To Vaccinate Or Not To Vaccinate, That Is The Question

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Vaccinate or Die!!!

What fears and/or objections have you, personally, or as Nurses caring for your patients, encountered when it comes to vaccinations?

I thought it was interesting, too! I didn't specifically mention childhood vaccines - I was speaking generally as you asked about my concerns. And yes, of course there are aspects of immunology we don't understand - I was answering the other poster's question since she asked. I also never said I disputed stacks and stacks of research, and did say right off the bat that I do advocate for vaccines. I'm not trying to argue with anyone. So I'll sign off at this point. Everyone have a great evening!

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Specializes in orthopedic/trauma, Informatics, diabetes.

having two kids with Type 1 diabetes, there is a HUGE debate about vaccines (of course there is no rhyme or reason to why someone has an autoimmune trigger). One of my children was dx at 2, one at 14. Neither were sick. No family hx on either side (I did have gest diabetes and ended up T2).

People clamor that there is a cure "hidden from the public" so big pharma can make all this money off T1 people (< 0.05% of the population is T1).

I have not held any vaccines from my sons. They have both had HPV vax. Oldest has just finished meningitis. series. I just got the newest Shingles vax. I am a believer of vaccination.

Other than some one who has a true allergy (like to eggs w/flu shot) I don't understand why people don't get vaccinated. We have seen in historical records that more people died before vaccines. It's a no-brainer to me. The flu or chicken pox could kill my children.

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Specializes in OB.
1 hour ago, Coopsalot said:

I thought it was interesting, too! I didn't specifically mention childhood vaccines - I was speaking generally as you asked about my concerns. And yes, of course there are aspects of immunology we don't understand - I was answering the other poster's question since she asked. I also never said I disputed stacks and stacks of research, and did say right off the bat that I do advocate for vaccines. I'm not trying to argue with anyone. So I'll sign off at this point. Everyone have a great evening!

Not arguing, just having a conversation.

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Honestly, its not as simple as so many people make it seem. Its too bad that like the poster said, it's such a "hot topic" that there's no discussion to be had. Many nurses love to just spit out facts that their teachers told them and aren't open to any conversation. This is the opposite, in my opinion, of what nursing should be about.

There are many many concerns and blindly pushing vaccines is dangerous. Please note, I am PRO- Vaccines and they are a wonderful thing.

For example, their scheduling. You still get herd immunity if a child gets it at age 4, rather than 8 months. Are you giving the infant a chance to develop ANY innate immunity? Yet, we are pushing Hep B vaccines on infants? Funny stuff.

Flu vaccine, don't even get me started. Complete money-grab.

Even for the "more serious ones" like polio and MMR, there are arguments to be made.

What it comes down to is that the medical community has lost (probably rightfully so) the trust of the general population, and vaccines are just a trigger point for it.

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It does not look anyone has posted a different opinion yet, so I guess I will. Personally, I am not vaccinated and have not had any vaccines since nursing school. I also seldom get sick but I have noticed that the majority of the nurses that I work with all get sick and stay sick. They are also big proponents of vaccines.

There are probably several different ways that I stay “well,” including but not limited to: not consuming lots of sugar, I take buffered Vitamin C on a daily basis, exercise, etc. I also do the same with my own children. They are all perfectly healthy and have had very little vaccines.

Now as a nurse, that’s a different story. I pretty much keep my opinions to myself. I do not and could not work in a specific job where it is expected of me to vaccinate others, due to my own beliefs. It’s a better idea for me to not even go there.

I would like to see a large study of groups that are vaccinated vs. unvaccinated from birth to 25 years of age. This study should follow those individuals for an extended period of time looking for everything including but not limited to: cancers, neuro (any type), developmental delays, various disorders (e.g. autism, depression, etc.), obesity, fertility issues, etc. I think if we could all see something along this level and of this scale, this debate that we have every few months could be settled but something tells me, that’s not ever gonna happen.

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Specializes in Public Health, TB.
On 10/22/2019 at 10:37 PM, dholly2015 said:

I would like to see a large study of groups that are vaccinated vs. unvaccinated from birth to 25 years of age. This study should follow those individuals for an extended period of time looking for everything including but not limited to: cancers, neuro (any type), developmental delays, various disorders (e.g. autism, depression, etc.), obesity, fertility issues, etc. I think if we could all see something along this level and of this scale, this debate that we have every few months could be settled but something tells me, that’s not ever gonna happen.

And how will you conduct this study? It would seem unethical to withhold vaccines or give placebos to study subjects who want them. Will you withhold all vaccines? I have spoken to clinicians who have seen deaths from polio, tetorifice, measles, and whooping cough. Per their accounts, it isn't pretty. And even if anyone would allow these deaths, there would still be naysayers.

