Doctoral degree to become an NP???

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The American Association of Colleges of Nursing (AACN) is calling for the requirement of doctorate in nursing for advanced practice nurses, such as nurse practitioners, nurse midwives, clinical nurse specialists, and nurse anesthetists. This new degree will be called a Doctor of Nursing Practice and, if the AACN has its way, will become the entry level for advanced nursing practice.

AACN Position Statement on the Practice Doctorate in Nursing

Specializes in ACNP-BC, Adult Critical Care, Cardiology.

A co-worker who just started a DNP program and I were looking through the ABCC website to see if there's anything new on the Mundinger camp and the proposed DNP certification exam slated for the this fall. I noticed that the composition of the ABCC board members have shrunk considerably making me wonder if previous board members bailed because of the negative reaction from the nurse practitioner community particularly NONPF and AANP not to mention the outrage from the physician community. The board is now composed of just five individuals, three of whom are faculty from Columbia. The two others include a physician from Penn and a nursing professor for U Tenn HSC.

We also checked out the sample exam questions and found that many items actually use the word "physician" when referring to the provider as in sample question goes this way: "you are the physician taking care of this 24-year old female so and so...". There were also sample questions involving a case of 1 year old with skin problems (hello! out of scope for ACNP, ANP). I wonder if these question were taken directly from USMLE Step 3 and not even reworded to reflect applicability to NP's.

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A co-worker who just started a DNP program and I were looking through the ABCC website to see if there's anything new on the Mundinger camp and the proposed DNP certification exam slated for the this fall. I noticed that the composition of the ABCC board members have shrunk considerably making me wonder if previous board members bailed because of the negative reaction from the nurse practitioner community particularly NONPF and AANP not to mention the outrage from the physician community. The board is now composed of just five individuals, three of whom are faculty from Columbia. The two others include a physician from Penn and a nursing professor for U Tenn HSC.

We also checked out the sample exam questions and found that many items actually use the word "physician" when referring to the provider as in sample question goes this way: "you are the physician taking care of this 24-year old female so and so...". There were also sample questions involving a case of 1 year old with skin problems (hello! out of scope for ACNP, ANP). I wonder if these question were taken directly from USMLE Step 3 and not even reworded to reflect applicability to NP's.

If you look at their website the questions will be taken directly from part one of the USLME part three test bank. Therefore you should expect to see all ages and all conditions. I seriously doubt they are paying the USMLE enough for them to go through and scrub all the questions to remove the physician label. This test along with part two is used to grant a physician an unrestricted license to practice medicine (along with at least an intern year in all states). There for it has to cover all age groups and patient demographics. The problems you raised are even more pronounced for other specialties ie. PNP or WHNP. The other issue is that part two is an interactive computer treatment algorithm of a number of patients with different conditions. Most of the state boards regard this as more important than part one. However, Mundingers group has decided not to include this. I will be interested to see the results of the first test in November if they are released.

David Carpenter, PA-C

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Specializes in ICU, OR.

Hi, I am trying to find this info in this thread but can't. Can someone tell me what is the year that the DNP will be required for NP? How much time do I have left to try and get my MSN for NP? Will those with MSN be grandfathered as NPs, or will the NPs have to all go back and get DNP?

Thanks.

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Specializes in ACNP-BC, Adult Critical Care, Cardiology.
Hi, I am trying to find this info in this thread but can't. Can someone tell me what is the year that the DNP will be required for NP? How much time do I have left to try and get my MSN for NP? Will those with MSN be grandfathered as NPs, or will the NPs have to all go back and get DNP?

Thanks.

You may have missed the actual post but that question has been answered in this thread and other threads repeatedly. There is no definite mandate to require the DNP at a certain time frame. AACN is proposing that the DNP becomes the required degree for entry into advanced practice nursing roles by 2015. There is a provision to grandfather all nurse practitioners with master's degrees to allow them to stay in clinical practice. While allnurses.com is a wealth of information, you should get your sources from the actual organizations who are involved in these changes. I suggest you look at AACN DNP FAQ's here: http://www.aacn.nche.edu/DNP/DNPFAQ.htm and NONPF DNP FAQ's here: http://www.nonpf.com/NONPF2005/PracticeDoctorateResourceCenter/PDfaqs.htm

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Specializes in ICU, OR.

Thanks, yes, that is what I meant. I knew that info was in the thread SOMEWHERE but could not find that post in the huge thread! :nuke:

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Specializes in Ante-Intra-Postpartum, Post Gyne.
You may have missed the actual post but that question has been answered in this thread and other threads repeatedly. There is no definite mandate to require the DNP at a certain time frame. AACN is proposing that the DNP becomes the required degree for entry into advanced practice nursing roles by 2015. There is a provision to grandfather all nurse practitioners with master's degrees to allow them to stay in clinical practice. While allnurses.com is a wealth of information, you should get your sources from the actual organizations who are involved in these changes. I suggest you look at AACN DNP FAQ's here: http://www.aacn.nche.edu/DNP/DNPFAQ.htm and NONPF DNP FAQ's here: http://www.nonpf.com/NONPF2005/PracticeDoctorateResourceCenter/PDfaqs.htm

I was told by a representative for San Francisco State University that the DNP will be required by 2015 and that those that are already FNPs will be grandfathered but will more than likely be pressured to go back to school and will be paid less than those with a DNP...I worked with FNPs that only have ASN degrees (obviously they were granfathered when the BSN and then MSN were required)....they have a long road of school ahead of them. I wonder what this will do to the PA's who many only have a certificate but do a lot of the same care as FNPs, even attend the same programs at this time.

