I traditionally have a thread heading to the election, here we go.
Get out the popcorn for this one.
Quote
Florida Gov. Ron DeSantis is expected to formally announce next week he is running for president in 2024, NBC News reported Thursday, citing two sources familiar with the matter.
The governor's official entry into the Republican primary field will put him head-to-head with former President Donald Trump, the party's current frontrunner for the nomination. Trump has already spent months treating DeSantis as his primary campaign rival, thrashing him with torrents of criticism over his gubernatorial record, his political skills and his personality.
There is a pdf of the actual platform language embeddedin the article. Please take a few minutes to read through it.
Lies about abortion in the 9th month have become a staple in Trump's campaign speeches. He lied about it at the debate too.
What's wrong with opposing late term abortions ? Apparently they never happen and would not happen. Late term abortions(in this context) do not fall under the category that emergency induction or c-section to save the woman's life or the baby. That's medical intervention and the goal is not to end the pregnancy /babies life. In these situations, every effort will be to save the baby as well.
I had an emergency c-section at 32 weeks, did I have a "Late term abortion"? No. I had one to save my and my babies life.
To say Trump or any republican would suggest I could not do that is propaganic fallacy fear mongering. And I have yet to hear any official republican bill that says otherwise.
I expect that the platform will be decided and finalized during the national convention where it's a project involving many voices. They will follow the usual algorithm to decide the party agenda. That's a bit of a contrast to the republican process in the era of Trump, which either neglects the platform altogether or simply dictates the platform to the delegates and members. Even the platform development of the RNC is becoming less democratic and more authoritarian in style.
It's good that conservatives agree with the platform since you didn't actually get a voice in its development.
There's nothing in the Republican Platform that is surprising, like the article says it's what Trump has been spewing out in the campaign.
Although really the idea that they want a national abortion ban isn't mentioned. It might be what they want but Trump, their leaders, has already said it's up to the states.
I think for the most part these platforms, by both parties, are hot air with unachievable promises, but that's what a campaign is, so I'm not mad.
I found an interview from 2007 where Biden opposed late term abortions. I think that the idea that pro-abortion activists want on-demand abortion up to the moment of birth needs to go away. I don't know one person that is for that.
In fact, according to the Republican Platform: after nearly four years of the Biden administration, America is now rocked by Raging Inflation, Open Borders, Rampant Crime, Attacks on our Children, and Global Conflict, Chaos, and Instability.
Specializes in NICU, PICU, Transport, L&D, Hospice.
Tweety said:
There's nothing in the Republican Platform that is surprising, like the article says it's what Trump has been spewing out in the campaign.
Although really the idea that they want a national abortion ban isn't mentioned. It might be what they want but Trump, their leaders, has already said it's up to the states.
I think for the most part these platforms, by both parties, are hot air with unachievable promises, but that's what a campaign is, so I'm not mad.
I found an interview from 2007 where Biden opposed late term abortions. I think that the idea that pro-abortion activists want on-demand abortion up to the moment of birth needs to go away. I don't know one person that is for that.
Trump and other Republicans continue to lie about late term abortions because the lies agitate the right wing voting base. It's exactly like the MAGA lies about election fraud, or an illegal immigrant crime spree or a variety of other social boogeyman topics; an exaggeration of a a tiny issue for the purpose of motivating conservatives. Trump's lies about late term abortion are ridiculous. I'm guessing that only cult members are gullible enough to believe that democrats support abortion after birth, as Trump confidently claimed in his debate rant.
Specializes in NICU, PICU, Transport, L&D, Hospice.
Crusades said:
What's wrong with opposing late term abortions ? Apparently they never happen and would not happen. Late term abortions(in this context) do not fall under the category that emergency induction or c-section to save the woman's life or the baby. That's medical intervention and the goal is not to end the pregnancy /babies life. In these situations, every effort will be to save the baby as well.
I had an emergency c-section at 32 weeks, did I have a "Late term abortion"? No. I had one to save my and my babies life.
To say Trump or any republican would suggest I could not do that is propaganic fallacy fear mongering. And I have yet to hear any official republican bill that says otherwise.
