This is my first time posting a thread. I was just wondering if anyone is or knows of a Jehovah's Witness nurse who works in a critical care unit. Also if you dont mind can you tell me at which hospital? The reason I am asking is that I am also one of Jehovah's Witnesses and I just passed my NCLEX. Yay I really want to work in the critical care unit, specifically the CCU. However, when I explained to the supervisor of the ICU/CCU about the issue with the blood transfusion, she said she couldnt hire me on to the critical care unit. Yes, this hospital is offering critical care positions to new grads. I was really devastated because i wanted to really work in the CCU. So I was wondering if it's the same for other hospitals. I explained to the supervisor that I am willing to care for the patient who is receiving the blood transfusion, but that I would need a second nurse(most likely the nurse who would be verifying the blood with me) to spike the blood and press the start button. I do understand why the critical care environment may not want to have a nurse who cannot initiate the blood transfusion. So I was just wondering if I do not have a chance at all in a critical care unit. For now I am orienting in the med-surg floor and I still have lingering feelings for the critical care unit.
You won't find a consistent answer on what is allowed and what isn't because administering blood isn't actually against JW doctrine, the official JW position is that it is allowed, a refusal to administer blood is a personal choice, not a true religious practice.
No kidding. I admit, I do not know much at all about Jehovah's Witness faith, but it seems so arbitrary. For example, certain JW patients will refuse transfusions but they accept hematopoietic stem cell transplant. What exactly constitutes "blood" when you get down to the cellular or molecular level? It would be nice if someone could clarify this for me.
I admit I do not know much at all about Jehovah's Witness faith, but it seems so arbitrary. [/quote']
I believe as you discover more about different religions, they are all packed with arbitrary practices. Please note people, I'm not saying all are, there is huge variation within every religion. Science is not going to affect JW dogma or it's practitioner's individual beliefs nor should they.
I believe as you discover more about different religions, they are all packed with arbitrary practices. Please note people, I'm not saying all are, there is huge variation within every religion. Science is not going to affect JW dogma or it's practitioner's individual beliefs nor should they.
The difference is that administering blood products isn't against JW dogma, it's an arbitrary personal belief, not an arbitrary religious belief.
Specializes in CCU, SICU, CVSICU, Precepting & Teaching.
Conscious = awake
Conscience = that little voice that asks, "What's that gonna cost me?"
I do hope that if you're giving blood it's a conscious matter. I'd like to think you couldn't do it in your sleep. Or is it like with Ambien, where people eat and drive and do all sorts of stuff in their sleep? Has anyone ever hung blood in their sleep? I've done it when I was really, really tired, but still ... conscious. :dzed:
I haven't hung it in my sleep, but I have hung it in a zombie-like semi-awake state. Although someone else had already checked it for me.
Specializes in CCU, SICU, CVSICU, Precepting & Teaching.
I worked with a nurse who, due to her beliefs as a Catholic, would not administer MTX to pts. with ectopic pregnancies. Did that mean that we should have made her resign? Because she was valued as an employee, the staff worked around this.
If the mgmt. and staff are willing to make accommodations for a nurse who feels it's against her beliefs to administer blood, then there's no issue with him/her working in ICU or other units where the probability of needing to administer blood is high. Some people are willing to look at all a potential employee can bring to the table, not just one thing they can't do.
I'm sorry, but as wonderful a person and as stellar a potential employee the person might be, if they're unwilling to administer blood in our unit, they're dangerous. I'm not talking about the docs writing an order for "two units of blood over two hours each with 20 mg. of IV Lasix between units." I'm talking about patients who are bleeding 6-8 liters an hour and getting transfused as fast as we possibly can. In the latter situation, if the JW nurse was involved, we'd have to somehow change assignments or get her out of the room and find someone who WAS willing to do what needed to be done. And that may be time better spent hanging blood or squeezing the blood bags already hanging.
I worked with a nurse who, due to her beliefs as a Catholic, would not administer MTX to pts. with ectopic pregnancies. Did that mean that we should have made her resign? Because she was valued as an employee, the staff worked around this.
Your coworker's actions indicate she, through inaction, advocates for the murder of women with ectopic pregnancies.
We can shine that fact up, turn it on it's edge, squint, discuss personal beliefs or varying talents, but none of that changes the situation.
