Young, Thin, and Cute New Hires - page 3

My workplace, a freestanding specialty hospital owned by a for-profit corporation that operates multiple facilities across the United States, has been having recent troubles with low Press Ganey... Read More

  1. Visit  imintrouble profile page
    12
    The light bulb went on when I was in my 40s. I remember exactly where I was when I figured out this getting old thing was going to stink.
    I was waiting at an ice cream counter with my sister (also 40s). You know, where there's no definite line, and you have to rely on the person behind the counter to take orders fairly. When I was obviously next in line, the man behind the counter addressed the attractive young woman behind me, and ignored me as if I didn't exist. I remember my outrage and resentment towards the man and the blameless young woman.
    Only I didn't really view her as blameless. She took my place in line knowing it wasn't her turn. She ignored me too.
    While nursing isn't an ice cream counter, and we don't take turns, the same dynamic happens in my job. I think the only people who would argue that are either young or in management.
    Ageism is everywhere. It's not exclusive to nursing. We live in a society where you're measured by how you look, and not by what you know.
    Psychtrish39, tnmarie, Mollypita, and 9 others like this.
  2. Visit  HouTx profile page
    20
    AAARRRRGGGGHHHHHHHH!!! <sorry, had to get that out of my system>

    Why is fallacious reasoning becoming so commonplace? Where is some critical thinking in all this rhetoric?

    Increased age does NOT automatically result in expertise. I have encountered way too many 'experienced' nurses that are barely squeeking by (competence-wise). Proficient & highly expert people got that way by learning from their experiences... but this is a deliberate process, and some people are just not capable of this type of learning. Honestly, just published research has validated this - differences are due to the way our brains are wired.

    So - let's all just stop this bandwagon with competing poles of age, attractiveness, religion, political stance or whatever other demographic groups are wading in to say that they are "the best". Just Stop It! This has no basis in reality and promotes divisiveness among us when we should be promoting solidarity to safeguard clinical quality in the face of all the legislative insanity that is cascading out of DC.

    It's incredibly superficial to reduce 'satisfaction with nursing care' to the appearance of the clinician. To even consider this is unbelievably disrespectful to our patients and their families. They're smarter than that. C'mon - we're smarter than that... aren't we?
    seaghost, LadyFree28, Psychtrish39, and 17 others like this.
  3. Visit  imintrouble profile page
    1
    Quote from HouTx
    AAARRRRGGGGHHHHHHHH!!! <sorry, had to get that out of my system>

    Why is fallacious reasoning becoming so commonplace? Where is some critical thinking in all this rhetoric?

    Increased age does NOT automatically result in expertise. I have encountered way too many 'experienced' nurses that are barely squeeking by (competence-wise). Proficient & highly expert people got that way by learning from their experiences... but this is a deliberate process, and some people are just not capable of this type of learning. Honestly, just published research has validated this - differences are due to the way our brains are wired.

    So - let's all just stop this bandwagon with competing poles of age, attractiveness, religion, political stance or whatever other demographic groups are wading in to say that they are "the best". Just Stop It! This has no basis in reality and promotes divisiveness among us when we should be promoting solidarity to safeguard clinical quality in the face of all the legislative insanity that is cascading out of DC.

    It's incredibly superficial to reduce 'satisfaction with nursing care' to the appearance of the clinician. To even consider this is unbelievably disrespectful to our patients and their families. They're smarter than that. C'mon - we're smarter than that... aren't we?
    I admire your passion, but you're wrong.
    I wish you weren't.
    ColoradoRocky likes this.
  4. Visit  brandy1017 profile page
    3
    Most of us were young, pretty and thin but then age or babies or stress of nursing took its toll! If nothing else now there are so many things a person can do to improve your appearance such as chemical peels and plastic surgery, although thanks to peels and lasers etc surgery is not even needed in many cases. Unfortunately if the problem is weight gain that can be very difficult to fix short of gastric bypass or lap band, but look at the bright side if you're overweight it hides the wrinkles! I've heard lasers can literallly melt fat, now where do you find one that helps with a round face thanks to steroids? Also you can color your hair and even experiment with different shades! So look at the bright side!

    I don't mind working with the young "pretty" ones, they are usually friendly, happy and hopeful about the future and easy to work with, joking and brightening the place up! Most of them aren't planning to work bedside and are actively pursuing FNP!

