I didn't expect to be insulted and frowned upon during my very FIRST interview, but that is exactly what happened. This was an interview for a new-grad position and one I was well prepared for and more than qualified to take on. But I wasn't prepared for THIS. At first they weren't even expecting me to be there because HR forgot to tell them, that should have been the first warning flag.
Initially I'm being asked all the normal questions and given "what would you do?" scenarios. The woman tells me I did well and answered what they're looking for. Well of course I did! I passed the NCLEX first try and I'm appropriately trained, right? WRONG. When the topic of my education came up and she learned that I was a diploma graduate, the interview took a 360. She informed me that diploma nurses were only "techs" in the nursing world and that I really should just go back to school for my BSN because she will pick the person with the BSN over the diploma nurse only based on that fact. She stated that diploma nurses are trained to take on the basic nursing duties however BSN know how to distinguish good research vs. garbage and apply it to their work environment. Well hey! That may very well be true and that's fine and dandy but we are talking about a new grad entry-level-get-eaten-alive position and it doesn't matter if you have a diploma, ADN, or BSN. ALL are qualified for this entry-level position. You pass the boards, you're capable. I am MORE than happy to go back to school and get my BSN, BUT I need a job first because surprise surprise, college isn't free! Who knew?! I could see getting a reaction like this if I had applied for a nurse manager or nursing supervisor position. But new grad? Infuriating! I gave up my WHOLE life. And I'm not just talking about time for fun and games and relaxation. I'm talking about my family, when the father of my child left me for another woman stating that I was "too dedicated to my education". I'm talking about single parenthood and still managing to finish my last year with an A. I'm talking about lost friendships and time with my daughter that I will NEVER get back. And for what exactly? To be told that my school is worthless? My education is worthless? I'M worthless? Unbelievable! The quality of a diploma education is one of a kind. You do spend time in the classroom but LIVE in the hospital practicing all of the necessary skills and graduate feeling prepared and ready!
But the NCLEX and nursing boards feel differently. If they didn't they would not allow the ADN to sit for exams if they weren't considered "equal".
It's not that simple -- it's not up to the BONs. BONs just interpret and enforce existing legislation -- they don't get to make up their own rules and set their own standards. In order to change the requirements for nursing licensure in a state, the state legislature has to be convinced to change the requirements, and they are not operating in a vaccuum. Community colleges have a lot of power and pull with state leges, and lobby strongly to protect ADN programs. Hospitals and other healthcare employers have a lot to gain from having a large, minimally-prepared nursing workforce in a state (keeps salaries and benefits down). Proprietary schools spend a lot of money lobbying to protect the minimum requirements for nursing education and licensure for their own financial benefit. Physician groups don't want to see nurses get stronger as a group. The list goes on and on ... And the state legislatures hear, loud and clear, from all of these groups that don't want to see any changes, and not a lot about why a change would be necessary or beneficial.
Specializes in Critical Care, ED, Cath lab, CTPAC,Trauma.
It's not that simple -- it's not up to the BONs. BONs just interpret and enforce existing legislation -- they don't get to make up their own rules and set their own standards. In order to change the requirements for nursing licensure in a state, the state legislature has to be convinced to change the requirements, and they are not operating in a vaccuum. Community colleges have a lot of power and pull with state leges, and lobby strongly to protect ADN programs. Hospitals and other healthcare employers have a lot to gain from having a large, minimally-prepared nursing workforce in a state (keeps salaries and benefits down). Proprietary schools spend a lot of money lobbying to protect the minimum requirements for nursing education and licensure for their own financial benefit. Physician groups don't want to see nurses get stronger as a group. The list goes on and on ... And the state legislatures hear, loud and clear, from all of these groups that don't want to see any changes, and not a lot about why a change would be necessary or beneficial.
I have always maintained it is a convoluted issue and all about money. I agree that the BSN is the future. I do, however, disagree that nurses with years of experience have become suddenly inferior and are no longer employable.
I have always maintained it is a convoluted issue and all about money. I agree that the BSN is the future. I do, however, disagree that nurses with years of experience have become suddenly inferior and are no longer employable.
One of the people I learned the most from on my last rotation was an LPN and one of the unit managers I've admired most began as a diploma RN. Talent and ability are all around us, regardless of the letters following our names or how we earned them. After all this education, I might end up really sucking as a nurse with my shiny new BSN. Pretty sure I'll cry if that happens.
So confusing to read about this topic and even the experience with the first interview. Is there any helpful hint which degree is higher or less? Want to find out what means diploma, ASN, ADN. Than, most employer really searches for BSN Nurses, ASN and Diploma almost worthless. Also, this time everybody esp. here in SW Florida tries to study nursing. As I heard, they also can try the NCLEX several times until finally passed. This makes this occupation and everybody job, it have not been several years before.
