Hernia Repair Patient Dignity

Updated:   Published

Since my husband just had hernia surgery, I have been looking into patient dignity.   He went to a male Dr for the surgery.  When he went into the ACC it was all females.   Since we are in Covid restrictions still, I couldn’t go in with him.  He was very uncomfortable with all the females and thought the attitude of I’ve seen thousands of memberes was totally Unprofessional. He felt that while they did their “jobs” they didn’t care how uncomfortable they made him.  Believe it or not males do not want to expose themselves to you.  Just because some of you don’t care who sees what, others do.  You are so correct about the double standards that females wouldn’t put up with that but males have to.  Ladies,  think about how off putting you are to your male pts when you make those comments.  Males also tend to hide their emotions. But, you bet your butt if I was allowed in and saw how uncomfortable he was I would have said something.  He was already nervous and alone and just wanted to get it over. 

4 hours ago, JKL33 said:

What is the other reason that people look at genitals as a "spectator sport" ?

Let me know. I haven't heard of this. I know people go to golf matches and things like that, but I didn't know that there was a non-sexual spectator sport of checking out genitals.

To be a spectator means to watch an event.  I think this is what the poster you were replying to was referring to.

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23 minutes ago, Susie2310 said:

To be a spectator means to watch an event.  I think this is what the poster you were replying to was referring to.

I understand. I just can't figure out what event those nurses were supposedly watching.

To suggest that they had to "check" him and that he had to inform them that viewing his genital area was not a spectator sport is to suggest that those nurses were there in some other capacity than a professional nursing function; it specifically suggests that they were there for their own entertainment, which, in the case of genitalia, would be sexual entertainment. As I told the poster, I can't think of any non-sexual reasons that people view genitalia as a spectator sport. Art appreciation, maybe. But that isn't what she meant. She meant what she said, and it was a wholly inappropriate suggestion.

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5 hours ago, Catfostermom said:

Never once did I say that he thought it was sexual.  His complaint was that he was exposed to different nurses and he felt the attitude towards him was we’ve seen many, you don’t have anything special.  He was getting more and more uncomfortable with so many different nurses.  ESP when he was told he’d have 1 nurse assigned to him. If it was only the one nurse chances are he wouldn’t have had a problem.   This is about male modesty and him being uncomfortable about the circumstances.  Things could have been dealt with differently.  If cupping himself wasn’t a clue then him saying this isn’t a spectator sport wasn’t a clue I don’t know what is.  My husband hides his emotions, just like many many other guys.  But, you can certainly tell if he is OK with what is going on or not, whether you’ve know him for 21 yrs or 10 min. He can’t hide facial expression even under a mask or the tenseness of his body. If he was offered the choice of partial covering and he didn’t accept it then that’s on him. Not being offered anything that’s on the nurses.  

 

I wrote an anonymous email to the nurse manager asking exactly what the exposure protocols were during hernia surgery.  Of course the reply was the exact opposite of what my husband encountered.  All promising they treat the patients with the utmost dignity and ensure their modesty concerns are met.  Now to schedule the in person meeting. 

You're upset they saw his privates, you're upset you weren't allowed in the room, you're upset he had more than one nurse, you're upset at people on this forum who don't even have anything to do with any of this, you're just upset. Seems like a control issue.

Maybe another patient of the nurse assigned to your husband had an emergency, maybe other staff were checking in on your husband to make sure he was alright despite the chaos, if they're under Covid guidelines you know why you couldn't be there, and again, no one on this forum was there.

You don't know anything about nursing yet here you are with all the smoke for strangers on a forum instead of the people who you feel did something wrong to your husband, yet you also know nothing about why there were different nurses checking on him. Had no one checked on him you'd be upset about that too. Seems there's no winning with you. Just say you wanted to come on here and gripe at nurses and call it a day.

Also, don't be a coward with an anonymous email to the manager. Go see them in person and give them all the smoke you're trying to give nurses on this forum who have nothing to do with anything. I mean if you're going to be hateful, go all in to the people who need to hear it and can do something about it. If your attitude towards them is anything like it is on here, the blame and point fingers while simultaneously not understanding the basics of nursing, then you've already closed the door to open communication. Appears you already have a scenario in your head and there's no changing that, facts be damned.

I get he was uncomfortable and I understand why. What I don't understand is why, as a grown adult man, didn't he ask where his primary nurse was when all those people came in and out? Is he not capable of speaking up for himself? He needs to start because your attitude is making things far worse than what they need to be. People can't even have a basic conversation with you. Sheesh!