    But you're right experience doesn't count, its only part of the package and what people see is more important. Might as well be practical and accept reality and do your best to look as good as you can, have a cheerful personality and network since friends and who you know are also important in getting new jobs and branching out!
    RNFiona, FranEMTnurse, and anotherone like this.
  5. Visit  samadams8 profile page
    4
    Quote from Jenni811
    Trust me when i say this, when you are sick and in the hospital the last thing you care about is how your nurse looks. yes there are the few exceptions but i'm talking in general.

    Its all in your head...get over it.


    But I don't know if it's all in anyone's head. It is the way of the world right now. They are cheaper than more experienced nurses, and I can see commuter's point.

    More proof that nursing is NOT viewed as a profession. It's utter BS.
    Psychtrish39, tnmarie, jrwest, and 1 other like this.
  6. Visit  CampNurse1 profile page
    4
    Of course it is about money. That is not a crime. It is for all of us. Who here works for free? The point being missed is how places are managed. Great managers use their resources to provide a superior product at a fair price. In nursing, we cannot provide a superior product without superior people. Nurses have to be nurtured. Great managers do not tolerate any "isms" or horizontal violence, or anything else that promotes a hostile environment. When I was a staff nurse, I used to think, "Man, managers got it made, they don't have to put up with the @#$% I do." As a manager, I chuckle when I find myself thinking, "Man, I wish I was a staff nurse, they don't have to put up with the @#$% I do." I do not think I am a great manager, but I do take care of my nurses, and I make sure they have what they need to deliver great care. If my employer ever stops letting me do those two things, I will move on pronto.

    Press Ganey is complicated! There is no getting around the link between perception and outcome. If a client's perception is poor, perhaps because of a rude staff member, chances are that client's outcome will not be optimal. It just works that way. If a patient's perception is poor, and you can tell, because they are just plain ignorant, they need some gentle education that brings them into the loop. If we give up on a client because we believe they are too dumb, or something else, we are now taking away their role on the health care team. Perception, and outcome, will be poor, because they feel left out. On the other side of the coin, good perception is possible even when the outcome is poor. This is when the care is compassionate, and inclusive.

    Managers that think cute young nurses are going to improve Press Ganey are nuts! I guess they got the idea at some cookie cutter seminar. I agree that nurses should be attractive. Now, before you kill me, let me tell you what I believe is an attractive nurse: A nurse that provides brainy, competent care, who offers self, and who makes me feel cared about, as well as cared for. That, my friends, is a sight for sore eyes. Our patients agree.
  7. Visit  samadams8 profile page
    0
    Quote from netglow
    and keeping them virginal
    You pretty much have to hire straight from the early elementary grades to get this anymore. Sad reality.
  8. Visit  samadams8 profile page
    3
    Quote from DeBerham


    Jason, BSN, RN-BC, CEN, ONC

    - See more at: http://allnurses.com/nurse-colleague....2VelrfBO.dpuf.

    OK, honestly, do you usually write all that alphabet soup after your name? Seriously. . .?
    RNFiona, nrsang97, and mc3 like this.
  9. Visit  Marshall1 profile page
    7
    Wow..just wow to a lot of what's posted on here...40 is old, egos are very high, and yet..I can't figure out why models with IQ's that rival Einstein would go into nursing...unless I missed it I didn't see anything on here about the patients..just money, business and young versus old......certainly healthcare is a business, money/costs of staff come into play..it could be argued that younger nurses cost more with being out of work due to pregnancy, childcare issues, stress..but others will say its the older ones that cost time/money..in the end people the hospitals - especially the for profit ones - aren't going to care if you are 20, 40 or 60, fat, thin. black, white, male, female, etc. They are going to only care that you show up, take care of the 8 sometimes more patients that you are assigned even if you are drowning in paperwork and do all this will a smile on your face and no complaint because in reality, there are more nurses looking for jobs than not - we are a dime a dozen in this economy and ANY of us can be replaced in a second.
    No matter what our certifications, experience, etc.
    Psychtrish39, prnqday, tnmarie, and 4 others like this.
  10. Visit  Jenni811 profile page
    1
    Quote from jadelpn
    The ego that comes off on this post is overshadowing a great deal of your points. "having certifications you have never heard of" and "superior computer skills" of that of a 50 year old is telling. It is lovely that you are so certified and computer literate and "already training to be a charge nurse" but something to think about-- you are ignoring the moon to count the stars. When the poop hits the fan and you have a patient crumping, critical thinking under pressure is the most important quality. And that is learned by a more experienced nurse. And when someone is coding, they certainly don't think about kumbya moments, or how awesome one's hair looks when they are doing compressions. And no one smiles at a code. You can have 152 certifications, but unless one practices them, they are not worth the paper they are printed on. And rescue Annie and plastic appendages and power point presentations are not akin to the real thing in real life. No matter what they tell you. If your orientee is not a new grad, then by all means, learn from her and each "older" member of your team. Because when it gets down to the REAL reason we are all at work, experience DOES matter. And I have never heard a patient's family say WELLLLL that code didn't go so well, but gee whiz the nurse was sooooo bubbly, like a fresh spring day!!!!!

