Calling in Sick

ADN 2002 · May 16, 2006

We have to call in to the house supervisor -- all but one of them asks why and most of them try to talk you into coming in anyway. The one that doesn't ask says it's a HIPAA violation.

michelLPN · May 16, 2006

I know how u feel. I hardly ever call in sick sometimes i go even if i feel like s**t. The other day got into a car accident 4 hours before i was supposed to go to work. I called in told them what happened told them i was in pain and i had no transportation. They still had the nerve to tell me they had no one to cover my shift and that i had to try to show up!! needless to say I didn't go.

Beary-nice · May 16, 2006

The reason why they ask is that it discourages people from calling in if they feel they have to 'justify' it.
If they said, "feel better!" and hung up and made it a cheery, easy thing, then it would be 'easy' to call in. It doesn't make sense, from management's perspective, to make it 'easy'.
So asking why is a 'gut check' for you. Are you sick enough to answer that question?
As far as being forced to seek medical treatment in order to call in: that cannot be legal. Your employer cannot force you to seek medical treatment, cannot then force you to pay a portion of a hospital mandated procedure. -- in order to use 'sick leave'.
THAT would be a bigger violation of HIPAA than asking what is wrong.
Simply put, sick leave is a function of hospital/facility HR policies. They cannot make you do more than what is written in POLICY; and they would not add to policy a directive such as requiring treatment/co-pays to call in sick.
Why would they not write that into the policy? Because it would invite legal action. See, employers are not required to provide paid sick leave, but many do, because it is a benefit that most people look to find with an employer. ONCE THEY DO offer sick leave, they have to do so in a 'fair' and equal manner.
Simply put, if they OFFER paid sick leave, yet make actually using that leave more costly than unpaid leave: they have, in effect, misrepresented a benefit and could suffer from legal recourse.
So, the first thing I would ask is to see the policy. If it isn't there, it isn't required behavior. If it IS there, and its implementation costs ANY employee more than they would make by working the shift, then it becomes MORE punitive than UNPAID sick time. At that point, FMLA act of 1993 comes into play.
It's illegal to make people PAY to call out sick. Employers don't have to pay you to be out; but they cannot make it more costly then 'unpaid' leave because unpaid leave IS protected by Federal Law.
~faith,
Timothy.

Very well said Timothy, as always when I read your responses. Thank you for reinforcing that what is being done on my floor is not right. I am so surprised that no one says anything but like I said, we tend to sit with our heads in the sand. I will be looking for this so called policy in black and white, this thread has sparked my interest into doing that. This was a recent change on our floor, one of many. It was presented at a staff meeting twice and management stands there and says "Per new floor policy, the supr has the authority to send you to the ER/Employee health to determine your illness...blah blah blah and you will pay a portion blah, blah, blah." Now that I think of it, I never remember being handed anything in black and white about this.

This is why I like this forum because it makes me think about what is actually happening and should or should I not put up with it. It helps pull my head out of the sand! Thanks friends!

RN4NICU, LPN, LVN · May 17, 2006

I now have a better understanding why it's frowned upon to ask the reason for calling in---HIPPA--it just didn't seem to apply to employees much 15 or so yrs ago when I was working LTC. It was pretty much a rule set by our DNS that as nsg supervisors, we needed todocument the reason for the call-in, and oftentimes suggest medical interventions(Pepto Bismol) and then a suggestion for the person "to come in anyway." !!!!!

Sounds like the DNS was instructing you to practice medicine without a license to me.

KyPinkRN · May 17, 2006

Okay, I don't complain loudly, I grumble under my breathe and frown alot. It doesn't do any good to complain anyway. We are so short that the staff that call off consistently are never done anything to.
I totally understand when self, kids or family really are sick or the weather is really bad and it isn't safe to drive, but to just call off b/c you don't feel like working today you'd rather go to the bar and drink is a completely different matter. ( I saw another nurse who I knew was supposed to be at work that night going into a bar. When I got to work I was told she called off. After work, I was having a beer with my bf at same bar and she was getting trashed.) That really :angryfire b/c then I end up having at the very least a third more work to do, and I already have thirty-two residents to care for as it is. So, at this point it would be a blessing if the individuals left and didn't come back. Then maybe we could hire some people who would come to work as they were contracted.