You should share a citation about late term abortions because it would be interesting to know where you fill your head with such silliness about them. You seem to be confused about the use of the medical term and your anecdotal experience and question about a cesarean section suggests that you have little didactic or practical experience in reproductive health care for women and expect that others here will be similarly confused.
I bet you believed Trump when he lied about abortions after birth, right?
You should share a citation about late term abortions because it would be interesting to know where you fill your head with such silliness about them. You seem to be confused about the use of the medical term and your anecdotal experience and question about a cesarean section suggests that you have little didactic or practical experience in reproductive health care for women and expect that others here will be similarly confused.
I bet you believed Trump when he lied about abortions after birth, right?
I wasn't talking about late term abortions. I was talking about medical intervention. When Trump talked about late term abortion, he is refering to elective termination of late pregnancy for other than medical intervention. Something democrats refuse to clarify.
It's a common left tactic to misrepresent republican abortion laws. Many use fallacies such as "a woman will not be allowed a intervention to save her life ". Or a woman "will be made to carry a dead fetus and get sepsis...".
So you don't have any evidence that republican bills would not allow an intervention to save the woman's life in early or late pregnancy?
Just ad hominiem attacks on my credentials? To deflect.
Anecdotal story? Don't you have family members who were at Jan.6, are friend's with muslium parents at school committees in which "conservatives were behaving badly " and a trans cousin or something? LOL.
There's nothing in the Republican Platform that is surprising, like the article says it's what Trump has been spewing out in the campaign.
Although really the idea that they want a national abortion ban isn't mentioned. It might be what they want but Trump, their leaders, has already said it's up to the states.
I think for the most part these platforms, by both parties, are hot air with unachievable promises, but that's what a campaign is, so I'm not mad.
I found an interview from 2007 where Biden opposed late term abortions. I think that the idea that pro-abortion activists want on-demand abortion up to the moment of birth needs to go away. I don't know one person that is for that.
I think one of the issues is that many democrats abortion bills are vague with general language.
They do not have term limits but mostly "between a woman and their healthcare provider should make the decision" For the health of the mother. Except "health" isn't defined.
Many democrats will not address this.
Late term abortions are rare but do occure.
"Access to abortions later in pregnancy has always been limited; there are few providers that offer the services and the costs are often prohibitive. Changes in the landscape of abortion access in the U.S. post-Dobbs has led to an increase in out of state travel for abortion services as well as an increase in delays. It is still unknown whether this has led to an increase in the share of abortions that are performed later in pregnancy". .
It should be noted that the phrase "late term abortion " used by Trump and conservatives, risk to the mother and severe fetal abnormality are not included in the "end late term abortion".
I think one of the issues is that many democrats abortion bills are vague with general language.
They do not have term limits but mostly "between a woman and their healthcare provider should make the decision" For the health of the mother. Except "health" isn't defined.
Many democrats will not address this.
Why should Democrats address an issue that they have said is decided between a woman and her provider.? Why shouldn't the healthcare provider be the one to define what's best for the health of the mother. Why does it have to be a politician?
Several states do permit abortions past 21 weeks which I guess is the definition of "late term abortions" so yes they do occur. This is not the same as on-demand abortion up to the time of pregnancy that some Republicans are fear mongering about.
Quote
Former President Donald Trump made false claims about late-in-pregnancy abortions during Thursday's debate with President Joe Biden, experts say.
Abortion is poised to be one of the biggest topics that will define this year's presidential election.
On Thursday, Trump repeated claims he made in 2016 regarding late-in-pregnancy abortions during a debate against then-presidential candidate Hillary Clinton.
He claimed: "They will take the life of a child in the eighth month, the ninth month and even after birth.”
Specializes in NICU, PICU, Transport, L&D, Hospice.
Crusades said:
I wasn't talking about late term abortions. I was talking about medical intervention. When Trump talked about late term abortion, he is refering to elective termination of late pregnancy for other than medical intervention. Something democrats refuse to clarify.
It's a common left tactic to misrepresent republican abortion laws. Many use fallacies such as "a woman will not be allowed a intervention to save her life ". Or a woman "will be made to carry a dead fetus and get sepsis...".
