How do you deal with anti-OB people? - page 3

I'm half-way to obtaining my ADN and have recently discovered that there are people out there who are not only anti-OB/GYN but are against any medical interventions at all during pregnancy. I talked... Read More

  1. by   fergus51
    Quote from geekgolightly
    oh im just being contrary using the inverse terminology. nature nazi's really stuck in my craw. GRRRRR!
    OK. I actually think both types exist, but 99% of people are neither. Women who want the "natural" experience were always supported as much as possible and so were women who wanted epidurals where I've worked. I think that's how it should be right?
  2. by   geekgolightly
    Quote from fergus51
    OK. I actually think both types exist, but 99% of people are neither. Women who want the "natural" experience were always supported as much as possible and so were women who wanted epidurals where I've worked. I think that's how it should be right?
    of course it should be that way! people like you should be in every hospital. maybe i wouldn't have had such a rotten experience. these nurses were pretty nasty. i came in when i was spilling 2+ protein. did not plan a hospital birth adn i should have had a backup plan in place. they treated me shabbily and did everything i was afriad of... all the reasons i wanted to avoid a hospital in the first place. i dont think that 99% of LD nurses are "neither." i would say there is a much larger percentage of LD nurses who are anti-home birthing, anti-natural labor (makes for more work for them) At a hospital I recently shadowed the nurses were HAPPY when a mom chose formula feeding, saying it made less work for them. :angryfire these are two separate hospitals in two separate states.
  3. by   fergus51
    Quote from prinsessa
    Do you have a problem with doctors giving out false information like they do all the time? My mom was told that she would HAVE to have a C-section because she was too small (5'3) and my brother was too big (he was under 9 lbs when he was born). She refused and gave birth to my brother vaginally without any problems. When I was pregnant with my son, I told my OB that I wanted to give birth without any pain meds. She looked at me and said "well I wouldn't recommend that". When I told her that I gave birth to my daughter (after 36 hours of labor) naturally, she looked shocked and said "I don't know how you ladies do it".

    Why should doctors push interventions that aren't necessary? Btw, I don't think all doctors are like this. And the term "nature nazi" or "breast nazi" is really offensive.
    Yes I have a problem with docs giving out false info. In all fairness though, "Well I wouldn't recommend that" and "I don't know how you ladies do it" isn't false info, it's an indication of her birth philosophy. You obviously knew what you wanted and I doubt she/he forced you to get an epidural right? Your mother's doc was wrong too, fortunately she was able to have a good birth. Like I said already I agree there are bad docs out there. That just wasn't the topic of this thread. I can probably match you bad doc story for bad doc story (and come up with many bad nurse stories, bad doula stories, bad layperson stories, bad midwife stories and stories where the parent was wrong and the hc provider was right)...

    What I find offensive is the way ALL health care providers are painted with the same brush by extremists (whatever you choose to call them) who want to bully women into giving birth a certain way. I'm tired of explaining again and again and again and again and again that I will support a woman's informed decision regardless of what it is.
  4. by   Indy
    In my opinion, the books I read could have been a direct detriment to either or both of my daughters had I followed their non-medical advice.

    My first daughter was born a week late and nearly aspirated meconium; there was a good hunk of it in her little throat. She spent nearly 24 hours in the nursery incubator getting that straightened out, and had problems with her temperature regulation. The nurses offered me a pump, but I was pretty intimidated by it so they fed my baby during this time. Why? Because they have to keep the child's blood sugar up to avoid brain damage. When she was more stable, she had no problems latching on and feeding.

    I was very entranced by the idea of midwives from a feminist standpoint based on my reading, and had daughter #1 been born at home, well, she'd have been in serious trouble. With daughter # 2, my water broke but it was a good 24 hours before labor progressed, and even then it took large amounts of pitocin to get it going anywhere. She was right about the due date, thank goodness. I'd hat to think I would have been in favor of birth with her in a less than "hospital-clean" environment, considering how long I went with the amniotic fluid leaking steadily.

    Now I don't want people to take things like epidurals lightly; you can be allergic to caine-type drugs and it'll be a really bad day. Or you can get an epidural that leaves hot spots and good god does that hurt. And if you're really short-waisted, the epidural can affect your diaphragm and make it difficult to breathe. The benefits of having less stress are worthwhile to some people, don't judge those people because they didn't want to go the time honored route of huffnpuff birth. (Sorry, that's what I call it.)

    Not everyone has a supportive spouse who will learn breathing techniques with them, and massage their back and legs, and such. Some of us are silly and paranoid of people sticking needles in their backs and wind up asking for things like Demerol, then promptly forgetting that they are in childbirth at all. We silly people need good nurses who will educate us. Even when we waltz in and say, Oh god no, don't give me an epidural.