:idea:

I say next time you see said coworker heading off to the bar instead of going to work you tell your sup. These things do add up and people who call off frequently eventually hang themselves. Hang in there and remember you will still have your job and she may not. :lol2:

barbyann · May 17, 2006

True story......A few winters ago I was getting ready at home for my 12hr shift (7p-7a). My last thing to do was get my uniform out of the dryer in the basement. I opened the basement door and a cloud of black smoke entered my home. The fire alarm was going off like crazy. I grabbed my young son and the dog and put them in the car (it was winter and very cold). I called 911 and then called the Nursing Supervisor and told her my house was on fire. Her response...no lie..."you can't call out this close to your shift" I said, crying, "My house is on fire, can't you hear the sirens?"...at this point the firemen were pulling hoses into my basement. Her next response "Oh, Ok, but be sure you are here by 11pm I can't find coverage for the overnight" I promised to call her back. End of story, my house was condemed (furnace fire), I called her back and told her I now had to find a place to live, her comment "Well, OK but be sure your here for your shift tomorrow". Isn't nursing grand!

That experience taught me a lot about what's important. ME & FAMILY come first, always. I now realize how crazy this whole nursing/healthcare business is. Why can't we make nursing a sensible occupation?

jaylynn67 · May 17, 2006

I work at a law firm and you would not believe the detail we have to have when we call in sick. The next day, our manager comes over to us and needs to know all of our symptoms, what we are taking for it, etc. It is so annoying!! We have to speak directly to our manager,when we call in NO EXCEPTIONS! Im glad to read some of these posts, i look forward to the entire office not knowing what is wrong with me any time i call in, even though we have 12 sick days a year.

HM2VikingRN, RN · May 17, 2006

At my employer its sick contagious/non contagious.

jenmlee · May 17, 2006

At my facility, all we have to do is say we are ill and won't be in now questions asked. If we are really sick and will need/call in several days in a row the policy states we need a Dr.'s note.

cardsRN · May 17, 2006

what about this- my time is my time and my work has no right to ask me how i'm using it. esp in hospitals like mine with earned time. i've worked for that time! it's already mine! it is my sick/personal/vaca... none of your business! in institutions where they have set aside "sick" days, apparently the # of days you are granted is the # of days your employer feels it is reasonable for an employee to be out ill per year.

we call to our floor and speak with another RN who has to page house supervisor and let them know (so she can then say sorry- there's no float for you!). often people will give a reason. i have and i have not. when taking a sick call though, i just tell people "feel better" and "see ya when i see ya!" it isn't my business, and it isn't my responsability to chase people down and shame them for using their time that they have either earned or been promised in a package of benefits.

does it leave us short? you bet. but as long as we keep martyring ourselves and working while ill or having a big taboo about taking personal days the culture that expects nurses to be unreasonably self-sacrificing will never change.

me and my family come first. if i bend myself out of shape to do the hospital favors, the only one who will remember it is my son who will remember that i wasn't there for him!

TiffyRN, BSN, PhD · May 17, 2006

Asking for a reason won't scare me off, I've worked in hospitals too long and I figure I've worked with excruciating migraines (or other problems) too many times so if I feel the least bit off I've earned the right to stay home.

I don't believe asking for a reason will help with absenteeism. I believe the policy where I work does. They strictly enforce a point system, at so many points you are counseled, at so many points, put on probation, then a disciplinary suspension followed by termination. I have always seemed to have too many "points" though never enough to be suspended. You can also "work off" points by working overtime shifts. Many employers have a program like this in place but many don't enforce it or don't enforce it until they are tired of a certain employee that abuses things.

Thankfully I recently discovered intermittent FMLA. Basically if you have a chronic recurring condition (example; asthma, migraines, back pain) you can apply and receive this. Then you can call in for so many shifts a year (rolling calendar) without accumulating points. Unfortunately you cannot collect PTO for those shifts, but that just means I'll have to have to use my PTO for vacation time instead. Fortunately my husband and I don't work paycheck to paycheck so that's not a big deal.

And about the HIPAA thing; I'm not sure that applies. Our employers have much of our health history and not everything is protected; think TB status, immune status (as in chickenpox, measles, not HIV status). They don't get to know all of our health history but some information is needed as protection for our patients. I work NICU and you are strictly forbidden to be in the unit with any fever >100.0 F, infections, cold sores, etc. . .

General E. Speaking, RN, RN · May 17, 2006

my coworker recently challenged the house supervisor when she was asked why she was calling in sick. She said point blank "It's none of your business- I'm sick." It was referred to HR and nothing ever came of it.