Vegan Diet - Healthy?

[Lily C.]

Today I was talking to a preteen and her mother about nutrition, and her mother explained that the family follows a strict vegan diet (no dairy, eggs, or meat). The mother was actually a raw vegan or raw foodist, and she only eats unprocessed vegan foods that have not been heated above 115 degrees Fahrenheit. Do you think a vegan diet is healthy enough for growing kids and teenagers?

P.S. I am not criticizing any type of alternative diet as I am a lacto vegetarian (no meat or eggs, yes dairy).

[Tweety, BSN, RN]

Tweety, is it safe to assume that you are vegan?

No, I'm a hippocrite. I advocate the vegan lifestyle, but am more of a flexitarian. I eat most of my meals at home and pack my lunch and those meals are always vegan. I buy leather free shoes and belts, and use vegan soaps, candles and plant-based household cleaners that arean't toxic. I even go so far as to choose gum without glycerin and mints vitamins without a gelatin capsule. My dogs are vegan as well. However, when eating out I dabble in ovo-lacto vegetarian fare when available, and if not convenient even eat meat. Thus I stay away from labeling myself. As the holidays have ended and there are less sweets and parties I tend towards vegan more than during the holidays.

Again, I acknowledge my own hippocrisy.

Over the last 15 years, I've become relatively well-educated on vega/vegetarian nutrition. It's actually not hard to get good nutrition - variety is the key - lots of fruits and vegetables, whole grains (breads, pasta, brown rice and things like quinoa), beans and legumes to include lentils. and soy products like tofu and tempeh, healthy fats like olive and canola oils, avacodo and nuts. I take a vegan multi-vit and includes B12, and supplement with a vegan-made omega3 fatty acid with DHA. Living in Florida there's plenty of sunshine for me to get while walking the dogs several times a week.

I think if you are eating healthy things in place of the dairy, eggs and meat, then yes, it can be okay. I say this because my 4 year old son has severe food allergies. He's allergic to dairy, eggs, wheat, peanuts and used to be soy--but just outgrew it. He's doing great. I just make sure that he receives a healthy, balanced diet with plenty of protein and good fats---and good vitamin supplementation as needed.

I have a coworker whose daughter is extremely allergic to dairy and eggs. Her mom breast fed her. She's so allergic the mom couldn't even eat eggs or dairy during breastfeeding. The child is now four, extremely healthy and hasn't outgrown her allergies yet, and thriving without dairy. It takes a little work and commitment from mom.

[patrick1rn, MSN, RN, NP]

I am not a vegetarian, I like to eat meat, meat is good.

But, yes a person can get all their nutritional needs met through eating a raw vegetarian diet. Different strokes for different folks. Come let us join hands together. I guess that means that these vegans can drink ETOH products like at the Catalina Wine mixer

[Rascal1]

I'd be concerned about the lack of calcium as well as the lack of variety/types of it. There are multitudes of causes of calcium being leeched from our bodies in addition to our different abilities to absorb it. I also, would worry about the lack of complete protein quality. Moderation and variety support a healthy lifestyle.

[talaxandra]

calcium

animal fats and a protein-heavy diet are leading causes of calcium loss,, along with a high sodium diet (which goes hand in hand with a highly processed diet).

according to this article, 60% of bone density is genetic, and ca++ fortified foods are as valid sources as milk.

and according to this article:

sources of well-absorbed calcium for vegans include calcium-fortified soy milk and juice, calcium-set tofu, soybeans and soynuts, bok choy, broccoli, collards, chinese cabbage, kale, mustard greens, and okra. grains, beans (other than soybeans), fruits, and vegetables (other than those listed) can contribute to calcium intake but cannot replace these key foods.. when you realize that there is as much or more calcium in 4 ounces of firm tofu or 3/4 cup of collard greens as there is in one cup of cow's milk, it is easy to see why groups of people who do not drink cow's milk still have strong bones and teeth.

set risk factors for osteoporosis are: small build/frame, being female, increasing age, heredity, race (higher incidence for caucasian and oriental heritage), early-onset menopause.

variable risk factors: cigarette smoking, elevated alcohol intake, physical inactivity (particularly lack of weight-bearing exercise), long-term immobility (placing it here's a little harsh but it's not always the result of forces outside an individual's control), inadequate calcium intake and insufficicient vitamin d.

protein

all 'complete' protein means is that all the amino acids needed are contained in one food source. you can quite easily meet all amino acid needs through combining different vegetable sources (eg beans and rice, peas and corn) - that's part of the reason for a lot of traditional food pairings in primarily meatless cultures. you don't even need to eat them at the same time, provided all nine essential amino acids are taken each day.

other complete protein combinations include: peanutbutter and wholegrain bread, humus (chickpeas and sesame seeds), bean soup with toast, fofu and rice, vegetarian chili and a roll. too easy!