ArtClassRN is right-- I am so tired of the "But it is God's WILL".....directly quoted from some verse or two in the middle of some other verse....subject to perception....."The Bible says so" is another ad nauseum debate....Bible says a whole lot that more than one doesn't follow to a "T"
If we are all going to pick and choose who we will take care of (after all, we are not doing this to ourselves) then no one would take care of nearly anyone.
MY religious beliefs state I would take a blood transfusion. Nurses need to keep theirs out of it. I believe a woman (or man) has a choice with what to do with their own body. Nurses do not have that choice over me. Or one would not be my nurse, one would be my health care proxy.
In other words I am the the one going to hell. The nurse is not based on a start button or a pill. Or one would take the direct route to hades over wearing pants, cutting ones hair, wearing makeup and heck even WORKING....as it is also stated in the Good Book that one needs to submit to husband, prepare a lovely home......I could go on....however, point made.
Specializes in Medsurg/ICU, Mental Health, Home Health.
I agree 100%...but I will add...
Sounds, to me at least, that the OP would have no problem with the transfusion except for actually spiking the bag. Therefore, because of a second nurse needing to be involved anyway, I don't see this is a real issue.
I think if one's only objection is physically spiking a bag of blood, that is no big deal. If a nurse can care for a patient without judging him or her for receiving blood, then I don't see any hitch whatsoever.
The dilemma appears when the nurse's beliefs end up discouraging a patient from receiving a transfusion. That's what I think. I am not a JW by any means, but I think that if I were I would try to PREVENT a patient from receiving a transfusion. Therein lies our trouble...
If the OP is certain he or she can care for these patients without judgement, without discouraging livesaving measures, then I think critical care would be just fine.
Now that I am in critical care myself, I still stand by what I've said.
I'm in a medical ICU, so we actually don't give too much blood (surgical is a completely different ball park!) but when we're using the rapid infuser (I've seen it for a massive GIB and for DIC in a code situation) it is a different story indeed - organized chaos, I'd call it. Those were both situations of "hey, you, PRIME THIS!" when free hands are discovered. I still think, though, if my coworker were a JW, and we all knew that, there would be other tasks for him or her to complete that didn't involve spiking or starting blood.
But now I have more questions...can clotting factors be given? What about albumin? Can a JW nurse draw a type & screen? Consent for blood? There are so many other steps in the procedure that show a very slippery slope. I could see it going either way, with the JW nurse completely being distanced from transfusions, or ending up giving them and feeling as if she's condemned herself.
Specializes in Nursing Education, CVICU, Float Pool.
Now that I am in critical care myself I still stand by what I've said. I'm in a medical ICU, so we actually don't give too much blood (surgical is a completely different ball park!) but when we're using the rapid infuser (I've seen it for a massive GIB and for DIC in a code situation) it is a different story indeed - organized chaos, I'd call it. Those were both situations of "hey, you, PRIME THIS!" when free hands are discovered. I still think, though, if my coworker were a JW, and we all knew that, there would be other tasks for him or her to complete that didn't involve spiking or starting blood. But now I have more questions...can clotting factors be given? What about albumin? Can a JW nurse draw a type & screen? Consent for blood? There are so many other steps in the procedure that show a very slippery slope. I could see it going either way, with the JW nurse completely being distanced from transfusions, or ending up giving them and feeling as if she's condemned herself. I couldn't do it, if those were my beliefs.[/quote']
I don't think most JWs would have an issue with drawing a lab. Each JW makes their own decision about what they will take outside of the main division of blood. Also, I learned that the administration is kind of a personal choice for the JW nurse, but most prefer not to if possible. I think some here have a made this thread a little more aggressive and negative think it was initially meant to be. JWs value life, highly. I don't think most would knowingly go into a work setting that they feel they would compromise that precious life. If you have a team that is functional, if you desire not to administer blood, then there's no problem. If you don't have a team like that, it may be best for a JW work elsewhere. We are always encouraged to inform employers of our beliefs during the hiring process. If we do this and are still hired, then it's an issue that will need to be discussed with the manager or hiring committee.
I can't even believe that anyone could contemplate accommodations for a nurse who would refuse life saving treatment for a patient.
As someone mentioned above, if a JW nurse doesn't want blood given to her -- no problem. That's her choice. I've seen patients die because that was their belief. I have no problem with what you do to your own body.