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14 minutes ago, NurseBlaq said:

You're upset they saw his privates, you're upset you weren't allowed in the room, you're upset he had more than one nurse, you're upset at people on this forum who don't even have anything to do with any of this, you're just upset. Seems like a control issue.

Maybe another patient of the nurse assigned to your husband had an emergency, maybe other staff were checking in on your husband to make sure he was alright despite the chaos, if they're under Covid guidelines you know why you couldn't be there, and again, no one on this forum was there.

You don't know anything about nursing yet here you are with all the smoke for strangers on a forum instead of the people who you feel did something wrong to your husband, yet you also know nothing about why there were different nurses checking on him. Had no one checked on him you'd be upset about that too. Seems there's no winning with you. Just say you wanted to come on here and gripe at nurses and call it a day.

Also, don't be a coward with an anonymous email to the manager. Go see them in person and give them all the smoke you're trying to give nurses on this forum who have nothing to do with anything. I mean if you're going to be hateful, go all in to the people who need to hear it and can do something about it. If your attitude towards them is anything like it is on here, the blame and point fingers while simultaneously not understanding the basics of nursing, then you've already closed the door to open communication. Appears you already have a scenario in your head and there's no changing that, facts be damned.

I get he was uncomfortable and I understand why. What I don't understand is why, as a grown adult man, didn't he ask where his primary nurse was when all those people came in and out? Is he not capable of speaking up for himself? He needs to start because your attitude is making things far worse than what they need to be. People can't even have a basic conversation with you. Sheesh!

Did you actually read what I said the email was about? I wanted to see how it was supposed to be. What the standard procedures where.  If they said covers are not supplied and multiple nurses will check on pts post op then it is what it is.  Her reply was they get assigned one nurse to be with the pts. through the whole surgical procedure.  They will protect the pts modesty and there will be limited exposure.  None of that is what happened.  Control issue?  Wanting to advocate for my husband is a control issue? Trying to make sure their future male  pts get some dignity. Since when do men speak up about how they are feeling without pulling it out of them?  What about just going forward with a side of caution that this isn’t many people’s cup of tea?  I didn’t make this thread.  Doing a search for male modesty this popped up. Obviously, it’s been s a problem for awhile, if this thread was made a year ago.  I don’t know if it’s egos or what but, there seems to be people with blinders on thinking this never happens to male pts and ALL nurses are innocent. 

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19 minutes ago, Catfostermom said:

Did you actually read what I said the email was about? I wanted to see how it was supposed to be. What the standard procedures where.  If they said covers are not supplied and multiple nurses will check on pts post op then it is what it is.  Her reply was they get assigned one nurse to be with the pts. through the whole surgical procedure.  They will protect the pts modesty and there will be limited exposure.  None of that is what happened.  Control issue?  Wanting to advocate for my husband is a control issue? Trying to make sure their future male  pts get some dignity. Since when do men speak up about how they are feeling without pulling it out of them?  What about just going forward with a side of caution that this isn’t many people’s cup of tea?  I didn’t make this thread.  Doing a search for male modesty this popped up. Obviously, it’s been s a problem for awhile, if this thread was made a year ago.  I don’t know if it’s egos or what but, there seems to be people with blinders on thinking this never happens to male pts and ALL nurses are innocent. 

I read all of your posts and at this point I don't care what you say. You've dismissed and belittled everything you've been told. You don't want information or understanding, you just want to be right. You don't care about facts. I said what I said and meant all of it. Anything you say after this is irrelevant.

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38 minutes ago, Catfostermom said:

I don’t know if it’s egos or what but, there seems to be people with blinders on thinking this never happens to male pts and ALL nurses are innocent. 

Not one person here has said this. Not. A. Single. One. You are carping at the wrong people. We were not the ones who upset your husband! Go talk to them! 

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2 hours ago, JKL33 said:

I understand. I just can't figure out what event those nurses were supposedly watching.

To suggest that they had to "check" him and that he had to inform them that viewing his genital area was not a spectator sport is to suggest that those nurses were there in some other capacity than a professional nursing function; it specifically suggests that they were there for their own entertainment, which, in the case of genitalia, would be sexual entertainment. As I told the poster, I can't think of any non-sexual reasons that people view genitalia as a spectator sport. Art appreciation, maybe. But that isn't what she meant. She meant what she said, and it was a wholly inappropriate suggestion.

