Bullied as a kinda new nurse

[allyyy]

I feel like I’m being bullied by the nurses on the floor that I’m orienting on. I’m a quiet person who does work quietly and thinks in my head. I only have barely a year of rehab/LTC experience so this acute setting feels pretty new. So I’m not the kind of person to go running around yelling out all of my patients problems. I read, I think, ask many questions and keep moving. I'm now being followed by the educator over an accusation of "not knowing why the patient is getting the med". I had a meeting today with my manager, supervisor, and educator and I felt like that came out of nowhere and I was completely shocked. And my preceptor was there and I felt like I couldn't say anything because I know that she said something. But I've never given the wrong patient the wrong med and I always look up meds I don't know and I always look up the doctors notes. I made an appointment to to see where that came from with only my manager, so we’ll see how that’s goes. Overall, My preceptor and I are butting heads. I feel like I'm not learning anything important from her. She proceeds on telling me things that I already know and I try to switch the topic up but then she gets annoyed. One time she was talking about something and I looked away to look at my computer (I like to multitask) and she bursted “LOOK AT ME” in front of everyone like I’m a child. I started tearing up after that. I was so embarrassed. And after that I feel like everyone is bullying me. And I wish I spoke up sooner about these issues. Idk. There's two sides of the story. But overall, I am hurt and offended that they think I would put my patient at risk. I've spent the last two days crying and I've already accepted that I'm probably going to be fired if I don't quit first. Idk. Idk what to do.

[myoglobin, ASN, BSN, MSN]

12 minutes ago, Gracefully Saved said:

I think you should talk to your manager about changing preceptors. This is ballsy I will admit but if you feel like she is bullying you and more importantly if you feel like you are not learning anything, then you need a change. Unfortunately nurses eat their young is not a false statement. I was traumatized my first year as an RN in a similar way. I was accused of doing something I did not, it spread around the unit and I would catch people talking about me. I never defended myself because 1. I didn’t see the point and 2. I felt like even if I did do what I was accused of, I was a knee nurse and I should have been corrected, not judged and gossiped about. This made me completely paranoid in nursing and it still effects me today. It’s hard sometimes it keep your head up and speak up for yourself.

Your story and my personal experiences causes me to ask the perpetual question of "why"? Is it that this behavior occurs in all industries and is just undereported or is their something unique to nursing that causes "bullying" and "eating their young" to be a perpetual topic in nursing?

[JKL33]

24 minutes ago, Gracefully Saved said:

I was traumatized my first year as an RN in a similar way. I was accused of doing something I did not, it spread around the unit and I would catch people talking about me. I never defended myself because 1. I didn’t see the point and 2. I felt like even if I did do what I was accused of, I was a knee nurse and I should have been corrected, not judged and gossiped about.

The point of doing something instead of nothing would have been to avoid complete paranoia and avoid still being seriously affected by this to this day. There is a difference between defending yourself by engaging in petty battle against someone's snicker, for example (waste of time), and defending yourself by stating the plain truth and expressing to someone in authority that you expect the poor treatment to stop immediately (much more likely to be effective than doing nothing).

[myoglobin, ASN, BSN, MSN]

6 minutes ago, JKL33 said:

The point of doing something instead of nothing would have been to avoid complete paranoia and avoid still being seriously affected by this to this day. There is a difference between defending yourself by engaging in petty battle against someone's snicker, for example (waste of time), and defending yourself by stating the plain truth and expressing to someone in authority that you expect the poor treatment to stop immediately (much more likely to be effective than doing nothing).

Confronting someone in authority over you is psychologically difficult. When I was being oriented I remember feeling that escalating conflict might cause me to be "targeted", and my paranoia was fed by a plethora of stories both from the hospital/unit where I worked at the time (Methodist CCU) and many stories on this website. Thus, the more attractive (but perhaps less effective route) that I went was to simply put my head down and "do my best" and try to return any negativity with as much sincere love as possible (remembering that Jesus said to love those that hate you). Given that I was forced to leave the unit and go to Med/Surg perhaps this was not the best approach.

