Are my pts "brain dead"?

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I apologize if I am sounding stupid now,but I am just curious. We have all heard about the case in California with the 13 yr old,and how she is brain dead. Of course,she is on a vent,and the family wants her to get a trach and gtube.

I have several pts that are "unresponsive" meaning they don't talk, blink their eyes, nothing, no purposeful movement, nothing. All but one is on a vent, and all have trach and gt. At least one doesn't even use a gtube. She has been on Tpn for 1.5 years now for all her nutritional needs. One boy is a Dnr order, but with the understanding that we are to rescucitate him using the Ambubag, but if his heart stops, we do nothing. (I haven't seen a Dnr order like that before, and this is the first one I've seen like that)

It also says "at parents discretion", meaning that they could change their minds and make us do chest compressions. (according to nursing supervisor). This same boy had an EEG,and it shows no activity.

Anyway,I'm not seeing the big issue with the California case as I have several kids with vents, trach, and gtubes that are well...I'm not saying the words.

I did PDN for 18 months, but still managed to have plenty of nursing contacts outside of the PDN world. I'm not trying to be mean, but you're really doing yourself a disservice by not net-working beyond your "specialty". There's a whole big world beyond the bedroom of the clients that you're currently caring for, don't limit yourself to just what's happening inside that one room. Besides, if you ever want to leave PDN, it's helpful to have contacts who might have an "in" with other facilities =)
Well,bieng that Pdn doesn't pay well,I have 2 work 80 hrs a week,and that varies as pts come in and out of the hospital. One week I could work 80,the next 20. The times are unpredictable.Netowrk how? Most times,its me coming and going without seeing another nurse. Supervisors come 9nce a yr to see me,if that . Most usually just check off on the skills,I mail it,and send it back,since I've been there so long.As I said,you would be surprised.One nurse told me she only used 2 liters of 02 to amubag a kid that had an o2 sat of 10 because we didn't have an order for 10L of 02.The subject of brain death didn't have an direct impact on me,meaning that it didn't have an impact on me saving a crashing pt or not;it was not matter of life or death in these instances.Anyway,a nurse who wrote on this topic last yr said Nj doesn't care about the time frame,as long as you have the required CEU's before you renew your license,you are fine.That poster asked the board directly.
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Networking how?99% of the Pdn nurses are also only working PDN(At least the ones I know).I did network,which is how I found the second agency.I am just grateful to have a job I really like.What's wrong with working Pdn? We have skiils other specialties don't.Also,you do REALIZE there is a RECESSION going on,right?I do think you are being....telling me to network under these circumstances.As if jobs are plentiful.....geezers.I do hope you know private duty isn't limited to the bedroom,as we also have school cases.

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Errrr I'm so sick of this guy already."DR. PAUL BYRNE" is a pediatrician. He is not a neurologist, therefore has no weight in this case except for adding to the family's hope by stating Jahi is ALIVE. He's already been discredited for this case, he is of no use. He has his own motives, he is catholic and is basing his knowledge off of his beliefs.I find nothing that he is saying 'interesting'."The ventilator won't work on a corpse," he said. "In a corpse, the ventilator pushes the air in, but it won't come out. Just the living person pushes the air out."Anyone????
What's wrong with basing something off his religious beliefs?I know you guys won't know it,but I'm getting private Private messages refuting what some of you are saying.Some
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Specializes in Pediatrics, Emergency, Trauma.
What's wrong with basing something off his religious beliefs?

Because as health professionals, we deal with EBM, not personal/religious/political beliefs; doing so is going against ethical practice and risks harming our patients.

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Specializes in Pedi.
What's wrong with basing something off his religious beliefs?I know you guys won't know it,but I'm getting private Private messages refuting what some of you are saying.Some

Nothing's wrong with it, in his personal life. Professionally, there are established guidelines and laws to abide by. He has an agenda. He doesn't believe in brain death. He is also not qualified to speak on this case. He is a neonatologist, not a neurologist. He is not licensed in the state of California so practically and legally, his opinion means no more than that of Joe Plumber.

