HIPAA and the Undocumented

Published

A medical office keeps a patient waiting two hours in order to deport her.

Advocates protest Latina immigrant's arrest at Texas doctor's office - LA Times

That refers to fraudulent SSN use for the purpose of employment, which this person is not using it for, and this incident happened in Texas which is an e-verify state.

That's not the point.

I was referring to your statement:

quote "I wouldn't care since that by itself cannot be used for anything. Just being able to randomly list 9 digits doesn't really have anything to do with identity theft." quote

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Specializes in Med-Surg, OB, ICU, Public Health Nursing.

Someone used my mother's social security number. They had contributed to her social security earnings and it was cleared up quite quickly.

I have no agenda. I have been a public health nurse for years and we don't all think alike. (I was horrified by the poster who said the mother of a child with strep was out of luck and should have thought that). I didn't respond or react because that is her opinion.

I do find it surprising the amount of anger of some of the posters. I lost a wallet and someone used my credit cards. Annoying yes, the end of the world, no.

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That refers to fraudulent SSN use for the purpose of employment, which this person is not using it for, ...

How do you know that? Just because neither article posted said, "Oh, by the way, don't worry, she isn't using the SSN for purposes of employment"? Do you have some other source?

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I don't know whose name was used but here is a very interesting article. Is it a crime to get a job using someone else's SSN? | Identity Theft Secrets

"Lora and Jamey Costner of Newport, Tennessee, have joined the ranks of identity theft victims after two illegal immigrants, Douglas Valdez and Elizabeth Velasco Bautista, allegedly used the Costner's Social Security numbers to obtain employment at the Koch Foods plant in nearby Morristown."

"Bautista also filed for workers compensation benefits after she fell off the food processing plant's production line. Mrs. Costner, on the other hand, had difficulty obtaining workers compensation benefits herself, as state labor officials said she had reported back to work at Koch Foods the previous month. Mrs. Costner has never worked at Koch Foods."

"Now here's the kicker: Koch Foods apparently did not deduct taxes from Bautista's and Valdez's wages of approximately $30,000 during 2005, so the IRS have levied the bill – not against the perpetrators of the identity theft (Bautista and Valdez), but rather against the victims – the Costners. Mrs. Costner reported that she and her husband are living in fear that the IRS will begin garnishing their wages. In a letter to her U.S. Senator, she wrote, The overall burden of it all is crushing us, please help. We have done all we know to do.”" - See more at: Nothing found for Is It A Crime To Get A Job Using Someone Elses Ssn#sthash Gqoyy7Cq Dpuf

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I'm not sure it's really a clinics primary responsibility to investigate and report fake ID's. They certainly have the right to ensure they will get paid, although this patient has been going to this group for some time and it doesn't sound like there's been any payment issues.

I've never told a patient it's "OK to break the law", but I also don't report them for things I discover while they are in the process of obtaining care if it poses no imminent threat to others as a matter of healthcare ethics. If you get a new admit in the hospital and they smell of marijuana, do you call the cops on them?

That was a poor example. MJ is legal where I have been, so no. Also, I am a worker bee, so I wouldn't call the cops, I would nudge it up the ladder. Smelling like drugs and having possession of them are two different things, anyway.

Now, I have called security who subsequently called the cops when a patient was trying to use heroin on the premises.

If you want to condone illegal behavior, that's your right. It's my right to think less of you for it.

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Specializes in CCU, SICU, CVSICU, Precepting & Teaching.
There are two other advocates quoted in the article. Before anyone goes off on "advocates" that was my job. To adovocate that the public receive health care.

I personally believe, after 40 years as an RN, I am due the respect of not being told the, "sky is blue and the sea is wet." I also believe posters don't need to yell "YOU" at me. I did not post to start a cat fight.

I posted this because I am trying to understand all points of view. I may not agree with them, but at least gain some understanding. I thought the poster who provided info. on her father's green card was useful.

We don't know you or anything about your forty years as an RN; all we know is what you're posting here. And what you're posting here has indeed gotten you all the respect you deserve from most of the posters. It does look like you posted either to gain a whole lot of agreement -- which you seem to be surprised that you didn't get -- or to start a cat fight. I don't see any attempts on your part to "gain understanding of all points of view."

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Specializes in CCU, SICU, CVSICU, Precepting & Teaching.
"The driver's license featured Borrego's picture and address, but the number belonged to a man, the card was the wrong color, and the hologram was missing, according to Jeff McShan, a spokesman for Harris County district attorney's office."

