DNP required for NP?

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Hi guys I'm new here, does anyone know if they are requiring DNP now for NP because I'm planning to start my masters FNP this December.. Because I read in some articles that starting in 2015 they are supposed to be required? I'm from Nevada

Good and informative reply elkpark. Just wanted to point out that CRNA will require a doctorate in 2025, not necessary a DNP. Most CRNA programs can't grant nursing degrees and so will grant other types of doctorates like doctor of nurse anesthesia.

Yes -- I was just using the term "DNP" in a generic sense to avoid making the topic any more confusing than it already is for people who are new to the issue.

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Specializes in Outpatient Psychiatry.

There's no enhancement to outcomes, practic, revenue, etc. so associates with the DNP so I doubt it'll ever be a requirement. How does filling the physician gap with people who have to spend time and money taking research and policy courses benefit sick people?

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The DNP is not a research degree, nor does it focus much on health policy. I'm in a DNP program right now, and I would say that it is a hodge podge of all sorts of things that are supposed to guide the doctoral candidate towards implementing EBP change processes in the clinical setting. Some of it makes sense. A lot of it doesn't...just like much of nursing academia. For that reason I agree with you that the DNP will perhaps never actually become a practice requirement.

I suspect that they rushed to implement the DNP degree without fully sussing out what it should actually be. I like my DNP program, but I still don't see why every NP should need to study these things because much of it has no relevance at all to the bulk of what we do for the patients.

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Specializes in Outpatient Psychiatry.
The DNP is not a research degree, nor does it focus much on health policy. I'm in a DNP program right now, and I would say that it is a hodge podge of all sorts of things that are supposed to guide the doctoral candidate towards implementing EBP change processes in the clinical setting. Some of it makes sense. A lot of it doesn't...just like much of nursing academia. For that reason I agree with you that the DNP will perhaps never actually become a practice requirement.

I suspect that they rushed to implement the DNP degree without fully sussing out what it should actually be. I like my DNP program, but I still don't see why every NP should need to study these things because much of it has no relevance at all to the bulk of what we do for the patients.

But its definitely not clinical

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Specializes in ER.

Ok, I feel better now. I know one of my job's this rumor is flying around. I heard it was only a recommendation but hadn't heard it was official. Supposedly the ANCC was requiring the DNP to test if you hadn't started a program before the end of 2015.

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Specializes in Assistant Professor, Nephrology, Internal Medicine.

I'll just leave my two cents on how I choose between the DNP and MSN level NP preparation.

I already have an MSN in a non-clinical area, so I originally thought, "why in the world would I get another MSN or post master's cert?!" So I applied to a few dnp programs and got accepted. Now some of these schools had MSN and DNP level NP education. When I was discussing tuition, transfer credits, etc. I found out that the bulk of my MSN wouldn't transfer, due to various issues, mainly being that something like advanced health policy for a MSN.Ed program has a different emphasis than a DNP/MSN-NP program. I thought, no big deal, until I looked at the tuition differences.

For example, take advanced Health Assessment:

MSN tuition was X, DNP tuition was X +$200 per credit

Same class, in fact the cohorts from MSN and DNP were mixed together, but the DNP was more expensive.

I did calculations and figured out that I basically had to redo the MSN level classes I took (minus a few because they were fluff and did transfer). So, if I wanted to go for the right now, I would pay more for the same classes.

So, I eventually decided to do a post-masters. Tuition is master's level, and I can get done in 1.5 years as opposed to 3.5. I plan on going for the DNP sometime, but this way I can get it after already being an NP.

SO, MY PROS AND CONS LIST: (off the top of my head from what I can remember)

MSN/PSM

PROS:

-cheaper

-can complete program in two fewer years

-get out there and gain NP experience sooner

-Possibly get a bigger paycheck depending on specialty

CONS:

-Not doing terminal degree

-losing out on the advanced leadership courses that most DNP programs offer

-losing out on clinical hours (MSN 500-700 hours, DNP 1000 hours)

-Losing out on specialization rotations (d/t fewer hours and less chance to diversify rotations)

DNP:

PROS:

-gaining extra leadership courses

-gaining extra specialization opportunities

-Terminal degree in field

CONS:

-extra time required before you can certify

-extra money, and a lot of it

-usually higher tuition per credit hour

-territory issues with physicians about having a doctoral degree (I've discussed this with several physician's, the vast majority don't care, but some do find it an issue"

Feel free anyone else to chime in! Like I said, this was my two cents, take it for what it is. In reality you need to evaluate your situation and make a choice based on what you desire!