    There are always gonna be patients you can't please. But if they tell you something, be ready to ask, "why?" and let them explain. A little tip I learned from school that is still serving me well is to let the patient know my goals for them, so they know why I'm doing whatever it is. With an end stage COPD'er, it might be :"I want you breathing decently and I don't want you to be in any pain, because that creates stress and it's harder to breathe when you hurt. K?" The first guy I said that to said, "oh thank god, you know what I need." I haven't worked OB yet but I'm kind of blunt so I might say something like "Okay, my goal is to have two live, healthy patients at the end of this process. That's you and your baby. All the things I need to do are geared towards making sure that this happens... " and move on to the subject of pain control. Note, I haven't worked in labor and delivery yet.

    A friend of mine used to want to BE a CNM. She tells some interesting stories from our local La Leche League. Things like how they will tell new moms to breastfeed well into the toddler years and deny the possibility of "nursing mouth" which is similar to "bottle mouth". Well, my friend's child has an ungodly amount of dental work now, and she's not five yet, from nursing too much; having seen the diet this kid eats I don't see where else it would come from. It's disturbing to me as us cardiac nurses know exactly how SBE can be a direct result of bad teeth.

    Heck, most people don't even know that letting a baby get cold too often or too long can cause brain damage. And if the local la leche league says that's bullhockey fed to you by the medical profession, well there are gonna be some kids out there with learning disabilities whose parents are just that gullible.

    Since people believe what other people tell them, those who use influence of ANY kind to peddle bad advice, have a special place in hell just for them, in my opinion.
  5. by   fergus51
    Quote from geekgolightly
    of course it should be that way! people like you should be in every hospital. maybe i wouldn't have had such a rotten experience. these nurses were pretty nasty. i came in when i was spilling 2+ protein. did not plan a hospital birth adn i should have had a backup plan in place. they treated me shabbily and did everything i was afriad of... all the reasons i wanted to avoid a hospital in the first place. i dont think that 99% of LD nurses are "neither." i would say there is a much larger percentage of LD nurses who are anti-home birthing, anti-natural labor (makes for more work for them) At a hospital I recently shadowed the nurses were HAPPY when a mom chose formula feeding, saying it made less work for them. :angryfire these are two separate hospitals in two separate states.
    Those nurses are no better than the bf "advocates" who use guilt and intimidation to get women to breastfeeding when they don't want to. Hopefully the women choosing to formula or breast feed are doing it because that's what's best for them.
  6. by   bluesky
    I am definitely not an L&D nurse, nor do I ever plan on it. I did just want to mention my own experience with childbirth, though. I was completely gung ho about having an epidural ! I wanted one, and I wanted it now! My OB was actually pretty conservative about it and even turned the sucker off after a lot of protest because of my failure to progress... point after which I had an extremely painful anterior delivery. I mean he could have easily made the extra cash and coerced me into a cesarian which he most certainly didn't. I was begging for more meds, let me tell you!!! The nurses also were pretty consistent about bringing my son in to breastfeed and never once encouraged me to take the "easy" way out.

    I never felt pressured either way, to be completely honest.
  7. by   tntrn
    [QUOTE=geekgolightly] i would say there is a much larger percentage of LD nurses who are anti-home birthing, anti-natural labor (makes for more work for them)QUOTE]

    I couldn't disagree more with you on this: When I worked in a No. CA teaching hospital in the 70's and 80's, we did NO, repeat, NO, epidurals for labor. Three hundred or so births a month and never an epidural. We worked out butts off. I find that being "supportive" of a blocked laboring patient actually requires less work. It's tempting to let the drug do its thing while staff does only what they must, such as vitals, assessments, etc. When the natural labor patient comes in, I personally love it. It's so much more challenging to do labor coaching, get FHT's when the mom is in other-than-the-usual positions. I always feel like I did make a difference. On the other hand, I've had the experience several times to have a home birth patient come in after many hours of not delivering at home for whatever reason (pushing 6 hours) and have the people with her tell me what I can and cannot do (no IV, for example, and No pitocin.) Really, you have to wonder why they even came in at all, if they aren't going to allow us to do the one or two little things which might make a difference.

    I'm really not sure to what you refer when you make the statement that natural labor patients make less work for the nurses. Could you please explain?
  8. by   grannynurse FNP student
    I know my experience is extremely outdated because my daughter was born in 1967. I had a wonderful experience with an English nurse mid-wife, even though she could not practice here in the states. She was very supportive, as were the nurses on the other two shifts. I had a epiidural and while it didn't take all my pain away, it sure helped. My next experience with L & D was when my three grandchildren were born, 1991, 1994, 1997. My daughter and SIL had a wonderful experience with the birth of my three grandchildren. I could have been there but opted to allow the two of them to share this wonderful experience by themselves, as did my SIL's Mom. We kept each other company in the waiting area. I have never had to deal with the NN but have heard tales about them. And I have visited message boards that they reign supreme on and tell horror stories and misrepresentations. And it is obvious they are very tall tales. It is too bad that some people fall prey to their misrepresentations. And it is equally unfortunate the there are some OBs that also ignore their patient's wishes.

