Would you do this so others could get vacation...

Stephanie D · Feb 18, 2004

No way, huh uh, wouldn't even think of it!

barefootlady, ADN, RN · Feb 18, 2004

Most facilities I have contacted in the last few months have offered a week's vacation at the end of 6 months of full time service. They did not mention a schedule change or special conditions to obtain this vacation time. I would be very upset to be scheduled ET that I had not agreed to, or to having my shift hours changed wo my consent, unless it was a real emergency. I think there should be some type of labor board review and the nurses of the unit should then present their feelings/findings in a staff meeting. If, this facility can indeed change hours/add hours wo your consent, then maybe after 18 years it is time for a change of employment. I would want to have some idea when I was going to be able to come home after a normal work day. It seems like this facility is attempting to take this knowledge away from its staff.

Good luck and I hope enough nurses on this unit band together to make it difficult to continue this practice.

Nurse Ratched, RN · Feb 18, 2004

Devil's advocate: if the newer folks get burnt out and quit, then you may wind up working more hours anyway. Is this a matter of them wanting extra time or just getting vacation time period? Everyone needs a little time off. Maybe it's not your responsibility to cover said time off, but if you can, it might be nice and set up a more friendly (and refreshed) work environment.

I don't know about the legalities of whether you can be *required* to work extra time.

gypsyatheart · Feb 18, 2004

OK, bear with me here, I'm still drinking my am coffee... I'm not sure I understand...

So, mgmt is asking staff to pick up extra hours when someone is on vacation...to cover when someone is off the schedule? Is this mandatory, or optional...picking up an extra shift?

Or do I have this all wrong??

BittyBabyGrower, MSN, RN · Feb 18, 2004

They have us pick up 8 extra hours so that they can give more vacation hours. There are plenty of hours thru the year, but the new people want 2 weeks off in the summer, and it isn't going to happen even if we pick up the extra time. Our contracts do not read 12 hours shifts, they are by hours, so they can pull us off our 12's unfortunately. I don't mind picking up hours for people, but I think demanding 2 weeks off in the summer is a bit forward, especially as a new nurse.

I have thought about leaving there, but I only have 12 more years to go and I can retire at the ripe old age of 51 with full medical and benefits, so I am kind of stuck it seems. :rolleyes:

Devil's advocate...we are never mandated to work over or scheduled mandatory except for this. I don't see how this can be legal...our unit is not short in the first place, it only to let 1-2 extra people out on vacation.

live4today, RN · Feb 18, 2004

If the hospitals had enough staff in the first place, they wouldn't have to look for underhanded avenues to ensure a staff member got the time off they deserve and are told they will have when they hire on (one or two weeks vacation per year). :rolleyes:

In my opinion, the hospitals are asking their staff to cover for benefits the hospital has agreed to provide each employee upon hiring them. This should NOT be! :nono:

Gompers, BSN, RN · Feb 18, 2004

Okay, I really don't understand. Doesn't the hospital give them vacation time as part of their benefits? Is it a money issue or a unit coverage issue?

Either way, I'm sorry, but I really really really don't think it's fair to ask people who've worked there forever to work extra hours (without overtime pay to boot) just so the new people can have a fun two weeks off in the summer! What a way to make the seasoned nurses resent these new people! It sounds kind of prissy to me, to be honest. Don't most hospitals give 2-3 weeks vacation per year to start with?

I understand if the staff has to pick up extra hours in the summer because a lot of people are taking vacation time, that happens everywhere. But to ask your unit to do it specifically for the new people isn't fair. If they don't have enough vacation time built up yet, when then that's life. We all had to go through that when we were first hired - waiting to get that first precious vacation time.

Sorry if I sound so heartless, but there is no way I would work overtime without overtime pay just because someone complained that they wanted more time off in the summer right after starting their job.

Then again, my unit has a very very low turnover rate, so we don't worry so much about "losing" new staff. Maybe that's why I'm thinking this way?