[Tweety, BSN, RN]

I also, would worry about the lack of complete protein quality. Moderation and variety support a healthy lifestyle.

Agree that moderation and vareity support a healthy lifestyle. I'd be happy if people ate more than one or two vegetables a day. How many people do we all know that eat a variety of fruits and vegetables? I polled my nursing class in my Stats course and myself and one other person out of 30 eat more than two servings of vegetables a day.

However, "complete" protein is not a concern for vegans at all. Vegans get complete protein. While no one food other than soybeans and quiona are "complete", meaning they have all the essential amino acids, vegans are not protein deficient unless they are calorie deficient. By eating grains, legumes, soy and nuts vegans get "complete" protein. Most all foods have amino acids, so if a vegan is eating adequate calories they are going to get them all. It's not necessary to have complete protein in each meal. Variety is the key. Westerners tend to be overly concerned with protein, but actually meat eating Americans are getting much more than necessary.

[ToxicShock]

I have read a lot of really good information about veganism, and as a new vegan, I am thankful for the info! :)

I was vegan several years ago but I stopped with the diet because I was doing it incorrectly. Now that I'm older, wiser, and more independent, I am able to do it right and I feel great! Not only do I believe that my health is improving, but I also feel better on a spiritual/moral level.

What are we supposed to do with the animals we're not using for food? Should we let all the cows and sheep die out or is it OK to use them for leather and wool?

The problem that I have (as most other vegans have) is with the way that animals are treated in factory farms. The conditions are deplorable, inhumane and cruel.

If left alone, cows and sheep will not "die out" because they will still be able to reproduce. When they die of natural causes and live on cruelty-free farms where they have enough room, aren't force fed chemicals, and are treated with the dignity and respect that ALL living creatures deserve, only then would I be comfortable with their carcasses being used as leather or food. I would not personally buy the leather or food because I feel that eating and using animals is morally wrong, regardless of the conditions, but I would feel much better about others using them.

I went to a raw food restaurant when visiting out in California and it was delicious but don't know if that would satisfy me in the cold climate where I live. Is there a vegan philosophy or do people just try it.

I'm not familiar with the whole raw food thing, so I can't really answer this. To my knowledge, the vegan philosophy (if there is one) has nothing to do with raw foods. According to the American Vegan Society, veganism is defined as "...living solely on the products of the plant kingdom, to the exclusion of flesh, fish, fowl, animal milk, and all dairy products (cheese, butter, yogurt, etc.), eggs, honey, and all other foods of animal origin. It also excludes from animal products such as fur, wool, leather and silk, notably items of clothing. Vegans also usually make efforts to avoid various less-than-obvious animal secretions, oils, etc., used in many cosmetics, toiletries, household goods, and other everyday commodities. Veganism encourages finding and using alternatives for these and all other materials from animal sources. Vegans may be described as those who have taken the next logical ethical steps beyond basic vegetarianism." Whew! Hope that helped

[Purple_Scrubs, BSN, RN]

I don't get the dairy thing. All creatures need calcium for bones, right. So why do we not see elephants with osteo. They do not drink milk or eat cheese, except the mother's milk when they are babies. And that milk is produced by a plant eating animal. If the other much larger boned animals of the world can obtain enough calcium to prevent osteo without dairy, why can't humans do the same on a dairy free diet? I am not vegan or even vegetarian at this point, but I do not agree that we need dairy to be healthy.

[Flightline, BSN, RN]

I am opposed to most factory farming practices. I would change them if I could. I eat meat seldomly, and I only eat beef and fish. My wife is a classic vegetarian in that she eats dairy and eggs as well. We buy that Horizon milk and only cage-free eggs.

I choose to eat meat, because I want to be connected to carnivors like my dogs. I want that relationship with them. Nonetheless, in spirit, I honor the cow or fish who has died so that I and my dogs who live at the top of the food chain might live more easily.

A vegan diet is an inappropriate reaction to the suffering of animals. There is nothing a vegan does that eliminates farm animal sufferring. They aren't part of the demand so they don't decrease demand by not eating meat or eggs or milk. They don't buy cage free eggs, so they don't support that industry. They don't limit their meat consumption (they aren't part of the consumption at all), so they don't have a voice as a consumer.

I completely respect the classic ovo-lacto vegetarian, however. That is probably the intended diet of human beings (other wise we'd have huge canine teeth like my dogs do). We are, of course, omnivours. I would be a classic vegitarian, but like I said, the occasional beef or fish I share with my dogs is very important to me in a spiritual sense.

[Atheos]

I've been doing the vegetarian thing for awhile. I tried being a vegan but it is more than just a way of eating. It's an entire lifestyle and gets way too complicated for me.

I feel bad for the animals but after awhile I lose interest in their suffering.

Not eating them will have to do.

