Cna challenge lpn boards

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ok hear this out! i lived in california and i would hear cnas say they are going to challenge the california lpn boards. im like ''ok lets be serious''! lol. so i took it upon myself to see if this is possible.damn i was shocked its REALLY TRUE!! you have to be a cna for 5 yrs with x-amount of expr.in certain areas. personally i think this is crazy and dangerous. its just some roles as a nurse cnas just dont undertsand or know. TELL ME WHAT YA THINK????

Specializes in Oncology.

That list of 15 things is bizarre. Any CNA should be able to do that. Feeding a patient? Good lord. That's not what LPNs should be doing. That's a CNA's job. Knowing how to feed someone doesn't make you qualified to be a nurse.

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If they met the criteria and pass the boards why not? RNs go to nursing school and get some hands on experience, but not on everything out there that they will ever do and they are aloud to practice. How much more can an LVN do than a CNA? This can be learned fairly easily.

Well I must say that I'm not very offended by this comment coming from somebody that doesn't know how to spell "allowed".... But I'd just like to say I am an LPN on a med-surg unit and I do just about everything the RNs do minus pushing cardiac drugs, initial assessments and chemo. In fact, I was chosen to be a preceptor FOR the new RNs. It depends on the facility. Im studying for my RN now, and I'm more than willing to EARN my degree just like everyone else. CNAs shouldn't be allowed to to half-fast it. If they want it bad enough they will go through the motions.

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Thats a great idea and I wish it was that way for every state. Im an LPN and went to school passed boards ect. I have to say that the correlation between what is learned in school and what is practiced out on the floor is very small. What percentage of what you learn in school is directly applicable? Not even 20%.

For that matter what is the difference between an LPN and RN curriculum? 8 MONTHS. There is no substantial difference in the complexity or breadth of the material presented.

Being exposed to the hospital environment for numerous consecutive years is adequate preparation for what we do as LPNs in the state of Illinois.

That save the public **** is just what people who went through the ropes say to

1. Secure job opportunities by excluding others from the profession.

2. Keep their pay high by excluding others from the profession.

3. Make other people suffer through it just cause they did.

MOST OF WHAT YOU LEARN AS A NURSE IS ON THE JOB THROUGH YEARS OF EXPERIENCE, NOT FROM BOOKS.

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Specializes in Med/Surg.

When I went from CNA to LPN it was a huge difference, and when I started working at a hospital that was a HUGE difference from what I learned in school.

So I would hope this is not true without superb clinical experience for the challengers.

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I have to laugh at the irony here because of all states.....California?

The state that started the whole uproar over Excelsior?

So to keep consistent with CA's stringent requirements to become a nurse, instead of following Excelsior's model, the LVN's wanting to become RN's, much like the CNA's becoming LVN's, should instead simply plug away at their LVN jobs putting in their "paid time" for 51 months in the right clinical areas, take a pharm class, then sit for the NCLEX-RN.

I really found it odd to see the list of other specialty areas that could be simply substituted for med/surg nursing like outpatient clinic, psych, and OR.

OR and med/surg nursing experience have almost nothing in common and are hardly interchangeable in any way.

If all of these areas could be substituted for med/surg clinical experience, then why not let all nursing students in CA skip their med/surg rotations and just let them do clinicals wherever they want like OR, psych, outpatient, etc.

After all, CA loves to rant and rave over everything being "substantially equivalent" in nursing education, particularly with regard to clinical experiences.

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Specializes in Psych, EMS.

In my humble opinion, a lot of nursing is on the job training. I respectfully disagree with those that believe critical thinking is taught in nursing school. I think that critical thinking is the result of knowledge repotroir, attentiveness, experience, and particularly god-given intelligence. It is up to you to apply the knowledge learned in nursing school and modify it to accomodate unusual situations and emergencies. Getting back on topic..since I find nursing to be heavy OJT I don't have a particular problem with CNAs challenging the LPN boards.

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Specializes in LTC, HH, clinic.

:eek:

Thats a great idea and I wish it was that way for every state. Im an LPN and went to school passed boards ect. I have to say that the correlation between what is learned in school and what is practiced out on the floor is very small. What percentage of what you learn in school is directly applicable? Not even 20%.

For that matter what is the difference between an LPN and RN curriculum? 8 MONTHS. There is no substantial difference in the complexity or breadth of the material presented.

Being exposed to the hospital environment for numerous consecutive years is adequate preparation for what we do as LPNs in the state of Illinois.

That save the public **** is just what people who went through the ropes say to

1. Secure job opportunities by excluding others from the profession.

2. Keep their pay high by excluding others from the profession.

3. Make other people suffer through it just cause they did.

MOST OF WHAT YOU LEARN AS A NURSE IS ON THE JOB THROUGH YEARS OF EXPERIENCE, NOT FROM BOOKS.