:uhoh3:

ktwlpn, LPN · Feb 18, 2004

They have us pick up 8 extra hours so that they can give more vacation hours. It is Mandatory if you are under 40hours/week...we don't even get OT for it LOL! There are plenty of hours thru the year, but the new people want 2 weeks off in the summer, and it isn't going to happen even if we pick up the extra time. Our contracts do not read 12 hours shifts, they are by hours, so they can pull us off our 12's unfortunately. I don't mind picking up hours for people, but I think demanding 2 weeks off in the summer is a bit forward, especially as a new nurse.
I have thought about leaving there, but I only have 12 more years to go and I can retire at the ripe old age of 51 with full medical and benefits, so I am kind of stuck it seems.
Devil's advocate...we are never mandated to work over or scheduled mandatory except for this and it seems that this goes against some labor law...I have to delve into it more. I don't see how this can be legal...our unit is not short in the first place, it only to let 1-2 extra people out on vacation.

It is great for those of you with many years of service to be given perks but you have to cut the new kids a break...We passed a calendar around to staff from highest seniority first to the lowest and everyone picked ONE week-after everyone got the first week then the calender went around again and again until everyone had marked in all of their time...No-one was permitted 2 weeks in a row-.....

fergus51 · Feb 18, 2004

I have worked extra so others could go on vacation. It isn't something I do every week, but it does make a big difference in the atmosphere of teamwork on the unit, and when I need to switch a shift those people are more than willing. Even new nurses deserve some good time off, which is why our vacations are granted sort of like ktwlpn's job does. If only senior nurses get the summer time off, you will not have any new nurses left.

I would want to know if your unit has looked into agency and perdiem workers first.

Gompers, BSN, RN · Feb 18, 2004

We submit vacation requests for the summer by a certain date, and they go by seniority and give one week off at a time and then possibly two if everyone has already had their request granted and there is some time left over. If requests are submitted after that date, they are granted in the order recieved. New people usually don't have trouble getting the week off that they want - GRANTED they have built up enough vacation time according to payroll.

My point is that really it's a lot for new people to ask for two weeks off in the summer right off the bat and their manager expect the whole unit to bust their butts for that. I suppose the unit could react one of two ways - the way fergus mentioned where the teamwork atmosphere improves, and the way I mentioned before. Two weeks off in a row, in the summer, is something very hard to come by enough for the most senior nurse in most places.

gypsyatheart · Feb 18, 2004

Okay, I really don't understand. Doesn't the hospital give them vacation time as part of their benefits? Is it a money issue or a unit coverage issue?
Either way, I'm sorry, but I really really really don't think it's fair to ask people who've worked there forever to work extra hours (without overtime pay to boot) just so the new people can have a fun two weeks off in the summer! What a way to make the seasoned nurses resent these new people! It sounds kind of prissy to me, to be honest. Don't most hospitals give 2-3 weeks vacation per year to start with?
I understand if the staff has to pick up extra hours in the summer because a lot of people are taking vacation time, that happens everywhere. But to ask your unit to do it specifically for the new people isn't fair. If they don't have enough vacation time built up yet, when then that's life. We all had to go through that when we were first hired - waiting to get that first precious vacation time.
Sorry if I sound so heartless, but there is no way I would work overtime without overtime pay just because someone complained that they wanted more time off in the summer right after starting their job.
Then again, my unit has a very very low turnover rate, so we don't worry so much about "losing" new staff. Maybe that's why I'm thinking this way?

Exactly... I must be dense or something because I am totally not understanding what you guys picking up 8hrs a month extra does???

I agree, everyone should get vacation,but I'm used to systems where everyone accrues their own amt of vacation or PTO(paid time off). If you have PTO, you use it. You put in your request like everyone else...

So, I don't get what the 8 exta hrs are doing?...Paying for their vacation or covering their shifts while out? If it's just covering while their out..well, that happens all the time....

Sorry to be so dense this am... :chuckle