So you don't have any evidence that republican bills would not allow an intervention to save the woman's life in early or late pregnancy?
Just ad hominiem attacks on my credentials? To deflect.
Anecdotal story? Don't you have family members who were at Jan.6, are friend's with muslium parents at school committees in which "conservatives were behaving badly " and a trans cousin or something? LOL.
Abortions ARE medical interventions. Trump specifically spoke about abortions up to and after the birth and it wasn't even the first time, for pity sake. You can't explain that away. There's nothing to clarify other than why you are trying to make excuses for Trump's lies with ridiculous clarifications?
It's no fallacy when women's lives and health are literally at risk because of the abortion restrictions currently in place.
Yes. I have family and old friends who attended the events of January 6th. Yes, I know people in Michigan, some are immigrants from Palestine and Lebanon, and they shared what they witnessed at a local school board meeting with me. Yes, I have a transgendered grandchild.
I've also worked closely with recent immigrants and refugees and I have family members who immigrated from the USSR (Belarus and Ukraine) before the fall of the Society Union.
It's really cool how exposure to other people and cultures and ideas and other experiences leads to learning new information. It helps us to find common ground, common goals and common good.
The people of France and England just rejected the type of right wing authoritarianism that Trump is offering here. They lost big time and their right wing spokesmen weren't even a pathological liar and felon who tried to overthrow a fairly elected government.
Specializes in NICU, PICU, Transport, L&D, Hospice.
Crusades said:
I think one of the issues is that many democrats abortion bills are vague with general language.
They do not have term limits but mostly "between a woman and their healthcare provider should make the decision" For the health of the mother. Except "health" isn't defined.
Many democrats will not address this.
Late term abortions are rare but do occure.
"Access to abortions later in pregnancy has always been limited; there are few providers that offer the services and the costs are often prohibitive. Changes in the landscape of abortion access in the U.S. post-Dobbs has led to an increase in out of state travel for abortion services as well as an increase in delays. It is still unknown whether this has led to an increase in the share of abortions that are performed later in pregnancy". .
It should be noted that the phrase "late term abortion " used by Trump and conservatives, risk to the mother and severe fetal abnormality are not included in the "end late term abortion".
Which Democrat bills? I call baloney.
At which point in a health matter is it appropriate for the politicians to dictate the care?
Define late term abortion and tell us what the data specifically says about when and how often it occurs. Next we will talk about whether those are primarily elective vs necessary or medically recommended. I challenge your beliefs that there's any justification for your concern.
What's wrong with opposing late term abortions ? Apparently they never happen and would not happen. Late term abortions(in this context) do not fall under the category that emergency induction or c-section to save the woman's life or the baby. That's medical intervention and the goal is not to end the pregnancy /babies life. In these situations, every effort will be to save the baby as well.
I had an emergency c-section at 32 weeks, did I have a "Late term abortion"? No. I had one to save my and my babies life.
To say Trump or any republican would suggest I could not do that is propaganic fallacy fear mongering. And I have yet to hear any official republican bill that says otherwise.
What makes you think that your situation has any relevance to the myth of the "full-term" abortion? How does one even do "full-term" or abortion "after birth" (in Trump's words). A medical team woukd have to deliver a viable baby and then kill it. Who would do that? How could it be kept a secret? Medically, a late term abortion is anything after 24 weeks. It could be 24 1/2 weeks and be late.term. Geez, what nonsense that you are some kind of hero for delivering a 32 weeker. What woman wouldn't do anything to save a baby that they'd been carrying for 32 weeks? Do you think so badly of women?
Crusades
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What's wrong with opposing late term abortions ? Apparently they never happen and would not happen. Late term abortions(in this context) do not fall under the category that emergency induction or c-section to save the woman's life or the baby. That's medical intervention and the goal is not to end the pregnancy /babies life. In these situations, every effort will be to save the baby as well.
I had an emergency c-section at 32 weeks, did I have a "Late term abortion"? No. I had one to save my and my babies life.
To say Trump or any republican would suggest I could not do that is propaganic fallacy fear mongering. And I have yet to hear any official republican bill that says otherwise.