVERYTHING ELSE - med-surg, psych 1, psych 2, abnormal psych, psych nursing, nutrition, labor and delivery, pediatrics, microbiology, anatomy, physiology, advanced physiology, pharmacology 1, pharmacology 2, geriatrics, 3 levels of math, fundamentals, sociology, ethics, cultural awareness, burn rotations, cardiac rotations, labor and delivery clinical, psych unit rotations, surgery rotations, etc etc etc - ASNs' have to do ALL of that - and we had SIM labs, and extensive paper writing. . . .

The ONLY stuff BSNs' really have are the foo foo courses I mentioned above - the only reason why the RN to BSN takes as long as it does is because in effort to make more money off each student the universities come up with some cockamamie excuse to force us to take un-necessary courses along with any genuinely needed nursing courses.

AND - here in the Midwest MOST hospitals WILL hire ASN's with an agreement to complete their BSN within 5 years.

The ONLY reason why they are doing that is because of this magnet status thing - and nurses I talked to who worked in hospitals with magnet status described it as only being "more paperwork" for nurses. "Magnet status" is nothing more than a marketing tool for hospitals to use in their advertising/brochures, etc. Also helps them seek other status changes -but is relatively meaningless on the bottom line.

Farawyn · May 23, 2016

wow - I just saw all the comments about "rn", and "good hospitals only take bsn's" and all that . Why do nurses with BSN's still believe that they are superior? It's nice to have a BSN, sure. If you did it all at once up front - great for you. BUT as many have TRIED to call attention to - and it seems to keep being ignored - most accredited ASN programs have VERY LITTLE DIFFERENCE IN CURRICULUM vs the BSN programs. THE ONLY difference usually is what someone else said here - about a year - maybe less actually - of ELECTIVE/non clinical courses - such as "nursing today", and "health trends in America" and "leadership and staffing in the 21st century" -those types of courses. EVERYTHING ELSE - med-surg, psych 1, psych 2, abnormal psych, psych nursing, nutrition, labor and delivery, pediatrics, microbiology, anatomy, physiology, advanced physiology, pharmacology 1, pharmacology 2, geriatrics, 3 levels of math, fundamentals, sociology, ethics, cultural awareness, burn rotations, cardiac rotations, labor and delivery clinical, psych unit rotations, surgery rotations, etc etc etc - ASNs' have to do ALL of that - and we had SIM labs, and extensive paper writing. . . .
The ONLY stuff BSNs' really have are the foo foo courses I mentioned above - the only reason why the RN to BSN takes as long as it does is because in effort to make more money off each student the universities come up with some cockamamie excuse to force us to take un-necessary courses along with any genuinely needed nursing courses.
AND - here in the Midwest MOST hospitals WILL hire ASN's with an agreement to complete their BSN within 5 years.
The ONLY reason why they are doing that is because of this magnet status thing - and nurses I talked to who worked in hospitals with magnet status described it as only being "more paperwork" for nurses. "Magnet status" is nothing more than a marketing tool for hospitals to use in their advertising/brochures, etc. Also helps them seek other status changes -but is relatively meaningless on the bottom line.

It may be marketing and meaningless, but if they want BSN, then you (and I) are out of luck.

That's a risk I am willing to take.

Also, I have seen very little BSNs saying "I'm bettern you" in this thread. In fact, it's been pretty civil, comparatively.

Horseshoe, BSN, RN · May 23, 2016

wow - I just saw all the comments about "rn", and "good hospitals only take bsn's" and all that . Why do nurses with BSN's still believe that they are superior?

How is pointing out that many hospitals are either requiring a BSN (or preferring one) the same thing as saying "BSNs are superior?" One is a statement of fact, the other is an opinion.

In certain markets, not having a BSN is becoming a barrier to getting a job in hospitals or getting a job in the more desired units. Saying that this is the case is not an indication of a delusion of grandeur. In other markets, there is no discernible advantage to having a BSN in terms of job opportunities or salary.

Each person needs to examine the realities of their local job market and make the best decision going forward with that in mind. There is no universal experience; it is completely dependent on the locale.

PMFB-RN, RN · May 24, 2016

I'm in the upper Midwest and hospitals here don't hire ASNs or at least you'd better be in a BSN program and on track. We are also Union. Schools here have transitioned out of ASN and many are going entry level MSN. The plan to get the hospital to "pay" fell out here long ago. LPN's are in clinic and LTC.
I agree it's regional. To the nurse who wanted to move here, better luck in FL with a two year.
Lest you think I'm biased, I'm a former two year who has a dual Master's. I had to.

I work in both Minnesota and Wisconsin and all the hospitals I work in (one full time, 3 casual) hire ADNs for staff nursing positions. Two of the 4 have "BSN preferred" on their job listings, but it doesn't seem to mean "BSN required".

PMFB-RN, RN · May 24, 2016

I think the entry requirement for a candidate to sit for the NCLEX RN should be a BSN. This is no knock against the ADN or whether they're competent or not. I just think as a profession an ADN shouldn't be sufficent. Where i come from a BSN is mandatory to sit for the boards,.

How long does it take a well qualified, hard working high school graduate to earn the BSN?

