Do nurses only "eat their young" in certain departments?

Natkat, BSN, MSN, RN · Apr 8, 2007

As a nursing student I've had experiences similar to the OP. Here is how I handle it.

Ignore it.

I try and work as independently as possible when I'm in clinicals. I wait to ask questions when the nurse isn't as busy. I try to be a helpful as I can so that their experience with me will be tolerable at least, and pleasant at most. I do what I can to make her job easier without getting in the way too much.

If they're less than pleasant I try not to take it personally. I'm there to learn and feel it's my responsibility to find as many learning experiences as I can. I don't care if they like or not, but I try to understand what they're going through too. I have my own agenda and I'm not going to let a cranky nurse stand in the way of my education.

I try and put myself in the nurses' shoes. I know someday I will have student nurses working with me, and I know myself well enough to know that I won't always be in the mood to deal with it. I know that will depend on the day I'm having. If I'm feeling overwhelmed and have a lot of needy patients I know I won't be as receptive to teaching someone new things. If I'm having a decent day and feel like I'm more in control of things, I know I'll be more open to showing a student new things and explaining what I'm doing.

One last thing......some people are more territorial than others. I try to keep this in mind when I'm the new kid. If I run across a territorial type, I give them a wide path and don't say much. I will be polite and helpful, but I usually let that person make the overtures. I wait for them to let me know when it's okay to approach them. Sometimes it takes a while but this usually works out okay. Then there are times that someone won't like you no matter what. If you can deal with that and still work together then fine. If you just can't help rubbing each other the wrong way, then go work someplace else. You can always find another group of people you are more compatible with.

DusktilDawn · Apr 8, 2007

This semester we are on Med/Surg. At first I thought this "nurse eating young" thing was just something made up by overly sensitive students, until I floated to other departments. I have been is short stay, OR and the ICU and the nurses in there are SOOOOOOOOOOO nice compared to the nurses on M/S! One of the nurses in OR told me "I want the student nurses to enjoy their time in here so they will come and work here when they graduate". He spent tons of time with me; quizzing me a little things, showing me how to sterile gown-up, and told me the names of all the instruments he was setting up. In M/S however, I feel like I am a big pain in the orifice! I try at all cost not to bother the nurses in this department, but if I can not find my teacher and my client is in 9/10 pain an is allowed prn morphine and it is time (we need assistance/an observer) they sigh and act all put out. Its like, if I was not there there would be a number of other things they would have to add to their list of things to do because I am taking two of their five patients and doing everything for them (minus needing them or my teacher when available for I.V. push meds). I even say, "as soon as you get a chance can you watch me give such and such med".
Don't get me wrong, there are some that are nice, but the majority make me feel hated. The school tells us that students in the past have been hired as techs that have left an impression...but who would want to work with these people? Some even ignore you when you say good morning!

You will no doubt experience floors where pretty much everybody is friendly. You will also no doubt experience floors where it seems everyone is mean. Floors that have a general "bad attitude" usually have long standing issues that you as a student do not know the history of. Chances are if they treat students miserably, they treat each other just as bad, regardless of "youth." Sometimes it's only one person that's miserable, and they will take it out on whomever, regardless of whether it's a co-worker or a student.

Its like, if I was not there there would be a number of other things they would have to add to their list of things to do because I am taking two of their five patients and doing everything for them (minus needing them or my teacher when available for I.V. push meds).

Did it ever occur to you that having students can add to an already full plate on a unit where the stress level is already critical? You are there to LEARN, not as a favor to the staff, and not necessarily to relieve any of their burdens. As much as I enjoy having students on my unit, it does at times create situations that impede me from doing my job. EJM brings up a good point regarding how viewpoint/perspective can be temporarily fixed. Both students and staff will have an increasingly harder time empathizing with each other when their own stress/stressors are at a high level.

I think the last thing needed is yet another thread that incorporates into it's title "do nurses eat their young." It's a stereotype that I've seen one too many use as an excuse for bad behavior, from both "bullies" and "victims."

Little Panda RN, ASN, RN · Apr 8, 2007

Normally I do not post in a thread where opinions and emotions are running in overdrive, but this time I just have to defend the OP. I am a nurse and of course not a student any longer and thank goodness for that. Being a student is difficult and when you arrive to the floor to do the dreaded clinical that is required it is doubly difficult when the nurse you are assigned to is already having a bad day and makes it known that you are a bother. Believe me I had this happen many times during my clinical rotations. I sucked it up and dealt with it. Some nurses do eat their young plain and simple. It is hard not to generalize when you are frustrated, been there done that. So please give the OP some slack, we all need it every now and then. Just my 2 cents.

TigerGalLE, BSN, RN · Apr 8, 2007

Ok... I just graduated ... literally in december. I now work on a crazy busy psycho med/surg floor. I used to feel the exact same way as you did. I would leave clinical totally bumbed, pissed, and sick of the way the nurses acted. Well now i know how they feel. I mean if I had to have a student right now I'd freak out. Ultimately, even though you are taking 2 of their patients, they are still responsible for them, and they do have to pick the patient back up when you leave.