I have a huge problem when you impose your beliefs on others. Huge.
Go work in a setting where you are not in charge of blood products. Get out of the acute care setting if you cannot tolerate the beliefs of others.
Specializes in Nursing Education, CVICU, Float Pool.
I can't even believe that anyone could contemplate accommodations for a nurse who would refuse life saving treatment for a patient. As someone mentioned above if a JW nurse doesn't want blood given to her -- no problem. That's her choice. I've seen patients die because that was their belief. I have no problem with what you do to your own body. I have a huge problem when you impose your beliefs on others. Huge. Go work in a setting where you are not in charge of blood products. Get out of the acute care setting if you cannot tolerate the beliefs of others. I can't even believe this is a thread! Sent from my iPhone using allnurses.com[/quote'] As state before, most JW nurses are not going to knowingly go into job that they feel that pt. lives will be compromised. As for the whole accommodation of someone "who would refuse......" Most JWs will monitor pt. for hemolytic reactions and cafe for the pt. post-blood spikes, some even administer blood, bc their conscious allows that, bc they see it as a conscious decision between the doctor and the patient. However, there is thankfully someone took the time to take an outside view of such situations and came to the conclusion that no one should lose out on a job they are qualified for, SINGULARLY bc of their religious beliefs, race, etc.... Thus was born the equal employment opportunity commission, which enforces policies on non-discriminatory employment practices and reasonable accommodation.
Now if an employer feels that they can reasonably accommodate such a request, then that's a decision that's left up to the hiring committee's discretion.
I can't speak for every individual JW that's ever lived, but JWs, in general, would never judge a person or patient for deciding to take blood. Everyone has the right to an informed decision, that is solely that individuals decision. JWs respect that.
As state before, most JW nurses are not going to knowingly go into job that they feel that pt. lives will be compromised. As for the whole accommodation of someone "who would refuse......" Most JWs will monitor pt. for hemolytic reactions and cafe for the pt. post-blood spikes, some even administer blood, bc their conscious allows that, bc they see it as a conscious decision between the doctor and the patient. However, there is thankfully someone took the time to take an outside view of such situations and came to the conclusion that no one should lose out on a job they are qualified for, SINGULARLY bc of their religious beliefs, race, etc.... Thus was born the equal employment opportunity commission, which enforces policies on non-discriminatory employment practices and reasonable accommodation.
Now if an employer feels that they can reasonably accommodate such a request, then that's a decision that's left up to the hiring committee's discretion.
I can't speak for every individual JW that's ever lived, but JWs, in general, would never judge a person or patient for deciding to take blood. Everyone has the right to an informed decision, that is solely that individuals decision. JWs respect that.
This isn't a situation where religious freedom and non-discrimination applies, administering blood is not only not forbidden by the JW church, the JW church has clarified specifically that it's followers are allowed at least under JW doctrine to administer blood.
A JW refusing to administer blood has no religious basis for this, instead this is a situation where a Nurse is substituting their conscious for the patient's. If it were a matter of religious objection, then one could argue the Nurse should just avoid situations where they have to hang blood, but if it's a matter of being unable to put the patient's conscious above yours, that's not something that can be avoided in Nursing, it is a part of all Nursing and it's working as a Nursing in general that needs to be avoided.
I really want to work in the critical care unit, specifically the CCU. However, when I explained to the supervisor of the ICU/CCU about the issue with the blood transfusion, she said she couldnt hire me on to the critical care unit. Yes, this hospital is offering critical care positions to new grads. I was really devastated because i wanted to really work in the CCU. 
So I was wondering if it's the same for other hospitals. I explained to the supervisor that I am willing to care for the patient who is receiving the blood transfusion, but that I would need a second nurse(most likely the nurse who would be verifying the blood with me) to spike the blood and press the start button. I do understand why the critical care environment may not want to have a nurse who cannot initiate the blood transfusion. So I was just wondering if I do not have a chance at all in a critical care unit. For now I am orienting in the med-surg floor and I still have lingering feelings for the critical care unit. 
tokebi
1 Article; 404 Posts
No kidding. I admit, I do not know much at all about Jehovah's Witness faith, but it seems so arbitrary. For example, certain JW patients will refuse transfusions but they accept hematopoietic stem cell transplant. What exactly constitutes "blood" when you get down to the cellular or molecular level? It would be nice if someone could clarify this for me.