Do you think nursing would be more advanced as a profression if...

Illinurse2010 · Sep 27, 2011

Nursing is a service profession. On its most basic level we take care of people while they are sick until they return to their lives in the community. This type of job has traditionallly been viewed by men as more naturally suited to women, once nurses started making better wages the men started to get over that stereotype and trickle in.

I find the kitchen and sandwich statement to be overtly disrespectful to women, but I'm just crabby from my night shift.

evolvingrn, BSN, RN · Sep 27, 2011

I do think we could be more respected as a profession and I do think its hx as one of the few a jobs a 'women' could have plays into that but i do think that respect is definitely growing. Im not sure the answer is more men...look at education there are more and more men going into teaching and i see their work conditions getting worse not better. I think in order to advance our profession we have to be at the helm and as a whole we have to decide we are professionals.

Laurie52 · Sep 27, 2011

Nursing will be more respected as a profession when it changes its entry level into practice. My pharmacist has a pharmD, my physical therapist has a masters degree and PT now entering are getting a doctorate. Nursing has to bite the bullet and decide that a masters degree is the minimal entry level into practice--this debate in nursing has been going on for over 40 years!!

dee122381 · Sep 27, 2011

Nursing will be more respected as a profession when it changes its entry level into practice.

My thoughts exactly, Laurie52. The best way to advance nursing as a profession is to advance the education requirement. A 2-year ADN program is not going to get the respect that Master's or Doctorate's degrees get.

nicurn001 · Sep 27, 2011

You want entry level to nursing to be what ?? Masters , aint ever going to happen .

Level of education will never gain us respect , cohesiveness and being able to support colleagues , rather than running for cover at the first signs of trouble , these are the things that gain work groups respect .

Sorry but thats the reality , do you think employers will suddenly change there spots when nurses are MSN and pay them what they deserve , rather than what they can get away with , or stop giving us more and more of the formerly ancilliary tasks so that we are the most well educated dusters of shelves.

Most professionals are respected for being able to do their job well , not because of the alphabet soup of qualifications / certifications they have .

tma0312 · Sep 27, 2011

I agree with it being female dominated and having less respect as a profession.

I mean, just look at the name "nursing." I don't know what pops into your head, but to me, it is a distinctly female activity. I wish I had a different title than nurse sometimes.

Rob72, ASN, RN · Sep 27, 2011

My thoughts exactly, Laurie52. The best way to advance nursing as a profession is to advance the education requirement. A 2-year ADN program is not going to get the respect that Master's or Doctorate's degrees get.

I will respectfully disagree. There are not many MA/PhD practioners in any field, that does not function primarily in theory, who command respect. Fundamentally, look at the conflict between Psychiatrists and Psychologists, then relating to MDs. This gets back to the discussion regarding nursing diagnoses- this theoretical model was created in a practical void.

Look at the "satisfaction surveys" most facilities use. They have nothing to do with patient or staff satisfaction, but with validation of developing business models. Press-Gagme is a prime example. They have nothing new to tell us. Quality employees do not use a script; you cannot "create" effective customer service with a script. What the PG script does is establish a minimum standard of CS that retards personal growth and expression, thereby driving out truly effective CS personnel- the "theory" being that they will (if truly dedicated to CS) begin the BS-MBA track. In turn, the facility is able to pay minimum wage to anyone under their CS model, since it is impossible to "excel" to the degree where any individual is an irreplaceable asset.

In one move, the facility has created a minimally trained pool of employees, immediately replaceable, at absolute minimum cost.

The "advanced degree" concept really got rolling in business in the 80s. Its hard to see that things are appreciably better in any sense. The effect on Nursing will be the same, because we are pursuing the same goals with the same standards.

Don't believe it? RNs are already, increasingly, the licensed buffer between management and the UAPs/MAs/etc., just as a BS is the managerial buffer between the drooling CS moron and the MBA section head to the CEO. Hmmm...

Laurie52 · Sep 27, 2011

You want entry level to nursing to be what ?? Masters , aint ever going to happen .
Level of education will never gain us respect , cohesiveness and being able to support colleagues , rather than running for cover at the first signs of trouble , these are the things that gain work groups respect .
Sorry but thats the reality , do you think employers will suddenly change there spots when nurses are MSN and pay them what they deserve , rather than what they can get away with , or stop giving us more and more of the formerly ancilliary tasks so that we are the most well educated dusters of shelves.
Most professionals are respected for being able to do their job well , not because of the alphabet soup of qualifications / certifications they have .