I think it is so hard for m/s nurses to have students because they are just SO busy. Or that is how I feel. If a nurse is going to have a student then that nurse needs to be very experienced and excellent with time management. Because I know I couldn't handle a student right now.

And when I was a student it always seemed more pleasant when I would be in ICU, CVICU ect. Well because that nurse only has 2 patients. It is a lot easier to teach when you only have 1-2 patients. I don't know this is just my opinion. One day I do want to precept. But if I had to precept right now it would completely stress me out!

RUcon08 · Apr 8, 2007

I would suppose it just varies, whether it's a unit, hospital, or completely different career field. We had a chance to observe in the OR for a day last semester, and it is hands down one of my least liked clinical experiences EVER. I don't think I've ever felt so unwelcomed anywhere; I literally walked out mid-surgery at one point due to feeling so uncomfortable (granted it was a very "boring" surgery-- angioplasty with me in the back of the room visualizing it on an x-ray monitor). While in the next OR over, my classmates were observing brain surgery, limb amputation, lung transplant (just to name a few) and they actually told me that the surgeons & staff were VERY nice and informative. So yeah, I wouldn't think of there being any rule of thumb...

RN4NICU, LPN, LVN · Apr 8, 2007

This semester we are on Med/Surg. At first I thought this "nurse eating young" thing was just something made up by overly sensitive students, until I floated to other departments. I have been is short stay, OR and the ICU and the nurses in there are SOOOOOOOOOOO nice compared to the nurses on M/S! One of the nurses in OR told me "I want the student nurses to enjoy their time in here so they will come and work here when they graduate". He spent tons of time with me; quizzing me a little things, showing me how to sterile gown-up, and told me the names of all the instruments he was setting up. In M/S however, I feel like I am a big pain in the orifice! I try at all cost not to bother the nurses in this department, but if I can not find my teacher and my client is in 9/10 pain an is allowed prn morphine and it is time (we need assistance/an observer) they sigh and act all put out. Its like, if I was not there there would be a number of other things they would have to add to their list of things to do because I am taking two of their five patients and doing everything for them (minus needing them or my teacher when available for I.V. push meds). I even say, "as soon as you get a chance can you watch me give such and such med".
Don't get me wrong, there are some that are nice, but the majority make me feel hated. The school tells us that students in the past have been hired as techs that have left an impression...but who would want to work with these people? Some even ignore you when you say good morning!

It really isn't a certain profession, department, age, gender, level of experience, or any other trait that you could generalize. It is just the fact that some people are jerks, and if you get enough jerks together, it can create a negative working environment.

My first job out of school was in the OR. It was truly the most hateful, spiteful, miserable group of people I have ever encountered. The men were ten times more "catty" than the women, but the entire department was toxic. The techs were terrible, the surgeons were terrible, bad attitudes were the norm. The next place I went - also OR - was terrific. I loved it there, but I wanted to try the NICU, so I left when a NICU position became available.

When I got to the NICU, once again, everyone had their own personalities. Some are kind and helpful, some are total jack*$$es. The same could be said in any profession (except they don't call it "eating their young" but it really is the SAME THING), in any department, among any gender mix, etc.

Each unit usually does, from my experience, have its own "culture". Some are friendly, some are horrible, most are just average. You can't really predict by specialty, as it all depends on the particular group of people working on the unit at the time. It can even vary within the same unit. For example, one unit I worked on as a traveler had a good weekend group and a horrible weekend group. I dreaded every shift I worked with the horrible group but I loved working with the other group. Same specialty, same age/experience mix, same gender mix, same patients, just a different group of individuals.

So, what I'm trying to say in this increasingly long post is that generalizations and stereotypes very seldom represent reality. Nurses do not eat their young. Instead, jerks are jerks to most everyone who crosses their path (some bullies will back off if you confront them - but they're generally still jerks). Nice people will be nice, whether you are a student, a new grad, or a nurse with 30 years of experience. Some women will be catty and gossip. Some men will be catty and gossip. It depends on the individual attitudes of the people involved and nothing else.

LydiaNN · Apr 8, 2007

You know, though, on units that are just generally unhappy, it isn't a matter of eating the young. When morale is that low, relationships suffer across the board. A newbie may perceive that all the bad feelings are directed towards her, when in reality there is most likely seething resentment and ongoing frustration amongst many of the nurses.

