Education vs Experience

Nurses General Nursing

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Hello Everyone,

I am a BSN student who is interested in pursuing a graduate degree in the future, probably a year after I graduate. I have read some posts and found that many here believe that an RN with that little experience has no place in Advanced Practice programs. This is where I disagree.

I believe that Nursing culture is shooting itself in the foot here, and here's my :twocents: cents why. A prospective doctor does not have to leave college after a bachelors degree to gain experience in the field of biology or chemistry before going on to Med school. A prospective college professor does not have to leave college after his bachelor's degree to get experience teaching at the grade school level. So WHY do so many believe that an RN has to leave school after their bachelor's degree to gain whatever many years of experience at the clinical level before going on to grad school?

:nono:I believe that it is counterproductive for the nursing profession as a whole to discourage students who wish to complete their education (MSN or beyond) before beginning clinical or other types of practice. You would think that the sensible thing to do is get your education, and THEN get your experience. Am I the only one who feels like this?

Specializes in mostly PACU.
Sorry if my post was confusing - you were the 2nd person - I said the NP programs take a non-BSN bachelors degree AND your RN license which you can obtain (as we all know how) thru an ADN or diploma program. I never meant bypass having a license - but YES to bypassing having the BSN part - but WITH a bachelors in something else. I know it sounds crazy because as I said before the schools are a business - they're not going to tell you this unless you ask Also - check out the requirements online to get into those programs near you - they'll say either have a BSN or a bachelors in something else plus nursing assessments (which is a typical BSN course that's not in an ADN program) and maybe a few other undergrad classes.

Oh! Thanks for clearing that up. In this area I don't know of any schools that have an RN-MSN/NP track. Most of them still require a BSN. A classmate of mine got around that by doing the RN-BSN bridge while taking some of the Masters level courses, then officially applying for the NP program towards the end of the bridge program. He was able to just go straight through. I guess that's essentially the same thing. Although I'm sure he had to tak a lot more classes than he would have if he were in a regular RN-MSN program.

I believe you can still acquire experience as a nurse while still getting your education. That is why scholar programs have been created...to teach the incoming future nurses how to take responsibility for the job. You have to be qualified and have certain characteristics to attain the field of a registered nurse.

Oh! Thanks for clearing that up. In this area I don't know of any schools that have an RN-MSN/NP track. Most of them still require a BSN. A classmate of mine got around that by doing the RN-BSN bridge while taking some of the Masters level courses, then officially applying for the NP program towards the end of the bridge program. He was able to just go straight through. I guess that's essentially the same thing. Although I'm sure he had to tak a lot more classes than he would have if he were in a regular RN-MSN program.

There are programs where you go straight thru from getting your RN to becoming an NP - columbia university in NY city is the only one i know of - but there are more I believe.& you CAN have a bachelors degree in another field plus your RN license to get into a regular NP program. If your friend had NO bachelors degree - then he would need the BSN to get into the NP program.

You are very welcome. Just focus on your current classes and don't stress too much over the other requirements.

Specializes in M/S, MICU, CVICU, SICU, ER, Trauma, NICU.

. A lot of NP students have this issue when trying to get clinical experience. There needs to be the type of consistency in nursing education across the board. Unless we start doing this, no one will respect us.

Yup.

I can say that the NPs going through the FIU MSN ARNP programs find the docs just through the RN-bedside clinical time they have spent.

I know of several who follow surgeons/physicians and ask them prior to entering the program if they can train with them. They are getting excellent experience.

That's is definitely an advantage from those who come in straight out of nowhere and have to practically beg to follow someone.

Hi, I'm from Malaysia...we are here are still in the process to upgrade our nursing profession...Actually I'm just finished my bachelor Degree (Without any clinical working experience except for my clinical posting during my study). Now I'm in dilemma...just as same as you. I'm now being an educator for diploma in Nursing programme. I really think that Education without experience is acceptable because, theory is very important things for nurses to differentiate between a nurse who just do 'task' and nurses who really understand what they do...

In my opinion, in order to upgrade our profession, we should think out of the box...we should shift from orthodox way of thought to another new way of thought...we should provide a various job scope for our nurses rather than stereotyping to work in hospital...nurses role is not just providing care in hospital..it is beyond that..nurse as educator, nurse as counselor,nurse as advocate..and so on.....

So, if we provide various job scope for nurses, there will be more specialty rather than depend on job demand from hospital and MD...as for example, we trained nurses who interested in Edu to be Edu nurse, then he might have extra Edu experience (speciality in Theori)...for me to be a good nurse, not depend on how many experience you have, but how you use your knowledge for the benefit of your client (patients,public, students)....

