YOU as a Pt-what would you allow a student nurse to do? - page 3
I had mentioned in another thread that I wouldn't allow a student nurse to attempt insertion of a foley on me (unless I'd been anesthetized prior). So that got me thinking.... What would I... Read More
Mar 24, '07Haha! After replying to this thread I was trying to think of anytime something went wrong. I went into a military ER with a very bad UTI/kidney infection. I was in such back pain and was bleeding so bad. I had to wait 5 hours to be seen. The nurse had to give me an iv to put that dye that tests for kidney stones. Well while she was doing this she let go of the needle after it was in my arm. I felt like the exorcist! My blood was squirting all over the room. It got all over me and my clothes. It was crazy. LoL it's funny now, and at that time I was in too much pain to even freak out. I was passing out on the Xray table from the pain.
A couple of months ago the same thing happened at the hospital I volunteer at. I have really good veins and I just told the nurse, "Don't worry this isn't the first time this has happened." It doesn't really bother me. (It's actually kind of cool. Is that weird? LOL)
I think that first one was the only bad experience I have ever had, and it was mainly b/c of the pain I was in.
Mar 24, '07I did have an x-ray tech student film my finger once. It had been dislocated and the doc was ruling out a fx. He kept mashing my hand flatter and I kept yelling "Ow!" I finally told him that if he touched my hand one more time he was in trouble. Afterwards, with the licensed tech in the room with us (I worked at that hospital and knew the techs) I told the student (in a constructive way, honest!) what he had done wrong.
Mar 24, '07Being a Nursing Student myself i would let a student (med or nursing) do things to me. I mean everyone has to learn and i hate when patients give me looks or don't want me to do something because i'm a nursing student but Med students seem to just do everything and the patient never says a word. I mean come on people just because you don't have M.D./D.O./R.N dosn't mean that you can't properly do something. I'm a tech in an ER and have done far more caths on people then some Residents i work with. I mean i've seen them cath people before sometimes sterile technique is terrible. And why is it when a (some residents not all) resident straight caths someone they never fully empty the bladder, i mean come on they can't pee at least give them the comfort to fully empty the bladder so in 10 minutes they aren't extremely uncomfortable. I've actually seen an attending ask how much did they go and they state only a few cc's well that's because you only got enough to fill up that tiny cup for a U/A and then took it out. I'm not at all disrepecting the medical profession i highly respect them and think that they are very intelligent. I don't have a degree yet but i don't do things i'm not comfortable with and i always have an instructor by my side if i'm not quite sure. I've had R.N.'s and clinical instuctors tell me i did a really great job and did everything right on cath'ing patients and didn't do any of their pet peeves during the proceedure. I take my job as a tech and my soon to be nursing career very seriously. I wouldn't want to hinder anyone's learning. Also even the best nurses can't get an IV line sometimes and someone else has to come and do it, so it's not always because of lack of experience!!
ok i'm done ranting but i just think we should be open to others learning and if you aren't comfortable with a student doing something make sure their instuctor or your nurse is in the room with them!!Last edit by Maverick80 on Mar 24, '07
Mar 24, '07i will let them do anything except start my iv .i have the worst veins and get tired of getting stuck. when i was in the hospital to have my baby 4 weeks ago i ask "do you have any students that need to do anything cause i'm willing to let them"... i would make sure the staff nurse was there to make sure that the medication was right prior to the student giving it and did question one student about the insulin she was about to give me. but i'm just a natural teacher and love students so i'm open to whatever...as long as the student is respectful
Mar 24, '07Quote from KellNYso.. you wouldnt let a me do an NG tube insert...? so I go my whole student time never doing one because people like you say no. I walk into your room with the RN behind my name, say I have been an RN for.. 2 years.. and have NEVER done an NG tube (but you are oblivious to this) and.. you let me NG you...?? How are students supposed to learn? practicing on a mannequin for an NG feels NOTHING like a real person, so dont go there.I had mentioned in another thread that I wouldn't allow a student nurse to attempt insertion of a foley on me (unless I'd been anesthetized prior).
So that got me thinking....
What would I and what wouldn't I allow a student nurse to do for me?
Here's my personal thoughts
I WOULD allow:
PO meds dispensed and IVPB meds to be hung (and main fluid bag changed/hung)
*SC or IM meds administered
D/C IV or SL/HL IV
Foley emptying and flushing (if RN with SN for flush)
Unchecked assessments for lung sounds, bowel sounds, DTRs etc (as in, SN can do it, as long as RN there to assess and verify)
I WOULD NOT allow:
*SC or IM meds administered
NG tube insertion
*I listed SC and IM under both categories. If SN had experience giving injections, well, then shoot away. But if not, sorry. I've seen way too many students get scared or try to be nice, etc, and push the needle in so slowly, push the med too fast into the tissue, not feel comfortable with location and hit a bone, etc.