If I were this man, I don't think I would be too concerned.

Evidently you haven't been the victim of identity theft. If you had been, you would be concerned.

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Specializes in Critical care.
How do you know that? Just because neither article posted said, "Oh, by the way, don't worry, she isn't using the SSN for purposes of employment"? Do you have some other source?

I have to admit I would be surprised if her husband ... who had private health insurance was not illegal as well. Seems strange, that if he was legal, he wouldn't have his wife on a legal green card as a dependent, which is what I did with my wife and kids when I moved here. I am sure more will come out of the investigation.

Cheers

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I have to admit I would be surprised if her husband ... who had private health insurance was not illegal as well. Seems strange, that if he was legal, he wouldn't have his wife on a legal green card as a dependent, which is what I did with my wife and kids when I moved here. I am sure more will come out of the investigation.

Cheers

Yeah, I assume the husband is illegal, also. One of the articles said that they had originally come as tourists (in 2003) and overstayed their visas.

Although it's been made clear in the articles linked that, despite the OP's concerns, she was detained for illegal fraud, not her immigration status, I do hope that they will all get deported as a result of this.

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There's a big difference between someone using a credit card which you are not responsible for anyway and using someone's SSN.

"Lora and Jamey Costner of Newport, Tennessee, have joined the ranks of identity theft victims after two illegal immigrants, Douglas Valdez and Elizabeth Velasco Bautista, allegedly used the Costner's Social Security numbers to obtain employment at the Koch Foods plant in nearby Morristown."

"Bautista also filed for workers compensation benefits after she fell off the food processing plant's production line. Mrs. Costner, on the other hand, had difficulty obtaining workers compensation benefits herself, as state labor officials said she had reported back to work at Koch Foods the previous month. Mrs. Costner has never worked at Koch Foods."

"Now here's the kicker: Koch Foods apparently did not deduct taxes from Bautista's and Valdez's wages of approximately $30,000 during 2005, so the IRS have levied the bill – not against the perpetrators of the identity theft (Bautista and Valdez), but rather against the victims – the Costners. Mrs. Costner reported that she and her husband are living in fear that the IRS will begin garnishing their wages. In a letter to her U.S. Senator, she wrote, The overall burden of it all is crushing us, please help. We have done all we know to do.”" - See more at: Nothing found for Is It A Crime To Get A Job Using Someone Elses Ssn#sthash Gqoyy7Cq Dpuf

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Specializes in critical care, ER,ICU, CVSURG, CCU.
Well, this is a chance you take if you choose to live in this country illegally -- that the law is eventually going to catch up with you. Again, the article makes quite clear that what she was detained and reported for was not her immigration status (although I would certainly have no problem with that), but the fraudulent use of government documents (driver's license and SS card). You might not be so outraged if it were your license and SS number that someone else was using, and if it were your identity that had been stolen.

in rural SETexas, small community hosp. ER, very apparent non citizen, (legal or illegal?).....comes in for care, gets care, claiming no ID,etc..... Care given, referral to sources to help with "the bill"......saddest thing, when a similar patient was really sick, and needed transfer to higher acuity care hospital....the patient, sometimes was in fear their "status". being identified, than potential health outcomes..... Now we just did not have the false document situation very much.....

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Specializes in SICU, trauma, neuro.
Evidently you haven't been the victim of identity theft. If you had been, you would be concerned

Well said.

Years ago, my husband's bag was stolen from his locker at the gym. The guy smashed the hinges on the locker and removed the door while he was working out. In his wallet we're two credit cards, a bank card, his green card (you know, that thing the INS gives when one has taken the legal steps, and given legal permission to claim legal US residency)...his drivers license and keys....

We didn't know who the thief was. But he had our keys and our home address from the drivers license. We had to get our locks changed. He had to deal with the credit card companies, bank, DMV, and headache of headaches, the INS.

I don't know how it works legally, but morally if someone caught this lowlife using my husband's documents and said nothing to the authorities, I would consider them morally an accessory.

I'm curious OP, do you consider a clinic a sanctuary from all legal accountability? Say a female bank robber is on the run with her child, her face has been on the news...does her perceived "right" to a non-emergent clinic visit trump the rights of those who she stole from, and those who she traumatized in the robbery?

Or is it only those who break immigration law who get special consideration? Honest question.

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