Filipino nurses emigrating to US

[kool-aide, RN]

Is there any reason that there seems to be lots of RNs trained in the Philippines that come to the US to practice?

I just wonder because I never hear of nurses from other countries coming to work in the US as much as I hear of Filipino RNs. Does it have to do with the similarity of their training compared to RNs in the US?

[jadelpn, LPN, EMT-B]

Can anyone post requirements for a Bsn in the Philippines?

I often wondered how long their programs are and if they are identical to ours.

Because some day we can do an exchange....send us to another country and get an education for free (or close to it) housing, a stipend-- and then bring us back and let us work.....we are far, far too open doors/arms when there are a number of people who can't afford to get an education to be able to work here....

[HarryTheCat, MSN, RN]

Just a couple of quick points about H-1B workers...I am not an attorney, nor am I offering this up as legal advice, so your mileage may vary.

1) H-1B workers, by law, have to be paid according to the pay scales that the employer uses for all employees holding the same jobs at the same education and experience levels, or the "prevailing wage" for that particular job classification as determined by the state's workforce development department, whichever rate is higher. For example, if your hospital calls an RN with a BSN and five years experience a "Registered Nurse Level II", with a compensation range of $30.00 to $40.00 per hour, they will also have to pay their H-1B nurses accordingly, however the state can also rule that the "prevailing wage" is higher, and that the H-1B worker must be paid at the higher rate.

2) Companies with more than 50 employees who have more than 15% of their workforce on H-1B visas are classified as "H-1B dependent", and have to jump through a couple of extra hoops to prove that they are not displacing American workers, and that they have undertaken reasonable efforts to recruit citizens/permanent residents.

There is also some discussion as to the legality of allowing RNs on H-1B visas. H-1Bs are only authorized for positions requiring a bona fide occupational requirement of a BS (or higher) degree. Since many nursing positions are filled by ADN RNs, the legality of importing RNs may not hold up if someone were to mount a serious challenge to the practice.

There are other considerations too numerous to mention here, but it's not always easy to bring H-1B workers aboard. It is very difficult to do without an immigration lawyer and a lot of paperwork, and in the end there really isn't a cost savings for the employer. The only time it makes sense is if there is a shortage of qualified American workers. There is also an annual cap on the total number of H-1B visas that are authorized every year, and once that cap is reached you can't get any more until the following year. As I recall, the cap is 65,000 per year, and that includes all occupations. Nobel Prize winners and other "distinguished researchers" go to the top of the list, and get preference. Individuals can't just show up in the U.S. and get an H-1B; they must be applied for through the hiring company.

This is a very complicated issue, so the only way to really know all the ins and outs of the law are to consult an attorney who specializes is immigration law.

[Nurse SMS, MSN, RN]

It bears noting that one can be concerned about the influx/influence of foreign workers to the detriment of our own countrymen without it being "foreigners go home". The black and white nature of modern day debate is ridiculous. There IS middle ground and I stand firmly in it. Accusations otherwise are unfounded and insulting.

[Esme12, ASN, BSN, RN]

May I remind everyone that we are ALL immigrants at some point in our history. The only true native Americans are NATIVE AMERICANS who had their land cheated and stolen from them many years ago by a bunch of immigrants.

Allnurses promotes a good debate as long as the comments are polite and respectful.

[Fiona59]

When my health authority recruited from the Phillipines back in 2008/09, we had huge issues with the educational differences. They had hired BScNs who couldn't pass the CRNE after three times (all the attempts allowed up here), so they worked a deal with governing body of LPNs and found that several couldn't pass the CPNRE after three tries and were returned home.

After a lot of research, it was discovered that despite starting school at five, they didn't have 12 years of education before entering university and that the first two years of uni were more like our Grades 11 and 12. This led to huge cries of persecution and discrimination and that Canada wasn't being fair to them. Many of the BScNs had less formal education than the LPNs they looked down upon.

yet now, we are having nurses migrating from the Phillipines who want to write the CPNRE and work as LPNs first so they get used to the Canadian system.

It ultimately would have been easier, more cost effective and employee friendly to fund a batch of LPNs through uni and then work as RNs. Not a choice offered to us unfortunately. Up here the PN education is two+ years full time at College, so we aren't exactly uneducated.

