Why do so many people insist that LPN'S AREN'T REAL NURSES!!??

NCalLVN · Apr 17, 2012

Ca correctly passed Nurse to Patient Ratios, further reading would explain nurse to be RN and LVN as well as in some instances Psychiatric Tech's. It has never been RN nurse to patient ratios except on the CNA website.

stephanie2012 · Apr 17, 2012

Hello, i am not a LPN, but in my mind , it should belong to nurse category.

I mean, the title does have "Nurse" in it.So why are so many people insisting that LPN's arent real nurses? When I go to the hospital, I see these people giving medication , care, comfort and other services to their patients, isn't that what nursing is all about? What do you think about this issue? Do you think LPN's aren't real nurses?

Merlyn · Apr 17, 2012

I wonder if one's perspective on this issue might depend on the state in which they are practicing? In CA, where I work as an LVN, our scope of practice is very limited -- so much so that I feel as though I am held back from fully caring for my patients, which can be frustrating.
Assessments, initial pt teaching, taking verbal orders, IV meds, IV fluids with additives of any kind, and anything with central lines (except maybe a dressing change) are all duties exclusively reserved for RNs according to our state's practice act.
How can LVNs in CA truly feel like "real nurses" with such a long list of important nursing tasks we are restricted from performing? I know that I don't.
For example, I hate having to say to one of my patients in pain: "I'll let your RN know that you're in pain and would like your IV morphine. It'll be just a few minutes." Wouldn't a "real nurse" have license to tend to the patient's needs independently? I say yes.
(I am not trying to offend or disrespect anyone by saying this. I am just sharing my personal point of view and feelings on the matter!)

I've worked in about 5 or 6 states. South Dakota was more receptive of LPNs, at lease in the early '80s they were. Virginia they weren't. It goes back to the 40s when the RN's and LPN's were going to war. Nursing aides could take state boards and become LPN's by wavier. I work with two nurses that did this back in the 70's. We LPN's are perceived as not being as smart as the RNs. We will always have that stigmata. All through the 40 years that I have been a LPN. Always followed me even though I've gone to college for something else. It doesn't matter. This is what the non-medical people think. But when my family has a problem or sees a new drug on TV for hand nails, I am the first one they run to.

Nurse Fee Fee · Apr 18, 2012

I wonder if one's perspective on this issue might depend on the state in which they are practicing? In CA, where I work as an LVN, our scope of practice is very limited -- so much so that I feel as though I am held back from fully caring for my patients, which can be frustrating.
Assessments, initial pt teaching, taking verbal orders, IV meds, IV fluids with additives of any kind, and anything with central lines (except maybe a dressing change) are all duties exclusively reserved for RNs according to our state's practice act.
How can LVNs in CA truly feel like "real nurses" with such a long list of important nursing tasks we are restricted from performing? I know that I don't.
For example, I hate having to say to one of my patients in pain: "I'll let your RN know that you're in pain and would like your IV morphine. It'll be just a few minutes." Wouldn't a "real nurse" have license to tend to the patient's needs independently? I say yes.
(I am not trying to offend or disrespect anyone by saying this. I am just sharing my personal point of view and feelings on the matter!)

LVNMUM, I am going to agree with you, I do believe it is a state by state thing. I think that the compact states have very similar education programs and that is the reason why some places the NURSE h ave to acquired a license for that state because the training is different. I know CA is not one of those compact states and I don't see it happening anytime soon because of the training. When I was an MA trained in Cali if was hard for me to get a job in Ky because the training and lenght of the program was so different.

rgroyer1RNBSN, BSN, RN · Apr 21, 2012

Well I thought lpn school was harder than Rn school it was like they packed the adn program into one year and our instructors were nazis, I have great respect for the lpn because I was one first. However my first year nursing I worked at an ltc facility and I had this nuthead supervising bsn that went around calling us lpns half a**ed nurses and now I am one of the nurses who will actually help my cna's, long story short I was helping do a bed check and said nuthead came down and said he was going to help us and had I not have been there this said nuthead would have rolled a poor resident out of there bed onto the floor because said nut head put both rails down thank god I was in the room to play catch the patient before she did a face dive into the floor, this is also the same nuthead I caught sticking a patient 3 times with the same iv catheter. Just my 2 cents.Rod Rn, Bsn

allnurses Guide · Apr 21, 2012

lvnmum;6340542]Assessments, initial pt teaching, taking verbal orders, IV meds, IV fluids with additives of any kind, and anything with central lines (except maybe a dressing change) are all duties exclusively reserved for RNs according to our state's practice act.

LVNs in CA can take verbal orders and administer blood products with certification.

The link below is a flowchart published by Kaiser Permanente after research by a committee (which I'm sure included as much legal firepower as their member premiums will buy) to put scope of practice laws into real life nursing interventions. The laws themselves are notoriously subject to many interpretations. They reference the statutes from which they determined their guidelines throughout.

http://ambulatorypractice.org/clinical_practice/docs/Scope of Practice Resource Guide.pdf

warning: title page is really bizarre :)

gypsygurl40 · Apr 21, 2012

The RN program is only 6 months longer than the LPN program and that extra 6 is management courses. I have wored in GA for many years and there is nothing I havent done. The oly difference is the admission signature/ and even then an RN just cosigned with me.

Idont think a CNA could pass the LPN state boards in this day and time. The cna training im GA is about 6 weeks and LPN is 18 months.

LostCauseCCRN · Apr 22, 2012

Why do 44% of LPNs flunk out/drop out of the LPN-RN Bridge Program in Alabama? Hhhmmmmmmm?

Source: 2011 Report on Nursing School Success Rates for the Southern Association of Colleges and Schools (In association with the National League of Nursing).

CNA Class of 2011 Success Rate was 94%!!!!!! Hhhmmmmmmmmmm?

RN required to oversee LPN work/decisions/assessments? Yup, Hhhmmmmmmmmmmm?

Real is a stretch? I haven't made one statement either way, just typed up some facts and questions! so NO BITES/FIGHTS!

allnurses Guide · Apr 22, 2012

Why do 44% of LPNs flunk out/drop out of the LPN-RN Bridge Program in Alabama? Hhhmmmmmmm?
Source: 2011 Report on Nursing School Success Rates for the Southern Association of Colleges and Schools (In association with the National League of Nursing).
CNA Class of 2011 Success Rate was 94%!!!!!! Hhhmmmmmmmmmm?
RN required to oversee LPN work/decisions/assessments? Yup, Hhhmmmmmmmmmmm?
Real is a stretch? I haven't made one statement either way, just typed up some facts and questions! so NO BITES/FIGHTS!

Actually, you've provided no facts. Unless you provide some way for others to evaluate the legitimacy of your sources you can't expect people to accept them as "facts". Usually best to get the link if you are making the point.

I remember the day when a post like this would've been very rare. It's disheartening. To claim that you didn't make a statement either way is pretty hollow when it's so obvious what your opinion is. Your non-statement was a statement and your questions aren't intended to be answered.

CloudySue · Apr 22, 2012

The questions themselves don't bother me. What does irk me is the smarmy "Hhhmmmmmmm?" that follows every question. And yeah, where's your source?

LongislandRN23 · Apr 22, 2012

I have a feeling that someday in the future "ASN/ADN" nurses are not going to be considered "real nurses".

allnurses Guide · Apr 23, 2012

That is already underway with some of the RN unions wanting to divide RNs into categories of "technical RN" (ADN) and "professional RN"(BSN) with different scopes of practice, opportunities for promotion to management, and pay scales.