However, I see people mentioning the Raw Foods diet. I DO follow that to an extent. I still cook my rice because soak softened rice doesn't do it for me but really it's just not cooking your veggies. Opened up all kinds of new ways to prepare dishes that I never thought of before.

It also leads to more variety like Tweety mentioned. Variety is essential.

Plus, sprouting your own seeds is kinda fun and who knew you could eat grass??? I've been using wheat grass in EVERYTHING lately. :)

ETA:

I eat about 6-8 pounds of fruits and veggies every day on top of the other things I eat.

In fact, I don't eat any more...

I graze...

[Tweety, BSN, RN]

I am opposed to most factory farming practices. I would change them if I could. I eat meat seldomly, and I only eat beef and fish. My wife is a classic vegetarian in that she eats dairy and eggs as well. We buy that Horizon milk and only cage-free eggs.

I choose to eat meat, because I want to be connected to carnivors like my dogs. I want that relationship with them. Nonetheless, in spirit, I honor the cow or fish who has died so that I and my dogs who live at the top of the food chain might live more easily.

A vegan diet is an inappropriate reaction to the suffering of animals. There is nothing a vegan does that eliminates farm animal sufferring. They aren't part of the demand so they don't decrease demand by not eating meat or eggs or milk. They don't buy cage free eggs, so they don't support that industry. They don't limit their meat consumption (they aren't part of the consumption at all), so they don't have a voice as a consumer.

First let me say that I respect everyones right to choose whether to eat meat or not and respect everyone's opinion.

I will respectfully disagree that vegans don't make a difference in animals lives. A meat eating person who goes vegan decreases demand by one person. Right now vegans are an extremely small portion of vegetarians who are a small portion of overall society, so the economic impact might be small. It's not just each individual's buying habits that make a difference, it's also collectively doing things - such as getting Morningstar to eliminate eggs in some of their vegetarian foods impaction hundreds of thousands of hens, or getting cosmetic companies to stop testing on animals, or designers like Calvin Kline to not include animal skins in their designs.

I think veganism is a perfect response to animal suffering. Also, I'm not going to say to my beloved dogs "you're higher on the food chain and this animal was tortured and suffered so you can eat". Thus my dogs are vegetarians (definitely will not debate this on a nursing board. :)) That also is part of my Unitarian Univeralist belief of our interconnectedness, etc.

Again, I'll not get defensive or debate, just respectfully disagree while allowing you to hold your opinion and beliefs. Thanks for listening.

[Susan9608]

They aren't part of the demand so they don't decrease demand by not eating meat or eggs or milk. They don't buy cage free eggs, so they don't support that industry. They don't limit their meat consumption (they aren't part of the consumption at all), so they don't have a voice as a consumer.

I"m a vegan, because I'm an animal rights activist. Being a vegan makes a very strong statement as an animal rights activist because you are boycotting a system that exploits animals for human gain.

"Cage-free" and "Cruelty-free" sound great - very comforting - but the fact is that free range animals are most often sent to the same cruel slaughter houses that "factory farmed animals are sent to. The same killing methods are utilized on those animals as well.

Cage free hens may not spend their lives in a tiny cage, but they don't necessarily spend their lives living outdoors, in a natural environment. They most likely still have their beaks cut off (to prevent them from pecking each otehr to death) and they are still crammed by the thousands into sheds, where the live in manipulated lights, in piles of their own excrement, overwhelmed by the smell of ammonia.

Unless you've personally visited a "free-range" or "cruelty-free" farm and seen the animals living out in the open, eating natural, healthy, antibiotic, pesticide, and hormone-free foods, then you have to take labels like that with a grain of salt. Those kind of labels are a kind of social cause marketing and are very manipulative.

Vegans boycott the use of animals, so they absolutely do have a "voice as a consumer." They use their voice to tell manufacturers that they will not support anyone that exploits animals, and they take their business - thus their $$ - else where.

I intend to raise my children as vegans. My sister is vegan. She has raised her two sons as vegan. They are both extremely healthy.

[Susan9608]

I am opposed to most factory farming practices. I would change them if I could.

I just have to comment on this, even though it may be beyond the scope of this forum. You absolutely *can* help bring about an end to factory farming, if you truly care enough to put some effort into it. Boycotting companies that participate in factory farming by any means - even down to the lard, bone char in sugar, leather in your clothing, etc. - and letting those companies know why you are taking your business elsewhere is a good start. Also, writing to your legal representatives and encouraging them to vote in favor of animal friendly legislation and, of course, voting in favor of animal friendly legislation yourself is an excellent advocacy point. And sharing your point of view and information with others is important as well, for how else will the word spread? If nothing else, contribute financially to groups willing to lobby for animal rights.

Advocacy is all about action ... nothing will change is no one does anything but wish and hope that things will be different.