Yes, I think that a master's should be entry level into practice. Why are pharmacists and physical therapists paid more than nurses?

Don't kid yourself, that "alphabet soup" of qualifications means something. I studied and worked for my CCRN and I am proud of it. I maintain it because it means that I have achieved a certian level of competency in critical cae. If you needed heart surgery, would you choose a physician who is board certified in cardiac surgery or a physician who didn't do a residency?

nyrn5125 · Sep 27, 2011

You want entry level to nursing to be what ?? Masters , aint ever going to happen .
Level of education will never gain us respect , cohesiveness and being able to support colleagues , rather than running for cover at the first signs of trouble , these are the things that gain work groups respect .
Sorry but thats the reality , do you think employers will suddenly change there spots when nurses are MSN and pay them what they deserve , rather than what they can get away with , or stop giving us more and more of the formerly ancilliary tasks so that we are the most well educated dusters of shelves.
Most professionals are respected for being able to do their job well , not because of the alphabet soup of qualifications / certifications they have .

I agree that it would not change. Look at how much more respect and pay the BSN RN are getting compared to ADN...NOT.

What is it a 5 cent raise? Starting pay will usually be the same for both because it's the same title-RN

We need way more nurses in the workforce than PT or Pharm. So that is why it's different education level. ADN has been acceptable because we need nurses to get out there and work. It takes an ADN 2 years to pass the same NCLEX that the BSN takes after 4 years. Also no patient has ever asked what kind of degree do you have. they just know you're an RN. As far as the Op question I can say that the male RN's definitely do get spoken to differently on the phone by MD's and sometimes will be mistaken by the pt for the dr or pa just because they are men. The pt's definitely see women as the nurturers. And hospital directors are usually men so it comes from the top-respect and higher salary

GHGoonette, BSN, RN · Sep 27, 2011

I agree with it being female dominated and having less respect as a profession.
I mean, just look at the name "nursing." I don't know what pops into your head, but to me, it is a distinctly female activity. I wish I had a different title than nurse sometimes.

Heck, why should we be "ashamed" (perhaps that's a rather extreme term for what you're implying) of being called nurses? Maybe it's different on my side of the Atlantic Pond, but here, nurses are regarded - by the general public at least - with the deepest respect. In fact, many youngsters of both genders get into nursing more for the desire for status in the community than anything else.

I think it's great that more and more men are getting into nursing, but I don't see that it's going to make much of a difference to the way the profession is viewed by members of other professions. Some doctors might have an elevated opinion of themselves, and these are precisely the kind of characters that will look down their snoots at all other people, professional or otherwise. If you are good and efficient at what you do, you will earn respect. If you're an ignorant butt-hole, you won't. That applies to everyone, nurses, doctors, engineers, plumbers, electricians.....

Isabelle49 · Sep 27, 2011

To understand nursing and how women in nursing might be viewed, you must go back to it's origins! My older sister, who is now deceased, was a nurse against her father's wishes. He told her that a nurse is nothing more than a glorified hooker!

NewTexasRN · Sep 27, 2011

I agree. Look at the stats. Think about it, the area of nursing where nurses get paid the highest salary: CRNA. How is it that nursing is such a female dominated profession, but the ones making the biggest bucks are male? Yea, it's why I have thought about leaving the profession. I respect physicians, but they are not Gods. I treat them just like a regular person. So sick of having to override them. How many times have you had a gut feeling that the physician is wrong because of your knowledge and experience? Some nurses are too afraid to speak up because we are not trained to think that we are on the level of the physicians. Honestly, I don't do well at this kind of thing. Nurses have power and yet we allow hospitals to boss us around and take advantage of us. They can't survive without us. We should have better salaries and better working conditions. Sometimes I am lucky if I get a bathroom break much less a lunch break. Jacho advocates for the patients, but who watches out for us to make sure that you don't work a t 14 hr shift without breaks. Who is our advocate? Then, the constant issue of your license.... blah blah blah. Yes, nursing is still in the dark ages.