Who's at fault here?

Zyprexa_Ho · May 16, 2016

I am not acting like anything. I am stating outright that the OP keeps returning to the idea that the school is to blame for these really good students not passing the exam when the question at this point should not be "who is at fault" but instead "what did those people do to pass that I didn't and can I now do whatever they did so I can pass?" When most people have succeeded and few have failed, it is up to the few who have failed to determine what they are doing wrong and what they need to change so they too can succeed.
You are saying essentially the same thing but keep getting stuck on insisting the school might not be to blame. It really doesn't matter in the end does it? Take a cue from the successful students and stop trying to place blame anywhere but on the people who failed, if 3/4 of students somehow learned to pass, then the 1/4 who claim to be good to excellent students should be able to learn that too.
Three out of four students did pass that exam, so whatever the 1 out of 4 that failed the exam is doing is obviously not sufficient. They need to figure out what 3 out of every 4 students obviously already did figure out, which is what they needed to do to pass!
I'll just return to my point that you can't just simply accept responsibility for everything and overcome disantages. You can do your best to overcome disadvantages (like a crappy school or crappy instructors) but it is not always a matter of hard work.

Quota, BSN, RN · May 16, 2016

I'll just return to my point that you can't just simply accept responsibility for everything and overcome disantages. You can do your best to overcome disadvantages (like a crappy school or crappy instructors) but it is not always a matter of hard work.
If hard work can't overcome poor instruction/schooling then something else was going to trip these students up anyways. If you are a smart and successful student you can overcome the instruction gap with hard work. If these students are repeatedly failing the fault lies with them.

Extra Pickles · May 16, 2016

I'll just return to my point that you can't just simply accept responsibility for everything and overcome disantages. You can do your best to overcome disadvantages (like a crappy school or crappy instructors) but it is not always a matter of hard work.
Correct! Which is exactly why not everyone who attempts the NCLEX passes it, not everyone who enrolls in nursing schools graduate, and not everyone who wants to become a nurse can and does.
If she cannot overcome whatever the obstacles were that were also in place for the other 75% of her class, then perhaps she cannot become a nurse. Maybe you are right and it doesn't matter how much work she does, she will not be able to pass the exam. If that is the case, she still must take the responsibility, as in I Tried My Best But I Failed. To have her talk about lawsuits and how the school is to blame for something that may be an impairment on her part, or if you prefer an inability to overcome whatever obstacles are thwarting her success, is not reasonable.

Horseshoe, BSN, RN · May 16, 2016

But there is no evidence that the 25% didn't work as hard. Numbers don't mean anything on their own. There are always several ways of explaining data. You don't just get to assume that the data is a certain way because it is convenient. This is basic experimental design.

True. Perhaps the school is accepting students who are inherently weaker at standardized tests than accepted students at other higher performing schools. In that case, it IS the school, but not the actual academic program.

alli. · May 19, 2016

Why are you all fighting? A bunch of professionals bickering at one another? How about you take a look at it objectively and be kind or at the very least polite? I do believe the 75% of passing students are at the their own hardwork with the resources the school provides. Ultimately it is always up to the student to ensure if they have any difficulty to study even harder and ask for help. That's it. Seriously. I can't believe all of your are RNs. You sound like a bunch of teenagers.

Zyprexa_Ho · May 19, 2016

The trouble with the "just work hard to overcome crappy schooling" train of thought is that when NCLEX rates drop, BONs don't sanction students. They sanction schools. Yes, some independent hard work is necessary to make it through any kind of school, but the primary burden is on the program to teach well, have clear expectations, etc.

mrsboots87 · May 20, 2016

The trouble with the "just work hard to overcome crappy schooling" train of thought is that when NCLEX rates drop, BONs don't sanction students. They sanction schools. Yes, some independent hard work is necessary to make it through any kind of school, but the primary burden is on the program to teach well, have clear expectations, etc.

This is exactly why a test like HESI exit, or the Kaplan or ATI versions are used by some schools before graduating their students. To ensure high NCLEX pass rates so they do not get board sanctions and risk losing accreditations. The real problem could then be blamed on the BON or accrediting bodies for valuing NCLEX pass rates so highly over attrition rates. this could just go further and further away from being the students fault.

But it none of that matters. Who's fault it is is a matter of each persons subjective view. Only the student can control how they study and what they consider working hard. If that is not enough to pass a standardized test then so be it. It doesn't become anyone's fault except the student for just not studying hard enough, or not being good enough at that type of test, or whatever the reason it. And this is coming from a student who failed HESI exit but was lucky enough to go to a school that didn't require it for graduation.

rzyzzy · May 21, 2016

Lol.. People are missing the biggest point of all here - hesi doesn't have a "passing" score, and if it did, it wouldn't be 925. 850 on the hesi RN exit exam correlates to a 97% chance of passing the nclex on the first try. So many of the "failures" @ below 925 would breeze right through the nclex. Most people who score in the 750+ range on the hesi don't have a problem with the nclex, as long as they continue taking practice questions until they take the nclex.

mrsboots87 · May 21, 2016

Lol.. People are missing the biggest point of all here - hesi doesn't have a "passing" score, and if it did, it wouldn't be 925. 850 on the hesi RN exit exam correlates to a 97% chance of passing the nclex on the first try. So many of the "failures" @ below 925 would breeze right through the nclex. Most people who score in the 750+ range on the hesi don't have a problem with the nclex, as long as they continue taking practice questions until they take the nclex.

Technically it does have a passing score. The HESI will generate a percentage (forgot what it's called) that can be used to give a grade value to the score you receive. The passing score would be whatever it takes to achieve a passing percent for each program. Further, programs set a score intended to pass. So that would technically be a passing score. Albeit not a HESI one.

However this whole argument over potato potahto in the thread is getting ridiculous lol. Someone failed. Who cares who's fault it is as it will change nothing for anyone involved.

applesxoranges, BSN, RN · May 21, 2016

Poor grammar, rude, and you're a Nurse Practitioner??
Says a lot for the quality of NPs lately.
ETA: Just read through your other posts. Praying you are far, far away from where I am.

Supposedly they are trying to get into med school.

Another factor that no one seems to have asked yet is what is the class size? Is it 100 students? Is it 10 students? Is it 4 students? I would guess more than 4 students but 25% not passing isn't as surprising with a smaller sample size. My nursing school had around 160 students graduating between the two campuses but a lot of schools have a smaller graduating class. 20 students with 5 not passing is not as dramatic as 25 students not passing out of 100.