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Specializes in burn ICU, SICU, ER, Trauma Rapid Response.
There's no enhancement to outcomes, practic, revenue, etc. so associates with the DNP so I doubt it'll ever be a requirement. How does filling the physician gap with people who have to spend time and money taking research and policy courses benefit sick people?

I noticed that while NP schools were busy increasing their NP programs to 3 to 4 years in length with the DNP, medical schools are busy shortening medical school to 3 years. One such program, actually a satellite program to a large medical school in the state, just opened near my home.

I could go to medical school and be finished in 3 years not 30 miles from my house. To do NP I would have to drive about 3 hours and it would take 3.5 to 4 years.

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Specializes in Labor and Delivery.
I noticed that while NP schools were busy increasing their NP programs to 3 to 4 years in length with the DNP, medical schools are busy shortening medical school to 3 years. One such program, actually a satellite program to a large medical school in the state, just opened near my home.

I could go to medical school and be finished in 3 years not 30 miles from my house. To do NP I would have to drive about 3 hours and it would take 3.5 to 4 years.

Just don't forget that after that 3 year medical school that you will need to do at the very minimum 3 years of residency after (depending on what specialty you would do). Our residents have to do 4 and of course other specialties even more. Just throwing that in there.

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Specializes in burn ICU, SICU, ER, Trauma Rapid Response.
Just don't forget that after that 3 year medical school that you will need to do at the very minimum 3 years of residency after (depending on what specialty you would do). Our residents have to do 4 and of course other specialties even more. Just throwing that in there.

No, I didn't forget. But there are many, including me, who feel that NPs (and RNs for that matter) should also have some form of required residency.

Also for physicians a residency is a PAID position. Not paid much, but it's not like they are in school accumulating more debt and PAYING to go to school like during medical school.

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Specializes in Labor and Delivery.
No, I didn't forget. But there are many, including me, who feel that NPs (and RNs for that matter) should also have some form of required residency.

Also for physicians a residency is a PAID position. Not paid much, but it's not like they are in school accumulating more debt and PAYING to go to school like during medical school.

I am very aware that the residents are paid. They complain about their "cr*p" pay all the time to us at work (all part of the process though until they become an attending). I assume by your prior post that you are considering this shortened, satellite medical program nearby? Either way, what is your idea of a residency for RNs and NPs, what would you like to see done for both? Also curious about how many other medical schools will be or have shortened their 4 year programs to 3. I work at a large academic/teaching hospital, so I am going to find out what the students and professors think about this idea (seriously, genuinely curious) just to see their perspective on it.

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Specializes in burn ICU, SICU, ER, Trauma Rapid Response.
I assume by your prior post that you are considering this shortened, satellite medical program nearby?

Oh gosh no. I was just pointing out what I see as irony that the NP, widely viewed as a cost effective provider of quality health care, was rapidly increasing the time and financial investment required to produce a provider, while medical schools are doing the opposite.

Either way, what is your idea of a residency for RNs and NPs, what would you like to see done for both?

There are already some superb residencies for both. They are just not required. For RNs my hospital has a 6-9 month residency for grads and nurses changing specialties. After the residency nurses are assigned to a mentor for a year who agrees to be their "go to" person and they work the same schedule. The mentor gets some perks for doing to and as a result many of out best nurses are serving as instructors in the residency, preceptors and as mentors.

The residency has cut our turn over significantly and another, unanticipated, benefit is that we now have surgeons who WANT their patient cared for in our ICU and admissions went up, fewer empty beds.

I have described the residency at length several times here.

My NP friends who have completed residencies in emergency care rave about it and they seem very competent right from the start.

Also curious about how many other medical schools will be or have shortened their 4 year programs to 3. I work at a large academic/teaching hospital, so I am going to find out what the students and professors think about this idea (seriously, genuinely curious) just to see their perspective on it

Its the same as the 4 year program, they just don't get summers off like in the 4 year program. But there is a huge cost savings in an entire year less of living expenses, plus and extra year of income as a resident and later attending.

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Specializes in Labor and Delivery.

Makes sense about the 3 years if the summers are spent in class, gotcha. For some reason I misunderstood when you were speaking about residencies for nurses (forgive me, lack of sleep, for some reason I thought you were getting to something else lol). My hospital offers a 6 or + month residency program for new grad RNs as well, which helps them tremendously. I was in a nurse residency program for 6 months as well a few years back at my first place of work (they offered residencies for critical care, labor & deliver, and ER). The residency program I was placed in wasn't as good as the one my current hospital runs (or at least that's how I feel looking back), but I am glad some places offer them!

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