[Gracefully Saved, ADN]

4 minutes ago, JKL33 said:

The point of doing something instead of nothing would have been to avoid complete paranoia and avoid still being seriously affected by this to this day. There is a difference between defending yourself by engaging in petty battle against someone's snicker, for example (waste of time), and defending yourself by stating the plain truth and expressing to someone in authority that you expect the poor treatment to stop immediately (much more likely to be effective than doing nothing).

Maybe this is true for you but not for me. I was a part of a 32 bed ICU. We had plenty of staff. While I made it known to the director that is all I could do. I was not going to chase down everyone who spoke I’ll about me to defend myself. This is petty I’m my eyes and useless. The damage was done and the paranoia was set.

[Gracefully Saved, ADN]

27 minutes ago, myoglobin said:

Your story and my personal experiences causes me to ask the perpetual question of "why"? Is it that this behavior occurs in all industries and is just undereported or is their something unique to nursing that causes "bullying" and "eating their young" to be a perpetual topic in nursing?

I wish I knew. In my observation I have found that a lot of nurses are obsessed with proving their competence. And I guess sometimes just coming to work and doing your job well doesn’t suffice for them. Many feel the need to put other nurses down or embarrass them to make themselves look better. Not all nurses are like this. I eventually left this hospital and the unit I am on now has wonderful nurses. It is sad when you encounter people like that but unfortunately there are plenty of them in our field.

[rnsrgr8t]

I would like to share my experience with my preceptor my first nursing job out of school. I experienced a combination of bullying but I also did not get off to a good start either with my behavior which I think exacerbated my being bullied. I was a star in nursing school. I worked as a nurse extern all throughout school. My clinical practicum was in the specialty I ended getting a job in when I graduated. I came in confident. My preceptor and I butted heads from the start. Some of it was on her but in retrospect a lot of it was on me. I heard the same comment from her that you received, I was not paying attention and looking at her when she was trying to tell me something. I thought I was doing the same thing you did- listening while I was multitasking. I was trying hard to act confident but it came across like I was not listening. I was trying to show her what I knew, she interpreted it like I was arrogant and unwilling to learn. She would tell me things I knew and instead of keeping my mouth shut, I would cut her off and tell her I knew already what she was telling me. She eventually told me the same thing your preceptor did. I need you to look at me and LISTEN. Looking back on it as a mature nurse 20 + years later. She was RIGHT.

Now on the other hand, the staff (because I was having personality conflicts with their star preceptor) took it SO far to knock me off my pedestal and take me down to a lower level. They did everything they could to humiliate me, talk about me, not help me, set me up for failure etc. I ended up leaving after a year and half after getting a serious right up questioning how I handled a specific patient situation. Caveat was, as I was navigating it, I was reviewing it with the charge nurse every step of the way. I thought I handled it well because I listened to what she told me to do and she knew everything that I did. Unfortunately I pissed off a resident and he reported me. Because of my earlier trouble, the charge nurse, when asked, lied and denied I ever asked for advice. I had no one stick up for me. I ended up being told I was not cut out to be a nurse at all. They were going to let me stay on (? really even though they did not think I should be a nurse?) but if I made ANY kind of mistake, they would fire me. They also would not let me transfer to anywhere else in the hospital. Luckily I found a job quickly after a few days outside of the hospital system and left.

I ended up having a very successful career and now been a PNP for 15 years.

Who knows how I would have done if I came in with the right attitude. How I ended up being treated was reprehensible and almost made me quit a career I loved. It did a lot of things to my psyche and confidence that still haunts me. That does not eliminate my culpability in the beginning of it. I am not saying that how I was treated in the end was right, it absolutely was not. But in the beginning, I can honestly say I was wrong.

You may be being bullied like I was in the end or your preceptor may have a valid point (like mine did initially).

When you are on orientation, best thing to do is keep your ears open, mouth shut and just listen to what you are being told. You may, in your head, be thinking I KNOW all this, but just listen. Now if you are ASKED if you know something, that is the opportunity to show your knowledge. NOT when your preceptor is trying to tell you something.