So confusing to read about this topic and even the experience with the first interview. Is there any helpful hint which degree is higher or less? Want to find out what means diploma, ASN, ADN. Than, most employer really searches for BSN Nurses, ASN and Diploma almost worthless. Also, this time everybody esp. here in SW Florida tries to study nursing. As I heard, they also can try the NCLEX several times until finally passed. This makes this occupation and everybody job, it have not been several years before.
Nica; I must admit I am having trouble understanding exactly what you are saying/asking. I believe you asked about the differences in the different routes for entry to RN practice. Here are a few good articles:
Sorry, it is confusing for me and some times I have difficulties to express my minds.
When you have here so many different ways to become an RN, how do you know what to take? And how does an employer make the decision between all the nursing ASN/ADN/Diploma?
I know that an BSN is higher, but what to prefer if someone has to decide?
Thats what I meant, in my country a nurse is a nurse, all have the same education, all the same degree and now it is started to become some with an Bachelor which is not better paid etc, just more study (this will change for sure) but here there are different ways.
If you are an employer, which one would you hire??
Honestly, I have two different translations of my nursing education, both from accredit US companies.
One says I have a diploma in nursing.
The other states that I have an ASN.
Which one would you choose?? Honestly?
This completely depends on your area of the country. The original poster here was looking for a job in Florida. Florida is by all reports flooded with excess nurses and employers have the power to pick and choose what they consider to be the best candidates; or rather, which candidates will make their hospitals look better. Given the choice, employers are hiring BSNs.
Sometimes employers know of a certain nursing school (either diploma or ADN) that produces particularly good graduates. They are favorable to those. I am afraid that with a foreign school, they are not likely to be favorable; be it diploma or ASN. Sorry.
If the nursing market you are in is unfavorable to diploma/ADN graduates, I would send your transcripts to some reasonably priced RN to BSN programs and see which one will give you the most credit for your prior work. Then pursue your BSN. At that point, you will be far more competitive.
Another option would be to move to an area of the country that has a true nursing shortage (usually undesirable places to live) and get some US nursing experience, beef up your credentials with some specialty certification exams and you will be more marketable.
I think Diploma nurses have as significant place in nursing as all other levels of education. Most of the nurses I've worked with over the 50+ years I've been in nursing are more legitimately judged on the base of attitude and knowledge learned on the job. Passing state boards is a starting place; learning never stops. I'd be more concerned about the nurses not seeking to continue to learn. I used to get concerned when interviewing a nurse who's "job hopped", but then I started seeing the value of experience, though I did watch for lack of commitment.
Thanks to both of you. Unfortunately, my area is FL. I do not have any problems in learning, I learned just three months to pass the NCLEX. At once with just 75 questions. This should say enough about my learning ability.
I can not move, we bought a business here to get the visa, also a house, which is senseless to sell after half a year. And spending at least $6.000 for a BSN and not knowing if I get a job than (because this will take me more and more away from my working experience) seems also not to be a good option. Seems that I already spent about $2.500 for my evaluation, all the translations, the tests, the requirements ... for a worthless RN license. This really is disappointing.
I try my best to find a job, but I am more and more unsure that I get one. I am also not that good in boasting skills, which in my eyes belong to a nurse and do not need any mention. Will see how it goes! All the best to original poster, hope at least he or she gets a job! Thx.
@Nica RN! I did find a job, I got offered the one I originally posted about despite the interview experience. It's not easy fining a job as a new grad but most hospitals offer a "new grad" program in which they will hire those without experience and train them. It's during certain times of the year, 3 nearby hospitals offered it in my area. I would apply for those position a, along with outpatient places, etc.
This is good to hear that you finally get a job!! Wish you all the best! Still, I don't think that I are able to apply for an internship due to my age, i think they prefer younger nurses. I can try, though.
elkpark
14,633 Posts
It's not that simple -- it's not up to the BONs. BONs just interpret and enforce existing legislation -- they don't get to make up their own rules and set their own standards. In order to change the requirements for nursing licensure in a state, the state legislature has to be convinced to change the requirements, and they are not operating in a vaccuum. Community colleges have a lot of power and pull with state leges, and lobby strongly to protect ADN programs. Hospitals and other healthcare employers have a lot to gain from having a large, minimally-prepared nursing workforce in a state (keeps salaries and benefits down). Proprietary schools spend a lot of money lobbying to protect the minimum requirements for nursing education and licensure for their own financial benefit. Physician groups don't want to see nurses get stronger as a group. The list goes on and on ... And the state legislatures hear, loud and clear, from all of these groups that don't want to see any changes, and not a lot about why a change would be necessary or beneficial.