Ackeem, BSN, MSN, RN, APRN · May 24, 2016

you have just cleared a whole area of drama that my hospital is going through.
Management hired a group of Jamaican LPNs who were trained under some scheme in Jamaica withe the local PN college here providing the course work to college in Jamaica.
Ths is the poorest performing group of LPNs we've ever worked with. Everything that is expected of them, is just too much. Wound care takes forever, med delivery is slow, patient care sloppy. Patients have complained about the care given by these nurses. They are given extended orientations, standards seem to be lowered for them, leaving those so working alongside them shaking our heads.
somehow, they passed the written exam in Canada but their actual performance has required a lot of remedial education at the unit level

I'm really not surprised and I'll only comment on one thing you mentioned. Practical nursing here is a vocation, they aren't professionally trained. Their credits or training modules cannot be tranfered to any College in Jamaica. They aren't regulated by the National Nursing Council of Jamaica, thus they cannot do clinicals in any local hospitals. The Council regulates only 4 universites that trains RNs (BSN) and 3 community colleges that trains enrolled nursing assistants.

Now in the height of the Canadian nursing shortage a couple years ago, dozens of these vocational schools pop up out of no where just for profit then export. They are not trained in the capacity to perform care to that of U.S or Canadian LPNs.

It makes me feel bad that they make actual Jamaican nurses like myself look bad but such is life.

Ackeem, BSN, MSN, RN, APRN · May 24, 2016

How long does it take a well qualified, hard working high school graduate to earn the BSN?

After you acquire the first set of science prerequisites in high school (O levels), you then have to take and pass A level science classes from a community college. After all prerequisites are acquired you then complete 4 years of training from 1 of the 4 universities.

Upon completion one must pass the clinical board and then the RENR (theory aspect of the board). If a candidate fails either board 3 times he/she must remiate the whole 4 years to sit the exam again. However you can sit the enroll nursing assistant board which most failures opt to do.

downsouthlaff, LPN · May 25, 2016

My opinion on the matter as a whole is best stated as a question. Why ?

There was a reason that LPN training and licensing was put into place. Registered Nurses needed help during a shortage that was well beyond the scope of ancillary assistants. Those who don't learn from history or doomed to repeat it right ? We need ASN RNs and we need LPNs. Can't everyone see what may happen if the entry level into nursing is a BSN?

1. Longer time before nurses may enter the profession.

2. BSN RNs have more options in career fields and choices than do LPNs and AD RNs. AD RNs and Especially LPNs are limited and are more likely to learn to love the areas there limited too.

And when comparing nursing to other professions , why ? Nursing is unique in its own way. So we have different types of Nurses just as we have different types of accountants. You've got Certified Public Accountant, Certified Management Accountant, Chartered Accountant the list goes on and on.

Been there,done that, ASN, RN · May 25, 2016

I hold a lowly ASN. I'm okay with it. I earn 6 figures .. working from home.

smartnurse1982 · May 25, 2016

I guess nothing matter,employers want what they want.

That really is all there is too it.

I really,really,really did not want to blow money on the Bsn.

I had been putting this off for 6 years(just check my history).

I regret not doing it sooner.

All the time lost,not to mention courses were easier and cheaper back in 2010.

Since i do not work in acute care,I do not really need it,but who says it won't be required 5 years from now?

WGU is charging me about $3600 per 6 months( i have to complete 37 credits aside from credits earned from Adn program)

I will admit i had to put buying my dream home on the back burner.

But what if I had bought the home only to find out 3 years from now my employer wants all nurses to go back for the Bsn?

I do not want to be stuck with a mortgage and paying for school.

It also helps to put things in perspective.

I know many people in other fields with Bachelor's degrees making $35,000 a year and $43,000.

smartnurse1982 · May 25, 2016

My opinion on the matter as a whole is best stated as a question. Why ?
There was a reason that LPN training and licensing was put into place. Registered Nurses needed help during a shortage that was well beyond the scope of ancillary assistants. Those who don't learn from history or doomed to repeat it right ? We need ASN RNs and we need LPNs. Can't everyone see what may happen if the entry level into nursing is a BSN?
1. Longer time before nurses may enter the profession.
2. BSN RNs have more options in career fields and choices than do LPNs and AD RNs. AD RNs and Especially LPNs are limited and are more likely to learn to love the areas there limited too.
And when comparing nursing to other professions , why ? Nursing is unique in its own way. So we have different types of Nurses just as we have different types of accountants. You've got Certified Public Accountant, Certified Management Accountant, Chartered Accountant the list goes on and on.

Those would actually be positives of having an all-Bsn workforce.

Who knows....maybe we all would be phased out when they start building robot nurses.

Casha19 · May 25, 2016

In my sorta southern not magnet hospital LPNs are being phased out. BSNs are not paid any more then ADNs and I believe we get the same sign on bonus too. ADNs are not being phased out and no one is forcing anyone to get a BSN.

But some people are slightly touchy about their degree status on this site. No one is saying one is smarter then the other. I happen to think that many of the bsn classes are bs and made me none the smarter for taking. When I was in school for my BSN we were beat across the head that BSNS are way better then ADNs. I really felt like it was biased to the point of promoting hostility towards ADNs. I truly believe that any difference between nurses has to do with personality and not degree held. One of my smartest coworkers was a 2 year rn who had a adn. That's just my opinion.