How can I gracefully and tactfully say No?

ixchel · May 20, 2012

Well if you read the whole statement you would have noted he did fail students and write them up for academic dishonesty but the administration wont support hin and even admonishes him for. Adult students are very vocal and would complain bitterly if punished. Blame the system and students not the instructors.

I DID read all of it and something does not add up. I don't see a school reprimanding a teacher for reporting too many cheaters, and If that actually is the case, that school would stand to lose whatever accreditations they may have for passing students knowing they are cheating. They're in the business of handing diplomas to people who earn them. Perhaps I am naive, but I just can't believe a school would tolerate this.

HolyPeas · May 20, 2012

Well I can see it from both ways but for a minute consider this. Lets say you are the dean of a college, everything going along like usual, the occasional cheater here and there and then all of a sudden you have an instructor that is throwing people out left and right. It WOULD seem suspicious, and if administration is lazy, and its a he said she said type of a deal, I can see how they would tell the teacher he needs to bring it down a notch.

Ruthfarmer · May 20, 2012

I DID read all of it and something does not add up. I don't see a school reprimanding a teacher for reporting too many cheaters, and If that actually is the case, that school would stand to lose whatever accreditations they may have for passing students knowing they are cheating. They're in the business of handing diplomas to people who earn them. Perhaps I am naive, but I just can't believe a school would tolerate this.

Naive and idealistic. There are an awful lot of unethical, illegal, an unconscionable things that occur in education, health care, and other areas of endeavor. This is why some areas of endeavor should NOT be operated on a for profit basis. When abuses and wrongdoing occur in some fields, some people can be egregiously hurt.

ixchel · May 20, 2012

Well I can see it from both ways but for a minute consider this. Lets say you are the dean of a college, everything going along like usual, the occasional cheater here and there and then all of a sudden you have an instructor that is throwing people out left and right. It WOULD seem suspicious, and if administration is lazy, and its a he said she said type of a deal, I can see how they would tell the teacher he needs to bring it down a notch.

I get that, but the instructor isn't just toning it down, he's outright allowing it. That kills the integrity of the school and the professor completely. If this behavior ends up going on rateyourprofessor, or is somehow made public, I think the dean will have a whole new problem on his/her hands completely. This professor is responding to the situation in a very unprofessional and childish way that does nothing but undermine the legitimate efforts of those students who are in school to actually learn and get a diploma that they can be proud of.

Consider this..... You get your degree from this school and you start looking for a job. Suddenly the behavior of the professor goes public and the university gets a bad rap in the media. Extreme possibility? Perhaps, but not beyond the possible. Anyway, you are on a job hunt with your new degree from Cheater University, and now no one will hire you because you are competing with people from more respected institutions.

This situation is NOT okay.

ixchel · May 20, 2012

Naive and idealistic. There are an awful lot of unethical, illegal, an unconscionable things that occur in education, health care, and other areas of endeavor. This is why some areas of endeavor should NOT be operated on a for profit basis. When abuses and wrongdoing occur in some fields, some people can be egregiously hurt.

I've been called worse :) lol I do tend to ride the idealist train in many scenarios. But, I do agree about profit being a huge problem in certain industries.

HolyPeas · May 20, 2012

I get that, but the instructor isn't just toning it down, he's outright allowing it. That kills the integrity of the school and the professor completely. If this behavior ends up going on rateyourprofessor, or is somehow made public, I think the dean will have a whole new problem on his/her hands completely. This professor is responding to the situation in a very unprofessional and childish way that does nothing but undermine the legitimate efforts of those students who are in school to actually learn and get a diploma that they can be proud of.
Consider this..... You get your degree from this school and you start looking for a job. Suddenly the behavior of the professor goes public and the university gets a bad rap in the media. Extreme possibility? Perhaps, but not beyond the possible. Anyway, you are on a job hunt with your new degree from Cheater University, and now no one will hire you because you are competing with people from more respected institutions.
This situation is NOT okay.

Nope, I never said it was OK, but this iswere you have something called personal responsibilty to look up who you are taking classes with and what type of school you are going too. There is something called ratemyprofessor.com that I think everyone should utilize. Students are not helpless.

ixchel · May 20, 2012

Nope, I never said it was OK, but this iswere you have something called personal responsibilty to look up who you are taking classes with and what type of school you are going too. There is something called ratemyprofessor.com that I think everyone should utilize. Students are not helpless.

I totally agree!

tothepointeLVN, LVN · May 20, 2012

Well since I was the one to bring this up I need to make clear a few issues. He teaches at a fairly large community college 20,000 + with about 50% of the student population turning over from semester to semester. Graduation / pass rates are about 15% normal for this state but the administrations priority is increasing pass and transfer rates nit academic honesty. They are more than aware that there is widespread academic.dishonesty but what are they to do? They arent about To fail them all.This unfortunately the result of a result based society.I dont agree with cheating but I dont want good professors losing jobs and tenture by some vocal two faced students. The story was posted To illustrate the point that cheaters aren't all sweet young.things

Ruthfarmer · May 20, 2012

I've been called worse :) lol I do tend to ride the idealist train in many scenarios. But, I do agree about profit being a huge problem in certain industries.

Please understand that it was not my intention to call you anything. I'm quite idealistic and optimistic myself. It's easy to find yourself disappointed and to find yourself with the short and dirty end of the stick when others aren't playing by the same "rules."

Merlyn · May 20, 2012

I DID read all of it and something does not add up. I don't see a school reprimanding a teacher for reporting too many cheaters, and If that actually is the case, that school would stand to lose whatever accreditations they may have for passing students knowing they are cheating. They're in the business of handing diplomas to people who earn them. Perhaps I am naive, but I just can't believe a school would tolerate this.

In today's world if the cheaters were a different race than the teacher, The teacher could catch these people red handed, he could have video and audio of them cheating he could have Jesus and the Twelve Apostles and the whole Roman Army see them and swear that they where cheating. But the students were minority, or they knew a local politician, or a member of the American Civil rights group or anyone of the idiot pressure groups. The teacher is up you know what creek without a paddle. That is why today Johnny can't read.As an example, my niece mention to her Science teacher the fact that she is related to Madame Curie. The teacher look at her and asked who Madame Curie was. My ten year old niece had to explain that she was the woman that did research in radioactivity. I mean if Tally said that she was related to Maria Sklodowska I could see but Madame Curie! Even I as dumb as I am knows who Madame Curie was! So what was this thread about again?

ixchel · May 20, 2012

Well since I was the one to bring this up I need to make clear a few issues. He teaches at a fairly large community college 20,000 + with about 50% of the student population turning over from semester to semester. Graduation / pass rates are about 15% normal for this state but the administrations priority is increasing pass and transfer rates nit academic honesty. They are more than aware that there is widespread academic.dishonesty but what are they to do? They arent about To fail them all.This unfortunately the result of a result based society.I dont agree with cheating but I dont want good professors losing jobs and tenture by some vocal two faced students. The story was posted To illustrate the point that cheaters aren't all sweet young.things

Please know that I do respect your opinion. We'll have to agree to disagree on this one :) I know in some situations I get my moral compass set to prude. lol

ixchel · May 20, 2012

Please understand that it was not my intention to call you anything. I'm quite idealistic and optimistic myself. It's easy to find yourself disappointed and to find yourself with the short and dirty end of the stick when others aren't playing by the same "rules."

I promise no offense was taken, and I know you weren't name calling! In reality I am generally an optimistic realist, but in many hypothetical situation debates (as this one is since for me, I'm in no way apart of the situation) I get stuck on idealist mode. it does lead me to be disappointed at times, but I'm okay with that.