Doctoral degree to become an NP???

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The American Association of Colleges of Nursing (AACN) is calling for the requirement of doctorate in nursing for advanced practice nurses, such as nurse practitioners, nurse midwives, clinical nurse specialists, and nurse anesthetists. This new degree will be called a Doctor of Nursing Practice and, if the AACN has its way, will become the entry level for advanced nursing practice.

AACN Position Statement on the Practice Doctorate in Nursing

Specializes in Education, FP, LNC, Forensics, ED, OB.

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Specializes in Education, FP, LNC, Forensics, ED, OB.

After much deliberation and careful consideration (along with post clean-up), this thread is reopened.

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Please keep to the topic: Doctoral degree to become an NP???

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A "glorified PhD"? A DNP isn't anywhere close to being a PhD. The PhD is the terminal degree in any field or discipline, awarded by the university as a whole (not an individual department, as other doctoral degrees, like the DNP, are), and the standards for a PhD are standardized across universities and across the world (again, unlike the DNP). Everyone understands what a PhD is and what the person had to do to earn it, which can certainly not be said for the DNP. The DNP is what my professors in grad school used to refer to as a "quick 'n dirty" doctorate. A more accurate description would be "a glorified Master's" (which is exactly what the DNP programs are -- an MSN program with a few extra courses and delusions of grandeur :)).

Cheers. :yeah:

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Specializes in Family Practice.

"The DNP is what my professors in grad school used to refer to as a "quick 'n dirty" doctorate. A more accurate description would be "a glorified Master's" (which is exactly what the DNP programs are -- an MSN program with a few extra courses and delusions of grandeur :))."

Very well put. I am a Masters prepared FNP. I am all for advancing the nursing profession, but this previous quote is "right on the mark". It is a glorified Masters Degree.

At first I was in favor of a Doctorate for clinical practice, such as the Clinical Psychologist have. But in reality, I'm not sure what it will add to the Professional Practice.

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"The DNP is what my professors in grad school used to refer to as a "quick 'n dirty" doctorate. A more accurate description would be "a glorified Master's" (which is exactly what the DNP programs are -- an MSN program with a few extra courses and delusions of grandeur :))."

Very well put. I am a Masters prepared FNP. I am all for advancing the nursing profession, but this previous quote is "right on the mark". It is a glorified Masters Degree.

At first I was in favor of a Doctorate for clinical practice, such as the Clinical Psychologist have. But in reality, I'm not sure what it will add to the Professional Practice.

I agree. The DNP degree seems to be great for those wishing to teach at the university level, open their own practice (for the business side) or work more in public health, but I'm still at a complete loss at how it makes you any better of a nurse due to the complete lack of science and clinicals.

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The DNP degree seems to be great for those wishing to teach at the university level, ...

It's not even that simple -- a lot of universities only recognize PhDs for tenure, and DNP-prepared nurses will not be eligible for tenure at those institutions (they may be able to get teaching jobs, but they'll always be "second class citizens" within the university community).

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i agree. the dnp degree seems to be great for those wishing to teach at the university level, open their own practice (for the business side) or work more in public health, but i'm still at a complete loss at how it makes you any better of a nurse due to the complete lack of science and clinicals.

i am not sure what factors you are using to develop this premise?????? the dnp was not designed for teaching, it was designed as a "practice" degree. business side??? public health??? i have noted your expertise being shared here, and sdn, your tone/thoughts change with the wind. as i recall your expertise is based on being related to a nurse and wanting to be a pa and or np depending on the day or forum. can you please point out a dnp program (just one) with a "complete lack of science and clinical " ???

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I'm a PNP and there is zero to none as far as advanced sciences in DNP programs. At least from the programs I have looked at around the states.

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i am not sure what factors you are using to develop this premise?????? the dnp was not designed for teaching, it was designed as a "practice" degree. business side??? public health??? i have noted your expertise being shared here, and sdn, your tone/thoughts change with the wind. as i recall your expertise is based on being related to a nurse and wanting to be a pa and or np depending on the day or forum. can you please point out a dnp program (just one) with a "complete lack of science and clinical " ???

http://fpb.case.edu/dnp/documents/curriculum1.pdf

please show me all the science and clinical coursework and please let me know how this coursework makes you better at treating patients and does not have any business/public health/education side.

also, please inform me how these 34 credit hours make you equivalent to a md/do.

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i'm a pnp and there is zero to none as far as advanced sciences in dnp programs. at least from the programs i have looked at around the states.

my understanding is that all dnp programs require some sort of transitional research or practice improvement project. advanced science would be highly likely in the development of any scholarly endeavor. i suspect many are viewing advanced science as genetics or patho or pharm or other?? for me, advanced science includes scholarly practice. my personal experience found pharmacology, genetics and chemistry far easier than my scholarly project. more importantly my scholarly endeavor was at a far higher level of critical thinking than any of my traditional science courses. the project forced me to integrate all of the sciences into an application of the knowledge, far more challenging than a single course.

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http://fpb.case.edu/dnp/documents/curriculum1.pdf

please show me all the science and clinical coursework and please let me know how this coursework makes you better at treating patients and does not have any business/public health/education side.

also, please inform me how these 34 credit hours make you equivalent to a md/do.

i am afraid until you have done the scholarly project you will not be able to appreciate how much the endeavor contributes to making you a better provider. i have done the scholarly project; i know the process made me a better provider. i know others who have done the dnp project, they also have become better providers secondary to the process. please note i have yet to suggest the dnp is equal to the md, one thing you learn in a scholarly endeavor is not to "generalize". i will suggest that a np contributes significantly in the provision of healthcare, and that they are a valuable resource in primary care.

i would also note that case dnp completion program has a good reputation for advanced practice nurses. please note the case dnp completion students are not newbies, they are experienced nps returning for a dnp.

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Your scholarly project may have been very difficult, but it doesn't replace the need for advanced physiology, pharmacology, patient management, pathophysiology, gross anatomy, etc. These are the courses needed for ongoing patient management. What i am saying is that a terminal degree for advanced practice nurses should include that type of information. Just as md students first have basic sciences prior to med school and then advanced courses for the next 3-4 yrs plus. The courses that we took prior to and in nursing school are not graduate level sciences, and there is a significant distinction.

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