Concerned mother..question about clinicals

TheCommuter, BSN, RN · Nov 23, 2009

i would have to say something in this about that age. In Florida you have to be 18 to do anything in nursing field. I am surprised that they allowed her to be able to take this class. Being the nature of what we do.

Many states allow minors to become CNAs. For example, I live in Texas, which mandates that an individual be at least 16 years old and have attained at least a 9th grade education before becoming a CNA.

sonomala · Nov 29, 2009

No way, no how, forget it. In 3 months as a CNA, I was punched at, hit, grabbed, kicked, spit on and verbally abused by many residents.

CNA2day · Nov 29, 2009

Training will teach your daughter now to deal with uncomfortable and unacceptable situations. I think it would do any kid good to learn the respect and learn how to develop a relationship with someone different then them. Let the girl do it, you stopping her is not going to teach her anything. But letting her get the experience will change her life for the better!

NICU_babyRN, BSN, RN · Nov 29, 2009

No way, no how, forget it. In 3 months as a CNA, I was punched at, hit, grabbed, kicked, spit on and verbally abused by many residents.

This is your experience but not a typical one. If this was your experience than perhaps you should have been working in pairs with another CNA. This is a manager's decision but if the abused CNAs don't bring these problems to the table, managers may not be aware.

I was a CNA for over 2 years and gained valuable experience caring for young, adult and old patients. There is nothing sexual and please remember that while your daughter is in clinicals she will not be alone with patients.

Also, as a CNA she can work with kids, adults, infants...CNAs don't work only in Long-term facilities.

Cul2 · Dec 31, 2009

How do any of you feel about a 16-year-old male cna

trainee cleaning the genitals of an alert elderly women?

Perhaps being mentored by an 18 or 19 year old more

experienced cna? How do you think some families of the

residents might react to this? I must assume you would

find this just as acceptable as having a 16-year-old

female work intimately with an alert older man who might

not appreciate it. It's interesting that this discussion

seems to come completely from the perspective of the

young cna, and seems to be completely concerned with

the feelings of the cna. How about looking at the feelings

and perspective of the male patient. Just something to

think about.

llg, PhD, RN · Dec 31, 2009

How do any of you feel about a 16-year-old male cna
trainee cleaning the genitals of an alert elderly women?
Perhaps being mentored by an 18 or 19 year old more
experienced cna? How do you think some families of the
residents might react to this? I must assume you would
find this just as acceptable as having a 16-year-old
female work intimately with an alert older man who might
not appreciate it. It's interesting that this discussion
seems to come completely from the perspective of the
young cna, and seems to be completely concerned with
the feelings of the cna. How about looking at the feelings
and perspective of the male patient. Just something to
think about.

I don't think the gender makes any difference. If the person is mature enough to do the work in a professional manner, it's OK with me. Society needs to get over some of its hang-ups. It is perfectly OK for a man to be an RN, LPN, or CNA.

PMFB-RN, RN · Dec 31, 2009

It's the clinicals that I am worried about. She will be working in a nursing home, helping the regular nurses there care for the elderly, right? The part I am worried about with that is the "assist in dressing and bathing". In clinicals, can the nurses have her bathe a naked man including washing his genital area? Or have her change a Depends undergarment and have to clean the genial area of an old man?
For her to have to do that at 18, I wouldn't have as much problem with it. At 18 your considered an adult. But I don't want her doing that sort of thing at 16.

*** Why on earth would you have any concerns about your daughter taking care of people? What is it that bothers you? I can't for the life of me fathom what it is you are worried about.

Cul2 · Dec 31, 2009

When you say that gender doesn't make any difference -- for whom?

It's obvious you mean for the caregiver. And I'll even dispute that.

Some caregivers feel much more comfortable dealing with same gender

care -- that, of course, doesn't mean they shouldn't be able and willing

to work with both genders -- but it also means that gender does matter.

But, when most caregivers say gender doesn't matter, it's about them,

not the patient.

When you say that society should "get over" its "hangups," you're basically

saying that they way you see things is okay and the way others see things

is not okay. Gender may or may not be an issue with hospitals (I think it

really is. It just isn't an open topic). But the fact is that gender is an issue

out in the real world. What caregivers consider should be the "norm" for

modesty and body exposure, isn't the norm out in society. You're dealing

with real people and real cultural norms. You expect people to just drop

their boundaries and bodily modesty values when the enter a hospital?

That's not realistic. You need to deal with what you've got and respect

those boundaries and values.

I gave the case of the male cna's on my last post because it would never,

never happen in a hospital. Never. And most of you know it. The response

was that gender doesn't matter. Well, it does. And the example I gave

is one of the gender double standard in medicine and how the modesty

of male patients is treated differently than the modesty of female patients.

And this thread is an example of how this double standard and gender

neutral attitude is so embedded within hospital culture that it isn't even

acknowledged.

llg, PhD, RN · Dec 31, 2009

When you say that gender doesn't make any difference -- for whom?
.

I wrote a quick answer that you are interpreting in a way that I did not intend. Yes, gender differences can matter -- but HOW they are handled should be similar whether the gender difference is male-female or female-male.

We should always be sensitive to the cultural needs of out patients -- REGARDLESS of the particular gender combinations involved. But we should not prohibit males from becoming CNA's, nurses, or physicians because SOME patients may be uncomfortable with it ... just as we do not prohibit women from becoming CNAS's, nurses, or physicians because SOME people are uncomfortable with a female provider.

When it comes to individual combinations of patients and care-givers (regardless of the role), we should be mindful of cultural preferences. But when we talk about national policy about roles and job opportunities in general, we should be gender-neutral. "Equal opportunity" is a basic tenent of American culture and we need to comply with that in our policies. We can do that and still be sensitive to the needs of individual patients. We do that all the time.

Taffey · Dec 31, 2009

When I took my CNA course there were highschool students in our class. They did the same work that we all did in clinicals. I had one patient that covered himself up during the shower. The other male patients that I had were fine with the showering and changing. You should talk with your daughter and see if she is up to this. There will be lots of things that she will encounter. Showering and changing are one aspect of the job. It will really be good for her to see a little into the medical field now. It might help her decide if this is the right profession for her. I wish her good luck.

Cul2 · Dec 31, 2009

You misunderstand my position. I agree with you. Of course males

should be allowed to be cna's and nurses. I'm not disputing that.

But this thread is about a 16-year-old girl and how it's just accepted

that she will have complete access to any male that needs intimate

care. We all know that the odds are slim that the male will be asked

if he would rather have same gender care. A recently posters gave

examples where it didn't really matter to the males being showered

by these young girls. Try asking the men. Try giving them choices and

then see if it matters. Males will put on a face, a persona, a macho

stance to pretend that it doesn't matter. But some are deeply

humiliated beneath mask and would never admit it. Unless you ask

respectfully you won't get them to admit it. This is true with some

women patients, too.

What I'm stating that what's being so casually discussed on this thread

would never be the case with a 16-year-old

male cna trainee. He would never be allowed to have access to any

female patient needing intimate. We all know this. Yet it is one of

those topics nobody wants talk about, and a truth that nobody will

openly admit. It's about the double standard regarding how male

and female patients and their modesty is treated. And about how some male

cna's and nurses are treated with regard to their access to patients

of the opposite gender. "Gender doesn't matter" seems mostly to

pertain to female's doing intimate care on males, not the reverse.

fuzzywuzzy, CNA · Dec 31, 2009

Where I work there are no male CNAs on my shift (7-3).