    Heck yes it sounds ignorant. But my point of making it sound ignorant was beause the OP sounded just as ignorant as i did degrading young/new nurses. So how come an older more experienced nurse can sound ignorant but i can't? should i light the fire and say "we shouldn't hire over weight nurses?" how is that any different than saying we need to stop hiring young/new/cute nurses because that is what she was implying. So if she can get away with saying that, tahn i can get away with "We need to stop hiring overweight nures" (I certainly do not think that at all im just using an example that really gets to people so they can relate)

    I never said those were my only qualifications. codes do not scare me. I have ACLS and have been in lots of codes. We have one telemetry nurse delegated to carry the code pager and i have to code pager from time to time. Times have changed, and all i can say is that from a BUSINESS stand point it is a smart move. Think about it in more simpe terms...you run open a pizza shop you chose between two people:
    1) a 50 year old with excellent skills, really good at making pizza. Years of experience, maybe more t than you. The 50 year old is demanding you pay 15/hour.
    2) a 24 year old with developing skills. He/she is eager to learn from your already hired employees. They are great with customers. They are ok with miniumum wage.

    I know this isn't pizza we're talking about. But i would go with the 24 year old? Is there a little ageism with nursing?? you betcha!! Would hospitals admit it? nope. They are going to think of any excuse other than the nurses age. Yea it will suck when that time comes for me, but it isn't about me.
    anotherone likes this.
  11. Visit  Jenni811 profile page
    0
    Quote from DeBerham
    Jenni811 hit the nail on the head, it's about $$$. Shockingly, inexperienced nurses (those with 1-3 years of experience) are cheaper to hire than an experienced nurse. Additionally, those coming out of nursing school are typically young and attractive as 22 to 25 year old females are apt to be. What I'll also say is that as a male I never had to deal with the garbage that the more... experienced... nurses dealt out to these new grads. That isn't to say I didn't hear about it, probably since I wasn't viewed as any type of threat to the pecking order. I even had one nurse tell me that the nurse manager was purposefully hiring attractive people to work the floor. That made me chuckle a little bit. What I'd suggest is to get over it. NOTHING good will come from being so superficial. Is it their fault that they're attractive? No. Is it their fault that they are young? No. Are you liable to let your jealousy over SUPERFICIAL things ruin some potential relationships? Yes. If you see that they are not acclimating the the job/culture (ie cell phone use while patients need something) let them know. I'll say though that you may need an attitude adjustment just as much as these new nurses because your feelings will translate in to actions in how you treat/interact with them... and then we'll get to read new posts about how we continue to eat our young.
    THANK YOU!!! seeing my point. It isn't the nurses "looks" its about the money. Im surprised for all the "experience" you people have you don't see that all hospitals care about is $$$$$. get to know these new people and see beyond their looks.
    Just because someone is young/beauitful does not mean they don't have brains or that they can't offer the company something. You can be beautiful and smart at the same time believe it or not.
  12. Visit  Susie2310 profile page
    13
    Jenni811, you mentioned that you are 24. Everything is much simpler when you are 24.
    tnmarie, 2yearrnba, ColoradoRocky, and 10 others like this.
  13. Visit  FlorenceNtheMachine profile page
    0
    Quote from HouTx
    Increased age does NOT automatically result in expertise. I have encountered way too many 'experienced' nurses that are barely squeeking by (competence-wise).
    So for those barely competent nurses, who squeaked by for so long, check them! Management should have their pick of the litter, so to speak. So replace them with someone who is more of an expert in their field. In my area, there are thousands of applications each month for dozens of open positions.

    I'm all about survival of the fittest (fittest=intelligent, competent)! But we need to let go of all preconceived notions about who that may be.

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