I know I'm leaving lots of stuff out--haven't slept in over 36hrs, so brain ain't what she could be right now, yk?
What about you all? Where are you willing to aid the learning process and where do you draw the line(for you personally-not your kids/family)?
***We're assuming these are not emergency situations. ie, I'd let a student venipuncture me, but not if it were for STAT Mag levels because they think I have MagTox, or T&S because I'm bleeding, etc.
Can't wait to see your answers.
Mar 25, '07I let students (all sorts, nurses, doc, ect) do things to me all the time.....lol. I usually get a student when I visit my FNP, haven't had an issue with but one.......I was there for a horrible ear infection and she was more worried that my panic disorder was acting up and I was breastfeeding (wanted me to stop bf and start back on meds.) Didn't even tell my FNP about the darn ear infection....urgggg. But otherwise I let them do IV's, blood draws, caths, whatever. Gotta learn sometime. I would stop ANYONE if they were doing something wrong or hurting me. at my last dd's birth I had 2 first year nursing students and MY old OB nursing instructor in the delivery. Kinda weird, but hey I said come on in.
Mar 25, '07Originally Posted by firstyearstudent
I'd rather have ANY student insert a Foley (anesthetized or not) than the E.R. nurses I've seen do it. They haven't given a hoot about sterile technique. One nurse shrugged told me, "They're probably going to get antibiotics anyway."
Quote from TazziRNIn defense of firstyearstudent, The only RN's she stated she would not let them insert a foley were the one she has seen do it. Big difference then saying any ER RN.Please don't judge all of use by the actions of one ER's staff. That's an insult to the rest of us.
Mar 25, '07I had a patient the other day at clinical that refused to let me do a rectal suppository. I was quite fine with that, the primary nurse wasn't though.
Mar 25, '07I actually had a funny experience as a male nursing student. I went to go give an heparin shot a few weeks ago. I said to the man.
"Good morning sir, remember me? My name is Ian, we talked a few minutes ago. I am your student nurse and I need to give you your heparin ok?"
Patient: "Ok docter"
"Im sorry sir, I am not a doctor, I am your student nurse today."
Patient: "Im sorry doc, but everyone knows females are nurses."
(I laughed on the inside at this part)
I kept a straight face though, made it very clear what I was doing, who I was, did my 6 rights (they added a new right o_O), checked my med three times, then gave the injection SQ in the URDeltoid. (He said the ABD was too painful for him)
Just goes to show ya, being a student can be very.. interesting hehe.
Mar 25, '07Quote from bethinYou're right, I should have written a letter, but I didn't, I just let it go. It was more than 10 years ago now.I've had one of those before and it is uncomfortable. Why didn't the actual tech supervise the student? Had the student even done one before? You should have written a letter to the school and the hospital. Not to get anyone in trouble but to let them know what is going on. Also, the student should have introduced herself as a student.
I left that area and went down the hall and had my first mammogram. I'd take the mammogram any day!
Mar 25, '07I have to agree with some of the posters who said theres not much of a difference between allowing a student nurse (with supervision, of course) do something and an actual RN with no experience with something (i.e one poster mentioned inserting an NG tube). Unless you ask, you have no idea what that RN has done and hasnt. Heck, sometimes I think I'd rather have a student, because they most likely would have an instructor present to watch them!
That being said, I can also say that I would be a little apprehensive about letting SOMEONE (SN or RN) with little or no experience start an IV on me, but I probably wouldnt mind, because i have a high pain threshold and because Ive been in that position myself. As for a foley, Ive only had one inserted in myself before, and I was anesthetized at the time, so I have no idea how much it would hurt, but I probably would let a SN do it, if the RN or instructor was there.
Now, I also agree with the posters who said that they wouldnt allow some of the students in their class to perform procedures on them. There are a few in my class that I would be terrified if I has them as a student nurse (or actual nurse). Problem is, for me at least, is that it would be difficult to determine (as the pt) who is one of "those" students. That brings back the memory of a student (who is no longer in our program, but not because she did this) who thought they were d/c'ing a heplock and actually pulled out a pts PICC line...yikes!
Personally, I also find it a little odd that many nurses are hesitant to allow a student to perform a procedure on them, because EVERYONE had to start somewhere...but that is your own decision as the pt and I would respect that if someone refused to have me perform something.
Mar 25, '07Just about any procedure would be okay with me.... The SN would be supervised, afterall, I'M a nurse! A nurse that graduated having never starting and IV or inserting a Foley (or and NG) for that matter. It does happen and having RN behind your name is not and indication of competency. I wouldn't let any nurses start administering drugs willy nilly without me asking questions, so I'd be sure to confirm the SN knew (or felt like s/he knew)what was going on.
Mar 25, '07i would not let them do anything invasive.
adding to that, i do no and will not ever see a pa either. np yes, pa no.