Best of luck!

[JKL33]

7 minutes ago, Gracefully Saved said:

I was not going to chase down everyone who spoke I’ll about me to defend myself. This is petty I’m my eyes and useless.

As very clearly stated already, I agree. I made no such suggestion.

9 minutes ago, myoglobin said:

Thus, the more attractive (but perhaps less effective route) that I went was to simply put my head down and "do my best" and try to return any negativity with as much sincere love as possible (remembering that Jesus said to love those that hate you).

What about the fact that doing both simultaneously is possible. One can show kindness to others and refuse to personally engage in the hateful behavior while also reporting that there is a problem and that your plan is to carry on without engaging in negativity. Having this discussion with a manger is not "confronting" them. Or, try the first thing and if inroads/progress cannot be made, then discuss it with the manager. I realize there are nuances that don't make this a fool-proof formula and also that there are generally toxic workplaces, but at the same time it's kind of problematic to be driven by a need to avoid any discomfort whatsoever even when severely disappointed with the predictable outcomes of that tack.

Avoidance behaviors are not the same thing as willfully choosing to pleasantly and confidently not engage in wrongness.

[JKL33]

31 minutes ago, Gracefully Saved said:

And I guess sometimes just coming to work and doing your job well doesn’t suffice for them.

Oftentimes, coming to work and doing one's job well isn't enough for others, namely authority figures, or else it means something different to them than it does to nurses. And that is indeed a problem involved in the larger topic of nurse behaviors.

[myoglobin, ASN, BSN, MSN]

7 minutes ago, JKL33 said:

Oftentimes, coming to work and doing one's job well isn't enough for others, namely authority figures, or else it means something different to them than it does to nurses. And that is indeed a problem involved in the larger topic of nurse behaviors.

It would be fascinating and perhaps informative to see a study comparing a large number of nurses who felt a low degree of "bullying" verses those who felt they experienced higher rates and to see if clear differences could be discovered between the hospitals, people, and behaviors that "made a difference". Perhaps if there was some sort of statistic for "first year drop out rate" of RN's that hospitals had to publish, this could be utilized by RN's as one measure in deciding where to work before they put their new careers on the line (along with things like pay/benefits which are more widely known as a rule).

[myoglobin, ASN, BSN, MSN]

Also, along the lines of "sometimes nothing is better". At my current job when I transferred to ICU (from PCU/overflow) after two years at the hospital my preceptor didn't seem to like me. According to my SO (who worked there as a nurse/charge nurse) she was expecting me to be "OCD just like her" I guess from her relatively few interactions with me when I visited my SO on the unit and when I transferred patients to her. Well, let's just say that while I am OCD in an "autistic" way I'm not in the way that she expected. It was a challenging orientation so bad that she made me finish it on days with the day shift charge nurse after she basically refused to sign off on me (who was a former Dr. from the Philippines and great to work with). Anyway, I "kept my head down" said nothing and eventually got through it. Indeed she became someone I considered a friend after many years ( and after many instances of knowing I would help her out even when busy and seeing that I was someone who didn't even take lunch breaks let alone screw around as many others on nights did). My point is that "sometimes" saying nothing may be the best thing. Other times it can be a disaster, knowing which is which is rather difficult. Part of the "issue" is that none of us are "perfect nurses" and we all tend to compensate in our own ways. I try to "compensate" for my lack of IV skills/mechanical ability and difficulty with "attention to detail" by continually reviewing my patient, my patient's data, and by always trying to help others in ways that I am strong (book stuff that you would expect from someone with a 4.0 GPA and an SAT in the 1500's, lifting patients, and generally things that require hustle). However, in the "focused" window of orientation it is sometimes difficult to illustrate these "compensations" in a meaningful way even though they come out in the "course of time". I know other nurses who won't lift a finger unless asked, but they could start an IV on a dead persons pinky and get a Dobhoff down a gagging person with minimal difficulties, that is "their" compensation and they are treated like minor nursing demigods. I think that sometimes preceptors are not inclined to appreciate the rich diversity of skills, that we bring focusing more on the deficits.