The last unit I worked on was dreadful. First shift griped about third, second griped after first, third griped about second. They didn't do this, they didn't do that. And within the shifts themselves? Ooh, boy. I haven't worked in a hospital since.

reesern63, RN · Apr 8, 2007

This semester we are on Med/Surg. At first I thought this "nurse eating young" thing was just something made up by overly sensitive students, until I floated to other departments. I have been is short stay, OR and the ICU and the nurses in there are SOOOOOOOOOOO nice compared to the nurses on M/S! One of the nurses in OR told me "I want the student nurses to enjoy their time in here so they will come and work here when they graduate". He spent tons of time with me; quizzing me a little things, showing me how to sterile gown-up, and told me the names of all the instruments he was setting up. In M/S however, I feel like I am a big pain in the orifice! I try at all cost not to bother the nurses in this department, but if I can not find my teacher and my client is in 9/10 pain an is allowed prn morphine and it is time (we need assistance/an observer) they sigh and act all put out. Its like, if I was not there there would be a number of other things they would have to add to their list of things to do because I am taking two of their five patients and doing everything for them (minus needing them or my teacher when available for I.V. push meds). I even say, "as soon as you get a chance can you watch me give such and such med".
Don't get me wrong, there are some that are nice, but the majority make me feel hated. The school tells us that students in the past have been hired as techs that have left an impression...but who would want to work with these people? Some even ignore you when you say good morning!

I'm sorry you had a bad experience. It's true that some units are so understaffed that morale is low. As a student, it may seem like you are lightening the load, but in reality that's not always the case. You do have to learn, though.

I have to say that for me, Friday was such a horrible day that if someone had told me I would be having a student following me I probably would have lost it. It wouldn't have been about the student personally, it would have been one more thing to be responsible for.

I think 99.9% of us wish we had the time to take an individual interest in the students that come through. Unfortunately, for many of us, we're staffed by the skin of our teeth.

LeahJet, ASN, RN · Apr 8, 2007

I apologize for my insensitive comments earlier in this thread. I was just having a bit of fun with an old cliche that all nurses have heard ad nauseum.

I am sympathetic to the plight of new nurses for once upon a time, I, as well as every one else was a new nurse also.

I had some of the same problems 10 years ago. I had to walk that fine line between being humble and being assertive. You have to find a happy medium between the new nurse that knows it all and rubs every one the wrong way and a doormat.

It's not easy.

But I have news for you......

Nursing isn't for the weak.

nuangel1, BSN, RN · Apr 8, 2007

I apologize for my insensitive comments earlier in this thread. I was just having a bit of fun with an old cliche that all nurses have heard ad nauseum.
I am sympathetic to the plight of new nurses for once upon a time, I, as well as every one else was a new nurse also.
I had some of the same problems 10 years ago. I had to walk that fine line between being humble and being assertive. You have to find a happy medium between the new nurse that knows it all and rubs every one the wrong way and a doormat.
It's not easy.
But I have news for you......
Nursing isn't for the weak.

well said leah .i too had the same experiences 20 yrs ago.it doesn't matter what hospital what floor shift etc .nasty people are out there pts and staff.you need to be respectful of seasoned nurses but at same time assertive so you aren't walked on and it can be a fine line..you grad school you have earned your license .be open to the learning and the experience because it only comes with time .i have been the student the nurse and the preceptor .i still overall like what i do and feel like i make a difference .i have bad days ,horrible days and good days like anyone .i have had my share of difficulties and incidences over the years .you have to be built of tough stuff to be a nurse today .i have made great friends .learned alot from staff pts and families .i met a wonderful man thru work.he too is a nurse .i can't imagine what else i would be if not a nurse it comes too naturally for me and i am good at it.

Gennaver, MSN · Apr 8, 2007

https://allnurses.com/forums/f35/why-do-nurses-eat-their-young-215955.html
https://allnurses.com/forums/f8/nurses-who-eat-their-young-should-kicked-curb-214953.html
The consensus among alot of us is that the phrase "nurses eat their young" should be banished, as it is a generalization that tars all nurses.
steph

Hello,

I agree, the phrase perpetuates the concept which is so easily misunderstood and applied inappropriately.

If we all "say" the phrase in unison it will still not simply make it apply wherever we want.

Edit to clarify...it will not apply to any nurse who is tired or busy or not in the mood to precept that day, nor will it apply to any nurse who...as a regular person...may have a personality that doesn't necessarily combine nicely with yours, just because someone want to throw the "eating-card" out there.

Gen-not buying it anymore

Tweety, BSN, RN · Apr 8, 2007

Thank you. My intent was not to be made fun of. If it continues feel free to erase this thread completely, if its possible. Gee-sh! This is why I am timid to ask nurses for help...perfect example here!!

You're welcome I apologize if you felt made fun of.

Please try to keep things in perspective. Look at the thousands of questions that are asked here before you judge that the posters here at all nurses eat their young. I ask the same as you go about your career. When nurses are mistreating you, take a minute to stop and ask yourself "how many nurses have I come into contact with this week.....did every single one who had experience or was older mistreat me? If not how many did". Most often the answer is one or two. If the answer is everyone, then find another job or quit school.

Seriously I wish you well. Unfortunately what was said above is true, it's not for the weak, the timid, or the sensitive. You need thick skin the same way a doctor, lawyer, or businessperson needs thick skin. Patients, families, doctors, supervisors, and yes even peers are going to challenge you every day. You need to develop the skills necessary to deal with these people. We can help.

I don't want you to ever feel you can't come here and vent and ask us how to deal with it. Some of us get a little upset when you lump us in with the "nurses eating their young" idea. As you've noticed, it distracted from your original idea.

End of lecture. Didn't mean to sound so old. Take it or leave it.