Refuting what, exactly? You opened the door...

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Specializes in HH, Peds, Rehab, Clinical.

I don't know what to tell you then. ANY suggestion anyone has offered to you has been responded to with disdain and defensiveness. I'm sorry you're finding PDN work to be so low-paying, I can honestly tell you that my agency paid us extremely well, the best pay I've ever received as an RN in fact. Do you not keep in contact with anyone you went to nursing school with? You know of no other nurses in your neighborhood or parents of children you may have? Have you done any online researching of area nursing communities?

I never said there was anything wrong with working PDN, I did it for 18 months and wouldn't have lasted 18 days if I didn't like it. At this point I have to choose to stop responding directly to your posts, for my own sanity. Clearly, I have nothing to offer you that agrees with you. Best of luck in your journey to learn more about the little ones who's very lives may depend on what you know about their medical situation. Best of luck in obtaining your required CEU's without the pressure of having to cram them in because of the very real possibility that your state BON is going to ask for proof that you've completed them. Best of luck in everything you do, including wallowing and lamenting in the fact that you are "stuck" in such an unpredictable and low paying job market. I respectfully bow out.

Networking how?99% of the Pdn nurses are also only working PDN(At least the ones I know).I did network,which is how I found the second agency.I am just grateful to have a job I really like.What's wrong with working Pdn? We have skiils other specialties don't.Also,you do REALIZE there is a RECESSION going on,right?I do think you are being....telling me to network under these circumstances.As if jobs are plentiful.....geezers.I do hope you know private duty isn't limited to the bedroom,as we also have school cases.
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I have learned alot from this post. I love all the knowledge y'all have. I will say that this thread seems like a rollercoaster at times. Phew! I keep getting back on. ;-)

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If people are refuting what has been said here, these FACTS, they should have the cojones to post it here.

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Specializes in Critical Care, ED, Cath lab, CTPAC,Trauma.
What's wrong with basing something off his religious beliefs?I know you guys won't know it,but I'm getting private Private messages refuting what some of you are saying.Some
I don't mind that you are getting private messages refuting what is being said. I would hope that a professional nurse would be able to post publicly but if they so choose to do so privately that's fine. Power to them.

This is one of those ethical debates that will not go away and for any students out there these are good ethical topics with a plethora of information for you.

Dr. Byrne is perfectly able to base his practice on his beliefs....although I don't believe her practices anymore. The problem is that he can advocate against brain death but it doesn't change the fact that it is contrary to ALL standard medical practice and one's opinion doesn't change the fact that these poor unfortunate people are suffering needlessly because medicine has interfered with God's will. Without man interference these patients would die according to God's will instead of being kept "alive" with man's medicine. I don't see him offering to care for Jahi for all his opinions he has about her being alive.

There are worse things than death.

Each nurse needs to make her own decision. Working in critical care, seeing the torture first hand, makes this decision easy for me.

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Specializes in Primary Care, OR.
What's wrong with basing something off his religious beliefs?I know you guys won't know it,but I'm getting private Private messages refuting what some of you are saying.Some
Well darn it seems I'm late to the party..... For all the reasons stated above^.How can you advocate for your patient when your own personal beliefs are clouding your professional judgement and well established EBP......
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I did very early,when starting out as a new grad,turn down a job with Planned Parenthood.It was for "religious reasons".I knwo for sure I would have told women the "bad" of getting abortions. I don't think I would have been fair

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Specializes in Pediatrics, Emergency, Trauma.
I did very earlywhen starting out as a new grad,turn down a job with Planned Parenthood.It was for "religious reasons".I knwo for sure I would have told women the "bad" of getting abortions. I don't think I would have been fair[/quote']

So, in your own words, to be clear, you turned down a job because of your personal beliefs, and YOU state "I would have not been fair" to your patients; so WHY would you THINK that when an "expert" who is NOT know and has NO expertise in a EBM view is giving "expertise" based on a "personal belief" is FAIR?

I am curious.

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