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i wonder what this will do to the pa's who many only have a certificate but do a lot of the same care as fnps, even attend the same programs at this time.

from http://www.allalliedhealthschools.co..._assistant.php

physician assistant degrees

until recently, pa programs awarded certificates and associate degrees in addition to master's and bachelor's degrees. now the accreditation review commission on education for the physician assistant (arc-pa) requires that all programs offer graduate level degrees.

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from http://www.allalliedhealthschools.co..._assistant.php

physician assistant degrees

until recently, pa programs awarded certificates and associate degrees in addition to master's and bachelor's degrees. now the accreditation review commission on education for the physician assistant (arc-pa) requires that all programs offer graduate level degrees.

from arc-pa:

"the arc-pa supports the sponsoring institution's prerogative in awarding credentials and degrees, and encourages sponsoring institutions to recognize the evolution of the profession as one that requires a graduate level of curricular intensity. institutions that sponsor pa programs are also encouraged to incorporate this higher level of academic rigor into their programs and acknowledge it with an appropriate degree."

however, it also states:

"the arc-pa acknowledges ongoing change in the delivery of health care and in the education of health professionals. the needs of patients and society at large should be considered by the arc-pa, the sponsoring institutions, and the programs. establishing an environment that will foster and promote diversity is considered essential to educating pas to provide service to others that is not exclusionary of any group, race, or culture. the various insights and resources offered by a diverse faculty, staff, and student body will increase the overall impact the pa profession can have on the future of the global community. pa programs are encouraged to have policies and practices addressing diversity of their student bodies and faculty."

within the standards:

institution accreditation

a1.01 the sponsoring institution must

a) be accredited by a recognized regional or specialized and professional accrediting agency to award graduates of the pa program a baccalaureate or higher degree. 1

b) be authorized under applicable law to provide a program of post secondary education.

what this ends up meaning is that any institution that can award a bachelors can sponsor a pa program (even if the bachelors comes from a cooperative agreement). however the program does not have to award a bachelors to the pa graduates. the arc-pa understands that each program understands the local needs and local educational environment in order to provide qualified pas. if the local needs are best met out of a community college then the program can be placed there.

the pa profession is founded upon the principle of clinical competence. the profession has long recognized that the degree itself does not confer any clinical competence. instead competence is met by a consistent program of didactic and clinical education with measured comparable outcomes. where this education is accomplished is best determined by the local medical community which understands the local medical needs. the pa profession also recognizes that to mandate the masters will disproportionately affect those programs that place a majority of pas in either urban or rural underserved areas.

the pa position will hopefully continue to be served by those certified as pas without regard to educational status.

david carpenter, pa-c

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I was told by a representative for San Francisco State University that the DNP will be required by 2015 and that those that are already FNPs will be grandfathered but will more than likely be pressured to go back to school and will be paid less than those with a DNP...I worked with FNPs that only have ASN degrees (obviously they were granfathered when the BSN and then MSN were required)....they have a long road of school ahead of them. I wonder what this will do to the PA's who many only have a certificate but do a lot of the same care as FNPs, even attend the same programs at this time.

Keep in mind that the DNP is an academic degree. In Virginia, those who are Master's prepared licensed APN's will be able to maintain their license as CNS, NP, CNM, or CNRA provided that they meet the regular requirements to maintain their license. The BON is stating that folks who are currently licensed as NPs with MSN degrees will not be required to get a doctoral degree to renew their existing APN certification or license.

As things stand now, in 2015 all new APNs will need to graduate from an accredited DNP program to be able to sit for APN licensure. Some Univeristies have already closed the MSN-exit for APN programs; they are enrolling only BSN-to-DNP students now. I expect that more universities will do this in the next few years as these dnp programs become CCNE accredited. UVa will have our CCNE accreditation visit for the DNP program next February. After the DNP program is accredited, we will develop plans for a BSN-entry to the DNP as well.

According to the AACN plan, after 2015 the only MSN programs will be in generalist or non-APN areas (CNL, administration, informatics, education, public health, etc).

Here in Virignia we have NPs who have been practicing since the late 1970s with only BSN preparation. They have continued to licensed as NPs (but their scope of practice is not as broad as those who are MSN-prepared). What remains to be seen is whether any state BONs will authorize different scopes of practice for MSN vs DNP prepared APNs.

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Specializes in Education, FP, LNC, Forensics, ED, OB.

As things stand now, in 2015 all new APNs will need to graduate from an accredited DNP program to be able to sit for APN licensure.

Not quite. Right now it is only a vision that all APN's will be required to possess DNP.

But, I look for this to become mandatory.

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Specializes in SICU,L and D.

Will the education of DNP be compensated in salary?

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Specializes in Education, FP, LNC, Forensics, ED, OB.
Will the education of DNP be compensated in salary?

Highly doubtful in the beginning, IMO. Maybe later as salary demands of the APNs become evident.

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