Another reason unions suck!

[Ruger8mm]

Trying to get a vacation as a new RN under a union regime is challenging at best. It's all seniority based. So the senior RNs can basically come and go as they choose. But that means the rest of us cannot be off (even though we don't cover each other or know each other's job). Also the silly union made a rule that managers cannot approve vacations to far out. So if someone knows they want a certain week 2 years from now, they cannot secure it and start booking flights or whatever. It's irritating at best.

[paddyk]

There are a large number of people who have commented are anti-union. I understand that and know that some unions are better than others without doubt.

The union to which I belong is not perfect either but they do a whole lot of good, even iof some people cannot see that fact. They advocate for safe working practices, violence policies, safe patient care, nurse patient ratios, wages, benefits such as maternity, paternity and extended health, rotations. They represent members at disiplinary meetings, meetings about sickness, displacement and many other forms of representation. Yes, vacation is seniority based and people do get disappointed but not too often. Union meetings are salary reimbursed and travelling to the meetings is covered as well. At the meetings, they will often fund raise for a local charity such as autism, woman's shelter, homeless shelter or the food bank.

They are often in the media, commenting upon violence in the work place, staffing levels, skill mix, displacement, "hallway nursing" (if you don't know, this is where a unit or department like ER is so over capacity that patients have to nursed in hallways or converted closets or even bathrooms).

That all having been said, have you considered what life would be like if there were no unions or similar organizations? There would be no minimum wage, no safety practices, no OSHA, no shift scheduling, no limit on hours worked, no whistleblower protection, no equal pay for men and women nurses, no maternity benefits, no paid vacation - probably no vacation, no self shielding needles, no anti-violence policies, no time for familes or friendships or courting, no minimum work age. No union driven research into staff sickness levels/burn out/mental health. No injury at work insurance, no pension, no benefits and so much more (or less?)

While I agree with the OP that some things the unions do are disagreeable, but I need to look at the bigger picture - what benefits the majority, not the individual. It is human nature to think of oneself and sometimes as nurses we do NOT think of ourselves enough - going on break and just stopping to give a bedpan, working a few minutes after shift and not claiming it (unpaid overtime), attending educational events in our own time and paying for them ourselves, coming to work sick, not addressing our own mental welfare.

A good union will look out for the welfare of as many members as possible. Mostly all will benefit, a few will take advantage and a few may detriment buit the vast majority will benefit. That is why I think that unions are not all bad - although some examples given by other posters indicate that all unions are not equal.

I am very lucky being in BC, Canada - come and work here!

[Farawyn]

I so agree with you there! Great point, btw! LOL

Thank you. :)

[Dogen]

I am glad that I do not work at a union job. I am very liberal, but I am not pro union. In most peoples eyes, that does not make sense. I think that they had there place in history, but not sure if they are relevent today. I hear very little positive comments from the nurses that I know who work a union job. They do seem to pay more, but is it worth all of the hassle. I applied for a job that was union, and I was told on the interview that during the probationary period, the other workers would make it very hard on me to be sure that I was a good worker. Once hired, it was nearly impossible to be fired. this sounds terrible to me. So, you would be stuck working with the same people, and if they were bad workers, you knew they would not be fired. Luckily, I did not take the job. My current boss used to work at a union job in Occ health. She states that she felt powerless because every nursing decision that she made had to go througn the union (non-nurses).

Thankfully, I've never had this experience in the union hospitals where I've worked. Unions negotiate contracts based on the needs of the voting members at each facility, so to some extent they tend to reflect the culture of the (active) union members at those hospitals. Unions don't cause ****** coworkers. Terrible coworkers, on the other hand, can cause terrible contracts. If the environment of your hospital is bad, blame the terrible people. Blame the management that hasn't focused on improving culture by taking whatever steps the contract lays out for firing terrible people. The union is a tool that can be used by good people and bad people. That's not really a reason to take the tool away from good people (getting rid of the union). Then you're just left with your existing poor management making decisions, when they already can't be bothered to fire terrible people because it's too hard (wah). It IS a reason for good people to be more involved in regulating their environment (by being active in the union or by leaving).

[PMFB-RN, RN]

It's nothing like that at all in our union hospital. Our union doesn't support dirt bags who don't do their job. New people are supported and encouraged, we are not hard on them.