Plus you would need to account for environmental factors such as air pollution, diet, and social determinants of health.

Have you seen what happened in the Philippines earlier this year, when there was a massive measles outbreak? Parents had withheld MMR vaccine as a reaction to unethical action on the part of a vaccine manufacturer. Hundreds of children died this year as a result of not being vaccinated.

There are several ways I stay healthy too. I wash my hands, eat a balanced diet, take a Vitamin C supplement, avoid stress, and I get immunized.

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On 10/22/2019 at 11:13 PM, nursej22 said:

And how will you conduct this study? It would seem unethical to withhold vaccines or give placebos to study subjects who want them. Will you withhold all vaccines?

Why is doing a large study unethical? It would only be unethical if persons did not know they were or were not getting said vaccines. I am not suggesting placebos at all. We have a fairly large population of people in the US right now that would volunteer to partake in such a study!

There’s many out there that pick and choose which ones they want/don’t want at all, some decide they want to space them out (but my question is why do they do that if there’s nothing to be concerned about?), and others decide to forgo all together.

The US Supreme Court ruled in 2011 that vaccines are “unavoidably unsafe.” VAERS was created in 1986 under the Reagan Administration for vaccine compensation of injured children.

SUPREME COURT: The National Childhood Vaccine Injury Act of 1986

Recommended Adult Immunization Schedule

It is concerning to me that the Supreme Court made the above statement and that VAERS exists to protect large corporations, rather than children and adults. I also question how legally pneumococcal and zoster vaccines are somehow exempt from VAERS claims. If most knew that VAERS was selective and certainly would not cover everything “IF” they had an adverse reaction, would those same individuals go through with it? If there were a malfunction in anything else (e.g. a faulty car seat) pertaining to our children or adult in the US, one would at least have recourse. But the pharmaceutical industry is off limits.

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Specializes in RN.

I'm not (yet) a nurse -- applying to programs right now. But as a mom to two kids who are autistic, the fact that autism is this big "worst thing that can ever happen to my child" fear drives me bananas. I mean, there are challenges for sure. Yet there's a particular misunderstanding/intolerance around autism that makes things way harder for folks living with it, that's for sure.

From the parent-of-patient perspective, I've been pretty stunned by how dated many pediatricians' understanding of autism can be. My son's diagnosis was so delayed and he missed out on early intervention because his doctor thought autism "looked" a certain way, and my son would talk, smile, look at you. Not that I expect an MD to have thorough experience in neuropsychology, but the pediatrician has a unique opportunity to make a real difference for families in a positive way here.

I'll be curious to see, from a health professional standpoint, how all this goes. I don't plan to work with kids, but I can tell there are millions of adults living with autism who could benefit from this understanding, compassion and respect.

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Specializes in OB.

The CDC is not my "teacher." I believe what they say because they are a scientific organization dedicated to rigorous research to ensure public health. I'm happy to discuss anything, but I'm also happy to point out when others are wrong and spreading lies.

What is your rationale for your statement that a child developing "innate" immunity somehow protects them better than a vaccine and is therefore preferable? I hear this a lot and I have no idea where it came from. Vaccines protect us from what our innate immune system cannot.

If you're putting "more serious" in quotes to discuss polio and MMR, then this conversation is essentially over, because you've clearly no idea the devastating effects these diseases can have. BECAUSE, we hardly ever see them and have forgotten how devastating they are. BECAUSE OF VACCINES!!!

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9 hours ago, dholly2015 said:

Personally, I am not vaccinated and have not had any vaccines since nursing school. I also seldom get sick but I have noticed that the majority of the nurses that I work with all get sick and stay sick. They are also big proponents of vaccines.

You realize this means absolutely nothing and to imply otherwise is...sorry, I don't have any polite words to use.

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34 minutes ago, Wuzzie said:

You realize this means absolutely nothing and to imply otherwise is...sorry, I don't have any polite words to use.

How does it not mean anything? I am carrying on with the discussion, same as you. The OP asked for personal and professional opinions for pros and cons of vaccines. I gave my opinion just like you gave yours.

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Specializes in Practice educator.
8 minutes ago, dholly2015 said:

How does it not mean anything? I am carrying on with the discussion, same as you. The OP asked for personal and professional opinions for pros and cons of vaccines. I gave my opinion just like you gave yours.

No, it literally means nothing.

I have 3 friends who don't have a driving license who are never sick yet most of the people I know with driving licenses have been sick at some stage and stay sick. They are also big proponents of everyone learning to drive.

Its a completely nonsense discussion.

Its also most likely entirely fabricated.

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