"The Jesus Factor"

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A collegue of mine in the ICU is soon moving to Home Health for several reasons, both personal and otherwise. At the nurses station the other day, she and one of the doctors were talking, and she mentioned to him, regarding one of his patients, that "The Jesus factor was all squared away". This co-worker is a very active Christian and so is the MD in question. I asked her what that meant and she said that she liked to make sure where people were going when they die. She said that that was one reason why she wanted to do home health and hospice, was to help people find Jesus before they die.

She is an awesome, awesome nurse, but I was always thought that this is not ethical. I would never discuss religion with a patient unless they wanted to and I don't think it's correct to try to convert them. She's basically going to be evangelizing her Home Health patients. I find that disturbing.

Specializes in Cardiac Care, ICU.
I think, again,that the key here is support of the patient, whether it be answering their questions, holding their hand, or praying with them at their request. "Finding God"/faith with your last minutes of physical life is not even possible, in my own opinion. I always had trouble with that , that all of a sudden, you can ask for and receive forgiveness and eternal life. BUT THAT IS A PERSONAL PROBLEM.I just strive, to the best of my ability and understanding, to provide what the patient needs and wants of me tobe able to die peacefully without fear,not alone, free from judgement and with my support to the end.

I agree w/ you, Purple, about being there to support the pt and comfort them and their families no matter what their beliefs are. Hey, but don't forget about the thief on the cross. He asked, Jesus answered and the rest is Biblical history! ;)

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I have to say that like llg, I am getting increasingly frightened by some of the responses I am reading.

At this point, I'm on page 9 of what looks like a whole lot more to go in this thread. And I'm feeling this as well.

I see several people writing that they believe it's their obligation to spread the word of Jesus, to help people to find him, etc etc. And I know this to be true of Christians in general, and there is nothing wrong in any of that, in my mind. However, there IS a time when it becomes wrong, and that's in a setting in which you have sworn (albeit symbolically more than legally) to uphold a patient's desires above your own, and to be an advocate for the patient before anything or anyone else.

The problem I can see here with those who say they would never consider beating anyone over the head with the bible (figuratively!) is that SO MANY of them don't KNOW they are DOING EXACTLY THAT.

I have had the misfortune of speaking with those who were absolutely certain that "all they did" was casually discuss their beliefs, and that if anyone didn't want to listen, they certainly weren't captive. Oh, really? Those same people certain that they weren't crossing any line were so far over the line they couldn't hope to see it again!

To a fervant believer (I'll use the term born-again since it does come into play more often), one who DOES believe that the only way to "save" someone is to have them accept Jesus as messiah, son of G-d, etc, it's usually not a case of someone just talking about their faith to a willing listener. It's frequently, too frequently, a case of someone talking to someone who does NOT want to hear it, and they can't TELL that. Sometimes, makes them even more persistent, in my experience.

Now make the "active participant" someone who is on her deathbed. Someone who isn't sure of alot of things, is worried about alot of things, and here's someone who just won't drop the Jesus thing. Someone who won't let it go, because that patient once asked "oh, you're Pentacostal?" or some such comment. That was enough of a green light to get preached the gospel, when she really just wished the nurse would shut up and ask about how the patient's coming along today.

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I agree w/ you, Purple, about being there to support the pt and comfort them and their families no matter what their beliefs are. Hey, but don't forget about the thief on the cross. He asked, Jesus answered and the rest is Biblical history! ;)

Key point being "he asked" ;)

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Specializes in NICU, Infection Control.

I'm sorry. this is a little off-topic in this serious thread, but I was thinking about this thread and remembered when I was in nursing school (a Catholic one!). We were @ the State hospital for our psych rotation; a newly admitted pt came out of the day room when he saw the students arrive and announced to us, "Jesus saves!" One of my classmates said, "that's because he puts his money in the 1st Camden Trust".

Again, I apologize, now, back to your regularly scheduled debate....

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Specializes in Cardiac Care, ICU.
At this point, I'm on page 9 of what looks like a whole lot more to go in this thread. And I'm feeling this as well.

The problem I can see here with those who say they would never consider beating anyone over the head with the bible (figuratively!) is that SO MANY of them don't KNOW they are DOING EXACTLY THAT.

Oh, they know. I don't know many people of sound mind who honestly just can't tell when they are making people really uncomfortable. Unfortunatly there will always be people who are just bound and determined to make people see things their way. It is sad that we are all judged by their actions. When a police officer is caught doing something illegal it doesn't mean that all cops are crooked but, unfortunately, many will judge everyone in law enforcement by the actions of a few "hypocrites".

I've read the Bible cover to cover and can't find one example where someone was forced to believe. Jesus would often tell the Pharisees what they needed to do to get right w/ God but they always sought Him out and, if they rejected what he had to say, He was done w/ the conversation. That is a good model to follow everywhere. Wait until someone asks for your opinion, and if it is not well received, move to the next subject. (Actually that is pretty good advice for any subject, not just religion.).

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Specializes in Med-Surg.
I look forward to being the same way when I graduate. I by no means plan on preaching to my patients, BUT, I will let them know that I will pray for them and am there IF they need someone to talk to.

I guess I am thankful that the hospital I plan on working at is a Catholic based hospital. I don't see myself getting into too much trouble for being a Christian, if you happen to report me!

Ah.....I was just going to suggest that there are many hospitals where it is acceptable to for nursing staff to announce their faith and offer to pray with their patients. Florida Hospital where I'm getting my RN to BSN is a Christian operated hospital The nursing students there are required in their clinicals to offer to pray with patients.

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l.o.l @ prmenrs

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Specializes in Cardiac Care, ICU.
Key point being "he asked" ;)

That's what I said.

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Specializes in Cardiac Care, ICU.
I'm sorry. this is a little off-topic in this serious thread, but I was thinking about this thread and remembered when I was in nursing school (a Catholic one!). We were @ the State hospital for our psych rotation; a newly admitted pt came out of the day room when he saw the students arrive and announced to us, "Jesus saves!" One of my classmates said, "that's because he puts his money in the 1st Camden Trust".

Again, I apologize, now, back to your regularly scheduled debate....

LOL:lol2::lol2::lol2:

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That's what I said.

I know. ;)

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Specializes in Cardiac Care, ICU.
Ah.....I was just going to suggest that there are many hospitals where it is acceptable to for nursing staff to announce their faith and offer to pray with their patients. Florida Hospital where I'm getting my RN to BSN is a Christian operated hospital The nursing students there are required in their clinicals to offer to pray with patients.

I'm not surre I agree w/ that either. Not all nsg students are religious and forcing them to pray if they don't believe in a personal God violates their rights. I can see if they were instructed to offer to get someone to pray w/ the pt.

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Specializes in Med-Surg.
I'm not surre I agree w/ that either. Not all nsg students are religious and forcing them to pray if they don't believe in a personal God violates their rights. I can see if they were instructed to offer to get someone to pray w/ the pt.

They are a Christian College. This is understood hopefully when the students enroll. From my student handbook, which I presume is similar to the ADNs doing clinicals ".......the Dept. of Nursing provides educational experiences in a Christian environment to promote excellent in nursing........". Their philosphy is "through the profession of nursing we extend the healing ministry of Christ. The practice of nursing is a calling to exercise God's gift in a life of service to humanity. Faculty and students guided by Christian principals...................."

Surely someone who signs up to attend this school, having clinicals in a Christian hospital wouldn't have much grounds to object to the assignment in clinicals to offer to pray with their patients.

Classes sometimes begin with prayer, even our online live chats.

They are an NLN approved program BTW.

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