If I understood correctly, the nurses didn't explain to the patient the reason why they needed to check the patient's genital area, and they didn't ask the patient for their permission to do this.  By not asking permission before doing this, and by not explaining the reason for needing to do this check, a patient experiencing this activity being done to them in an impersonal manner without their permission (particularly as more than one nurse came in at different times to do this check) could have perceived the nurses who performed this activity as spectators - that is, people (albeit nurses) who are watching something happen (the event being the post-op condition of the patient's genital area).

In my view, communication is key here; introducing oneself if you haven't provided care to the patient before, explaining what you need to do and why, and asking the patient if you can go ahead with the check before doing it.

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2 hours ago, Catfostermom said:

Her reply was they get assigned one nurse to be with the pts. through the whole surgical procedure.

Just so you understand, she was likely referring to the period of time in which he was in the operating room. That is what is meant by "through the whole surgical procedure." I know that I was not there but I'm confident that she didn't mean that someone will greet him at the front door and be the only one to care for him until he gets back in the car. That's just not how it works. I am sorry that wasn't clear/that he didn't know what to expect.

I also don't think she was trying to pull one over on you, nor that things did not go as they were supposed to with the number of staff involved. Pre-op and post-op are different. There are a number of patients to get through those two times (get ready for surgery/recover from surgery and be ready for discharge) and the staff on duty that day are responsible for accomplishing it. It isn't like "Nurse Jane will be taking care of you today." 

Others who work in these areas may clarify if I have represented this incorrectly.

I do think you should let your contact know that the number of different nurses coming in and out to do the post-op checks was part of what made him uncomfortable. But please understand that this part of it wasn't necessarily a break from the norm, and whether or not your contact admits that is another story. They like to keep things rolling. They also like "efficiency" which amounts to a few people running around doing a lot of things. I am sorry for the way that comes across to patients. Rest assured that some of us don't appreciate it much more than you do.

With any luck they will try to re-tool so that patients can have more consistency and also it sounds like they should try to communicate better in real time. I know it sounds a little cheesy to us (RNs) sometimes, but it does make a difference to patients when we introduce ourselves properly, give our role/title, state what we are there to do, and gain permission to do it.

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10 minutes ago, Susie2310 said:

In my view, communication is key here; introducing oneself if you haven't provided care to the patient before, explaining what you need to do and why, and asking the patient if you can go ahead with the check before doing it.

I agree completely. I typed the above post before reading your comment.

My only beef here is that it is not acceptable to haul off and suggest a whole other level of impropriety.

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1 minute ago, JKL33 said:

My only beef here is that it is not acceptable to haul off and suggest a whole other level of impropriety.

Yep, that’s where my sympathy went out the window. Well, that and the continual flogging of people who weren’t there. 

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@Catfostermom - I will admit one additional thing here: I do sometimes feel somewhat defensive when we receive this kind of feedback because I  know that what nurses are told to do and what patients are told (by hospital administrators) that nurses should be doing are two VERY different things.

I will not defend flat-out poor communication. I am on your side as far as that goes.

But nurses are routinely told to do things that are impossible (or told to do things in a way that makes it very difficult to do them with true excellence the way a nurse would want to do them). Many hospital nurses do run around like chickens with their heads cut off all day long because that is the way hospital administrators want it. And then we receive the backlash when it doesn't go over well with patients. When they have to wait for things they ideally wouldn't have to wait for. When they see 5 different people instead of 1 or 2. When multiple people run in focused on a task and forget to interact in the perfect manner.

As a patient you don't owe a nurse anything other than basic respect. You are the patient and we know that. But since we are all human beings we do nonetheless appreciate it when you try to see a bigger picture instead of just lashing out at the front line.

 

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28 minutes ago, Susie2310 said:

In my view, communication is key here; introducing oneself if you haven't provided care to the patient before, explaining what you need to do and why, and asking the patient if you can go ahead with the check before doing it.

This is very important whether the patient be male or female.  Communication from both sides.  If you are truly uncomfortable about a situation the patient needs to speak up.  Although the nurses are very busy and sometimes running to put out many fires just a few seconds can make all the difference in the world to a scared, confused patient.  And actually will make the experience better for the nurse in the long run.  

But as others have said no one here was in on this particular experience.  Many have stated their feelings and even commiserated with the poster.  Many have given good advice.  At this point the event cannot be changed, but perhaps if they speak with the patient advocate it will not happen to the next patient.  

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