It's certainly not nearly impossible to get fired. People who do bad things or don't do their jobs get fired.

I would also point out that in our hospital there are certain offences that will get you instantly fired and the union won't touch you or help you once it's been determined that the offence actually happened.

Some of those things are:

Stealing drugs

Working impaired by drugs or alcohol

Failure to maintain an active license

Assaulting other staff or patients (this applies to physicians too, Ya!)

Using hospital computers to download or look at Media (really if you need Media so much that you can't wait until you are off duty then you are not the kind of person I want to work with anyway).

Sexually assaulting staff or patients.

Theft of hospital or patient property

We do have a drug and alcohol amnesty program where if you come forward and declare that you have a problem BEFORE getting caught working impaired, or stealing drugs from patients, you won't be fired and will get help getting off drugs or alcohol.

[Farawyn]

I would also point out that in our hospital there are certain offences that will get you instantly fired and the union won't touch you or help you once it's been determined that the offence actually happened.

Some of those things are:

Stealing drugs

Working impaired by drugs or alcohol

Failure to maintain an active license

Assaulting other staff or patients (this applies to physicians too, Ya!)

Using hospital computers to download or look at Media (really if you need Media so much that you can't wait until you are off duty then you are not the kind of person I want to work with anyway).

Sexually assaulting staff or patients.

Theft of hospital or patient property

We do have a drug and alcohol amnesty program where if you come forward and declare that you have a problem BEFORE getting caught working impaired, or stealing drugs from patients, you won't be fired and will get help getting off drugs or alcohol.

So, if a fitness for duty is done and the employee is high and decides to go into treatment that day, it's still a no go?

[PMFB-RN, RN]

So, if a fitness for duty is done and the employee is high and decides to go into treatment that day, it's still a no go?

It depends on if they were caught, and what they were doing when caught or if they turned themselves in.

I am aware of one RN who appeared drunk in report and the supervisor was called. As the RN had not actually taken care of patients while impaired she was offered rehab and accepted it.

[canigraduate]

Not sure how you guys can say there isn't a shortage when data indicates there will be an excessive shortage in a number of years. Not to mention major facilities out there have hundreds of open positions.

**facepalm** Did you even read what you wrote?

How can you say there ISN'T a shortage when data indicates there WILL BE IN A NUMBER OF YEARS?

So, there is a shortage, or there will be a shortage? Can't have both at the same time.

There is a shortage of nurses in my unit because my dumbase director won't hire anyone to fill the open slots. We've had 3 managers and well over a dozen staff leave in the last 4 months and have hired 3 new grads. Three new grads can't replace 15 staffmembers.

The only reason there may be a nursing shortage is because the facilities are shorting staff on purpose. There's plenty of nurses, but no one is hiring them. They keep the open slots on the books for budget reasons.

The media can talk until they're blue in the face about a future nursing shortage, but the way facilities are cutting staff, I don't believe it.

There's a MANUFACTURED nursing shortage, not a lack of nurses.

[Thunderwolf, MSN, RN]

Non-union hospitals in my experience tend to globally run under the dictum of "Don't like it, then leave."

Union hospitals tend to globally run under the dictum of "Don't like it, then change it."

For most of my 30 years of nursing, it has been in non-union hospitals.

I now work in a union hospital. I am going on my 9th year.

You couldn't have me return to a non-union hospital again.

Believe me, unions DO...STILL...have their place.

[windsurfer8, BSN, RN]

Then quit and do something else. No one is forcing you to work in a hospital. My union got my patient ration down to a manageable level and I make more money. Power in numbers and I love it. My pay is awesome..I get time off. ..I guess you would refer to me as "filth"? (Army vet worked since age 14. Pay my taxes and love my country).

[mcintsof]

Good luck with that. Too funny. Have you researched the history of unions and what they fight for??? Obviously not. Do your research. Complacency is the worst response. You are the union so quit talking about yourselves so negatively and get to work making your workplace safer and more patient focussed.

[wolf9653]

I'm following on another topic a nurse that moved into a very prejudiced town with a very prejudiced hospital and has been having issues. They also are a new nurse. to me, it's a formula for disaster. I couldn't help but think if she only had a union.

[becksterc]

Amen. You only have to be fired as an at-will employee once to appreciate the good the unions do.