Specializes in ER.

I think it would depend on what you want to do once you graduated. If you've never worked on a floor, how can you expect to be a good manager? Learning how to interact with patients is an importabt part of being a good nurse, and that isn't something they can teach in school.I wouldn't want an instructor who had only classroom experience, and I honestly can't think of any advanced practice job where you would be able safely enter without prior nursing experience.Sometimes signs of impending arrest can be very subtle, how could you be a good NP or CRNA without that basis? Getting advanced education is a great idea- good luck and I hope you accomplish your goals, but hospital administrations are FILLED with people who have the education without the experience to back it up- Those of us who work the floors have to contend with their silly policies because they have no idea what it takes to work as a nurse.

Specializes in Med/Surg.

I both agree and disagree with you. I plan on returning to school for my MSN this year, I have 2 years of floor experience. I am going for my MSN in nursing leadership, but I plan to continue to work on the floor while doing so. When I graduate, I plan to work on the floor for some more. Just because I have a few more letters behind my name I don't think it in any way guarantees me a better job. Additionally, I KNOW my colleagues will respect me as a leader more with additional experience. The amount of respect I have on the floor is entirely dependent on my work ethic, critical thinking and patient care and has nothing to do with the fact I have a BSN.

I agree with your post, to an extent.

Like you, I plan on going straight from BSN to MSN or DNP. I just know that if I stop going to school, I will never go back as I don't have kids and I will want to start having kids when I get out of school. I just know myself, and getting all of my education first is the best route for myself.

Anyways, I hope to work as an RN while going to school to become an NP. But it's okay if I can't. I don't expect to get an NP position without RN experience and I really have no problem working as an RN after finishing NP school.

I think while we shouldn't be judgmental of those who choose to get all of their education first, those of us who choose that route should be open to the idea of working as a Staff RN for a few years before really taking on an Advanced Practice role.

Hello Everyone,

I am a BSN student who is interested in pursuing a graduate degree in the future, probably a year after I graduate. I have read some posts and found that many here believe that an RN with that little experience has no place in Advanced Practice programs. This is where I disagree.

I believe that Nursing culture is shooting itself in the foot here, and here's my :twocents: cents why. A prospective doctor does not have to leave college after a bachelors degree to gain experience in the field of biology or chemistry before going on to Med school. A prospective college professor does not have to leave college after his bachelor's degree to get experience teaching at the grade school level. So WHY do so many believe that an RN has to leave school after their bachelor's degree to gain whatever many years of experience at the clinical level before going on to grad school?

:nono:I believe that it is counterproductive for the nursing profession as a whole to discourage students who wish to complete their education (MSN or beyond) before beginning clinical or other types of practice. You would think that the sensible thing to do is get your education, and THEN get your experience. Am I the only one who feels like this?

Here is my 2 cents. Anyone can gain experience it pretty much a passive act. Education on the other hand is something that requires dedication and effort. However you decide to gain education it makes you a better health care provider.

Hello everyone,

First of all I would like to say that if I offended anyone with my greenness, that was not my intent. I appreciate most of your thoughtful and patient comments and I hope to glean as much wisdom from the community here that I can. I am a brand new student and I have wanted to be a nurse for years. Perhaps my overzealousness to get to where I want to be in nursing resulted in my voicing of more than a share of passive aggressiveness.

I am beginning to see that in nursing, the general consensus is that experience is the best education. Someone made a great point that nurses are expected to hit the ground running, and that nurses with advanced degrees are expected to be experts already at what they do, with little or no time to develop nursing skills that will be required of them.

I guess all I can say is that I look forward to developing that experience.

"Experience is a hard teacher because she gives the test first, the lesson afterwards"

Vernon Sanders Law

You really have to get that fundamental RN experience. A physician group where I live recently interviewed several new APN grads for a job... guess who they hired. The RN with 13 years of ICU experience, over the RN with 5 years of experience. Three docs actually made a new grad APN with no prior RN experience feel stupid during the interview process by asking her a simple clinical question (that I could've answered) but she had no idea and tried to ******** the answer. You will have a tough time getting a job without it - no physician will want to hire you, your app will not make it past the HR screeners, worse you might jeopardize safe patient care and get sued.

Experience trumps education over and over again. But experience gets you where you are and education takes you where you want to be. Combine the two and you've got an almost perfect match.

Don't discredit one over the other.

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