[Fiona59]

May I remind everyone that we are ALL immigrants at some point in our history. The only true native Americans are NATIVE AMERICANS who had their land cheated and stolen from them many years ago by a bunch of immigrants.

Allnurses promotes a good debate as long as the comments are polite and respectful.

First Nations people migrated here as well, Siberian land bridge.

[Esme12, ASN, BSN, RN]

First Nations people migrated here as well, Siberian land bridge.

But it wasn't the white anglo-saxon population that came here to escape persecution only to persecute themselves...but that is another thread.

[Dranger]

My floor is mostly Filipino, they are good workers but I agree there is no reason to import

[sky888]

I pray to god they don't come to canada. All the new graduates RN this year from my university none of them found a job at the local hospital. I've heard horrible things about Philippino psw in retirement home. I think on top of schooling, basic ethic is extremely important too.

[RyanCarolinaBoy, ADN, BSN, MSN]

You know, some of the hostility that SOME of the nurses feel towards foreign prepared nurses have to do with the perceptions that the foreign nurses themselves create. As someone pointed out above, many of these foreign nurses tend to lean to the ICU's for the respect of it. And I have FIRSTHAND witnessed a group of these nurses come into an ICU that I worked in, REFUSE to speak English when a group of them were together, and generally created a hostile work environment for those of us already working there. At the time, I was very angry. Over time, I have come to believe that this is due to an inferiority complex that they had, and they chose to try to gain the upper hand by acting condescending to the local ICU staff.

Regardless, I don't have an issue with ethnicity or a foreign nationality. The problem that I have with this scenario is this: We have MULTIPLE postings daily/weekly about new grads begging to get a job in the hospital system, and instead of hiring locally and choosing to invest in America, these corporations go overseas in an attempt to "save a buck" and simultaneously be able to brag about their BSN ratio to the public. I have dealt with MANY unskilled and unsafe foreign nurses that refuse to listen to advice, in report simply saying "ya, ya, ya" and then waiting until that nurse has left to turn and ask me, "what she say, i no unnerstand". These types of situations make those of us local become resentful and left filling in the gaps!

[RNdynamic]

I'm forced to agree with the above. A few people have barged into this thread insinuating that this is degrading into a foreign nurse bashing thread, but I haven't seen anybody here insult any group of people. If you don't want to participate in a thread about foreign nurses, the abuses that go on, and the difference in training, then why did you even come into this thread just to say you won't be participating? That seems a little counter intuitive to me, and it may signify your own inner seething.

You know, some of the hostility that SOME of the nurses feel towards foreign prepared nurses have to do with the perceptions that the foreign nurses themselves create. As someone pointed out above, many of these foreign nurses tend to lean to the ICU's for the respect of it. And I have FIRSTHAND witnessed a group of these nurses come into an ICU that I worked in, REFUSE to speak English when a group of them were together, and generally created a hostile work environment for those of us already working there. At the time, I was very angry. Over time, I have come to believe that this is due to an inferiority complex that they had, and they chose to try to gain the upper hand by acting condescending to the local ICU staff.

I pointed that out. Often Filipino nurses gear themselves up for critical care units in order to impress their families, who worship high-skilled appearing jobs as supreme. Due to their long history of extreme unemployment, which is one of the worst in the world, in Filipino culture an individual's profession is perhaps the most preeminent aspect of his or her identity. Many Filipino nurses therefore aim to work in critical care because they believe that working in the intensive care unit confers a status that they had been denied to them back home. It is very common to see Filipino nurses taking breaks and lunches together. Often they will study nursing research or methods to obtain additional certifications. To them, any minute not spent in improving their professional ability is a minute wasted.

You will find that very generally, they are a pleasant group of people to be around, but the labor abuses have got to stop and facilities need to stop placing these hungry nurses before they are properly oriented and trained.

[mmc51264, BSN, MSN, RN]

i work with a very diverse group: Filipino, Kenyan, Jamaican, Trinadian, British, South African, Indian, Pakistani, all religions and atheists. I think it makes for a great working group as were are all respectful and have become very culturally competent. Our residents are just as diverse. i think it is a good thing that we have other cultures to work with.