:eek:

I have a problem with this statement as a whole, though parts may be true. I would like to say that I started as a CNA for about 5 years, went to school for my LPN worked for 13 years as an LPN before finally deciding to get my RN. I got good grades in school, and feel that I am a fast thinker, but in NO WAY do I think "challenging" a board exam is a substitute for foundational learning! You have to have the basics to be able to critically apply what you know. The difference between an LPN and an RN is 8 months of critical thinking, increased knowledge of pathophysiology, pharmacology, patient education, community health, and more acute care experience! If you haven't done the extra 8 months of schooling you can't really say there " is no substantial difference in the complexity or breadth of the material presented. " That is a false statement and insulting as well!

That would be like saying a surgical tech could become a general surgeon after 10 years on the job. Can you honestly think that working as a CNA is "close enough" to an LPN, or a surgical tech is "close enough" to a surgeon to perform on you? Not this girl! And I have worked every aspect of the nursing profession from CNA to RN, each level has it's similarities and differences. Respect it for what it is, and earn the next step as it should be earned. Short cuts are not a good idea for sound patient care. *stepping down from the soap box*:twocents:

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How can anyone without a nursing license ever get the required nursing experience required? If they don't have a license, they can't work as a nurse in the US.

Perhaps this policy (assuming it's in effect) is geared towards nurses from other countries who have several years of documented inpatient acute care bedside med/surg nursing experience.

Anyone have more insight?

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I was able to substitute a substantial amount of my BSN education in lieu of some of the paid bedside experience in order to gain my LVN license in this manner. I was just as qualified as any other person who had completed at least 50% of an RN program. As a matter of fact, I was shy eight weeks of graduating from the BSN program, so I believe it was justifiable to be able to transfer this nursing education to obtaining an LVN license. The education only partly went to waste. I have only worked with perhaps three CNAs that I would consider capable of being good off the starting block nurses. One of them is already of RN caliber. Not every CNA you meet should be allowed to do this option. There should be some kind of yay/nay check and balance by a qualified, licensed person to prevent a doozy from becoming licensed. JMO

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Specializes in Peds/outpatient FP,derm,allergy/private duty.

Interesting- I had no idea California had that system for CNAs. Never have known a single person that worked that way to the LVN. "Bedside experience" doing what? I can see why California is the only state to offer it. I think the difference between a CNA and an LVN/LPN is quite a bit more than between the LVN and RN. I say that because I view the difference as a way of thinking. To me, that's what makes you a nurse.

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Interesting- I had no idea California had that system for CNAs. Never have known a single person that worked that way to the LVN. "Bedside experience" doing what? I can see why California is the only state to offer it. I think the difference between a CNA and an LVN/LPN is quite a bit more than between the LVN and RN. I say that because I view the difference as a way of thinking. To me, that's what makes you a nurse.

California being the only state to offer this option is nothing but pure irony considering that they are the state that started the big stink about people getting their RN degree via Excelsior in the first place. They are also the only state to offer the "30 unit option" for LVN's to get their RN. These candidiates would have no degree or diploma upon completion, but would have an RN license that no other state will recognize as valid RN credentials.

Way to go CA in your fight to keep the public safe from incompetent health professionals while granting LVN licenses to people who have simply put in their years taking vitals, bathing, checking blood sugars, etc.

This is not to over simplify or downplay the role of the CNA as it is a stressful and very important role in healthcare. They are often the person who has the most patient contact and can often detect when something is not right with their patients.

But simply putting in your time in one role does not necessarily make you competent or safe to move up to the next.

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Specializes in Gerontology, nursing education.
I think LPNs that have been CNAs really need to answer this one....sorry, but I think it is the establishment attempting to further dumb down nursing. What happened to nursing as a profession?

I don't think this is anything new. Thirty years ago I knew a nursing assistant in Minnesota (these were the days before nursing assistants needed to be certified or even listed on a registry) who challenged the LPN boards and was working as the night charge in a LTC facility. The DON remarked that she put the LPN on nights because she figured she could do the "least amount of harm" on that shift. :eek:

This practice is utterly, completely wrong, particularly now when care has become much more complicated than in the past. A CNA who is competent enough to challenge NCLEX-PN should be competent enough to get through a practical nursing program.

Additionally, with the difficulties that new graduates, practical/vocational nurses and registered nurses alike, are having finding jobs, it makes zero sense to permit someone without the benefit of formal education to challenge NCLEX and try to seek employment as a nurse.

ETA: Just realized that this thread is almost a year old! Talk about being late to the party! :D

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