    Grannynurse
  9. by   Cienna2000
    I'm pre-nursing, but with my hubby's step-SIL, I let it go in one ear and out the other. I was not a normal low-risk pregnancy to start with, and the local midwives only do home deliveries (which I am not comfortable with since I live 50 minutes from the nearest hospital). I can understand how as a L&D nurse this could be incredibly frustrating to deal with.

    As it was, my daughter was delivered by c-section at 31w0d due to pre-eclampsia. According to the umbilical dopplers my daughter wouldn't have survived contractions. My daughter and I were very fortunate to have VERY good nurses during our stays.

    What'ds really kind of funny though is step-SIL is all for natural labor with midwives but did not breastfeed any of her kids for more than a few days.

    The breast nazi of a LC I dealt with in the hospital though drove me nuts. My milk never came in due to a variety of reasons (all the meds that kept me pregnant from 28 to 31 weeks according to my OB and daughter's neonatologist) and this LC actually told me if I didn't get my milk in my daughter would die. Guess she was wrong because 15 months and no breast milk later my toddler is completely healthy and happy.
  10. by   geekgolightly
    Quote from tntrn
    I'm really not sure to what you refer when you make the statement that natural labor patients make less work for the nurses. Could you please explain?
    I thinkl I was unclear? I said that it appears that the nurses I shadowed and the ones I labored under were wanting me to get an epidural, were happy when someone formula fed because it was less work (PP). Was I unclear? I was writing fast before I left the house....
  11. by   geekgolightly
    Quote from fergus51
    Those nurses are no better than the bf "advocates" who use guilt and intimidation to get women to breastfeeding when they don't want to. Hopefully the women choosing to formula or breast feed are doing it because that's what's best for them.
    So are you retracting your 99% then? Curious...

    I wish I had someone who was really adament about breastfeeding helping me. Because no one did. There was even a lactation consultant, but she was too busy to help and seemed to shrug when I said that the nursery nurses wouldnt let me breastfeed. She said "well they want you to pump your milk..."

    uhhh thanks... six weeks of he&& to get Seth to breast because of that. No advocate for me or my son.
  12. by   fergus51
    Quote from geekgolightly
    So are you retracting your 99% then? Curious...

    I wish I had someone who was really adament about breastfeeding helping me. Because no one did. There was even a lactation consultant, but she was too busy to help and seemed to shrug when I said that the nursery nurses wouldnt let me breastfeed. She said "well they want you to pump your milk..."

    uhhh thanks... six weeks of he&& to get Seth to breast because of that. No advocate for me or my son.
    I'm not retracting my 99%. I truly believe there are about 1% of people who are truly extreme. They either want everyone in birkenstocks squatting in a forest to deliver while chanting to the fertility goddess, or they want them all anesthetized at around 8 months pregnant to give em a section. Everyone else is somewhere on the spectrum in between those extremes.

    I find it very odd that the lc wasn't more supportive. Most of the LCs I know are completely dedicated to breastfeeding, often to the point that they bother their patients. Why wouldn't the nursery nurses let you breastfeed? I don't like well baby nurseries period, they are bad for breastfeeding and teaching.
  13. by   prissy pixie
    Quote from fergus51
    I find it very odd that the lc wasn't more supportive. Most of the LCs I know are completely dedicated to breastfeeding, often to the point that they bother their patients. Why wouldn't the nursery nurses let you breastfeed? I don't like well baby nurseries period, they are bad for breastfeeding and teaching.
    This is my experience too.

    Having had 3 children and in 3 different states (California, Texas and Oklahoma) I was encouraged to BF at EVERY one of the hospitals.

    I had a heck of a time trying with my first and after 4 wks of not producing I turned to bottle feeding. Same with my second child, after a couple of wks. When I was in the hospital w/ my third I didn't even try because I wanted to enjoy my daughter and not deal with the stress and guilt of not being able to feed my child. I was encouraged to try (and was told of the benefits etc) but I told them I would rather bottle feed.

    It is NOBODY'S choice except mine If I choose to breast or bottle feed!

    I was never pressured either way at any of the hospitals and am very glad of that too. If I had come across anybody telling me what a bad mother I was for not breast feeding my third child I would have simply gone Rambo on them.

    I had 2 children naturally and my third w/ an epidural. My 3rd child took the longest to deliver because I was just not able to push. If I had to do it again I would deliver my 3rd naturally as well. But, that is my choice and I was never pressured in any direction with any of my births.


    The only surprise I encountered was the episiotomy with my 1st. I wish the doctor would have told me what he was doing instead of just doing that. That was by far the most painful thing I endured during childbirth.

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