[Horseshoe, BSN, RN]

On 7/9/2019 at 8:59 AM, rnsrgr8t said:

I would like to share my experience with my preceptor my first nursing job out of school. I experienced a combination of bullying but I also did not get off to a good start either with my behavior which I think exacerbated my being bullied. I was a star in nursing school. I worked as a nurse extern all throughout school. My clinical practicum was in the specialty I ended getting a job in when I graduated. I came in confident. My preceptor and I butted heads from the start. Some of it was on her but in retrospect a lot of it was on me. I heard the same comment from her that you received, I was not paying attention and looking at her when she was trying to tell me something. I thought I was doing the same thing you did- listening while I was multitasking. I was trying hard to act confident but it came across like I was not listening. I was trying to show her what I knew, she interpreted it like I was arrogant and unwilling to learn. She would tell me things I knew and instead of keeping my mouth shut, I would cut her off and tell her I knew already what she was telling me. She eventually told me the same thing your preceptor did. I need you to look at me and LISTEN. Looking back on it as a mature nurse 20 + years later. She was RIGHT.

Now on the other hand, the staff (because I was having personality conflicts with their star preceptor) took it SO far to knock me off my pedestal and take me down to a lower level. They did everything they could to humiliate me, talk about me, not help me, set me up for failure etc. I ended up leaving after a year and half after getting a serious right up questioning how I handled a specific patient situation. Caveat was, as I was navigating it, I was reviewing it with the charge nurse every step of the way. I thought I handled it well because I listened to what she told me to do and she knew everything that I did. Unfortunately I pissed off a resident and he reported me. Because of my earlier trouble, the charge nurse, when asked, lied and denied I ever asked for advice. I had no one stick up for me. I ended up being told I was not cut out to be a nurse at all. They were going to let me stay on (? really even though they did not think I should be a nurse?) but if I made ANY kind of mistake, they would fire me. They also would not let me transfer to anywhere else in the hospital. Luckily I found a job quickly after a few days outside of the hospital system and left.

I ended up having a very successful career and now been a PNP for 15 years.

Who knows how I would have done if I came in with the right attitude. How I ended up being treated was reprehensible and almost made me quit a career I loved. It did a lot of things to my psyche and confidence that still haunts me. That does not eliminate my culpability in the beginning of it. I am not saying that how I was treated in the end was right, it absolutely was not. But in the beginning, I can honestly say I was wrong.

You may be being bullied like I was in the end or your preceptor may have a valid point (like mine did initially).

When you are on orientation, best thing to do is keep your ears open, mouth shut and just listen to what you are being told. You may, in your head, be thinking I KNOW all this, but just listen. Now if you are ASKED if you know something, that is the opportunity to show your knowledge. NOT when your preceptor is trying to tell you something.

Best of luck!

Honestly, you sound like you were a real piece of work when you first started.

Glad you evolved into a better version of yourself and I commend you on your personal insight and eventual willingness to take some responsibility for what followed after you arrived on the unit with your new license.

[workinmomRN2012, BSN]

On 7/2/2019 at 11:49 PM, allyyy said:

One time she was talking about something and I looked away to look at my computer (I like to multitask) and she bursted “LOOK AT ME” in front of everyone like I’m a child.

This nurse has already decided how she is going to interact with you judging by this statement. I would ask to be changed to another preceptor, who knows this could be her first time precepting someone and the manager could be trying to teach her how to precept. I've had that happen to me, when I went to complain about how I was being oriented by this nurse the manager said that the reason that I was paired with her was because i was already a nurse for a few years and she thought that it would be easier on this nurse who had never precepted anyone before.

As far as everyone on here (AN) saying that not looking at her when she is talking to you is rude, well I would have to say that what she did by yelling at you in front of everyone far out weighs you looking at the computer.

I have found that bully behavior does exist but you will be hard pressed to get anyone to agree with you on this site! Some people will sympathize but ultimately will find fault with whatever you are doing. The nurses that are precepting should know better than a new nurse and if they dont, they should be called out on it...its BULLYING!!!