I see in the news that anti-choice organizations are planning demonstrations today at Planned Parenthood facilities around the US to support GOP plans to defund PP.
Of course, my first thought was to grab a sign (and my, ummm, "kittyhat"!) and head for my local facility to show my support for PP, but I also see in the news that PP offices are asking that supporters not show up at the facilities to counter-protest (because they don't want the crowds of protesters any larger or more chaotic than necessary as women are trying to get in and out for services).
Some communities are planning counter-demonstrations in other venues, but I haven't been able to find any information about any events planned in my city.
So, I've decided to set aside the time planned for the anti-choice demonstration in my city today to contact all my elected representatives, from the White House down to my state legislators, and Tom Price at DHHS, to remind them that I support PP and am strongly opposed to any efforts to restrict women's reproductive rights or Planned Parenthood's access to public healthcare dollars as a legitimate healthcare provider.
I hope PP supporters here will consider doing the same, and spread the word to people you know. I hope people all over the country will have the same thought. Wouldn't it be great if, while comparatively small groups of protesters are standing out in the cold and snow with their signs, huge numbers of Americans were flooding mail boxes and switchboards around the country with messages of support for PP, women's health, and reproductive rights?
The issue is societal, cultural. We do not live in a godless vacuum, an immoral universe, as many would have us believe.
We are going to answer to God for how we live here, for the choices we make. He is merciful and slow to anger, fortunately. Let us turn to Him while there is still time, before we enter His presence upon our death.
Yes, you are. If the problem is societal, then you will answer for claiming that, since you never personally defunded anything, you have no responsibility for the living conditions you are forcing on unwanted children and their mothers in the name of your god.
You will have to answer for usurping pregnant women's own moral judgement and force them to live according to yours, essentially disregarding their god-given free will.
Do do you think your god will buy the excuse of reverence for life when you allow children to starve in the richest country in the world? When you allow your lawmakers and your president to gut their healthcare and their schools, flood their streets with guns in the hands of crazies and thugs, poison them with bad air and even worse water (you being given dominion over the earth and all). What do you think he'll say when you whimper that you never personally defunded anything and besides, free lunches! (as if kids only have to eat when school's open). Free lunches ... i'm surprised you didn't throw in obamaphones.
One third of American families are working poor. Your diatribe by way of Judge Judy against shiftless takers with their hands out for freebies is not only ignorant but ultimately irrelevant, unless you demand that such shiftless people be forced to have children they don't want and are incompetent to raise.
As for all that cheap and effective birth control you think is so easily available, think again. PP has been around for a century, well before Roe v. Wade. The rabid war on PP has been going on since the beginning and is really more about preventing women from controlling their own reproduction than it is about abortion perse. So much for free will and personal responsibility.
Specializes in Mental Health, Gerontology, Palliative.
Speaking for myself and probably for a great majority of others, I have no idea what is happening except via news media. I expect most people don't unless they have children in the schools or are involved in a religious or other group and hear news among their acquaintances there. Or maybe through family or neighbors.
The story you related is, of course, horrible. But I knew nothing about it, so could not intervene. Did you know and step in?
Not in this case, this happened in Auckland and I was living at the other end of the country.
I have however stepped in other circumstances and wouldn't hesitate to do so again.
My hope is that the perpetrators get the same treatment at the hands of other prisoners, who often mete out some jailhouse justice.
One problem I have with our justice system is most offenders will eventually get out of jail. I'm more interested in ensuring these people don't wreck that destruction on someone else when they get out.
Unfortunately one of the people convicted of her murder has now had several more children taken off her at birth
I believe Nia is now in Heaven, where she is treated like the precious jewel that she truly is.
Nia lived most of her very short life in utter hell.
Society can argue that abortion is inhumane.
What is more inhumane is to put a child in a clothes dryer and turn it on. To kick, punch and slap that child, to kick, punch and body slam that child, put the child on the roof, hang them from the washing line and spin it until the child falls off and then put them back on the washing line and spin it again.
I think tubal ligations and vasectomies, even hysterectomies ought to be done at no charge for anyone who wants them - also for those who rape, molest, or commit other sex crimes, those with severe mental illness, and for those on welfare long term who already have a child or children they can't support. That is, they need food stamps, Section 8, Medicaid, or other welfare benefits for more than maybe 5 years and depend on the taxpayers to keep their children alive. Yet, there is always money for acrylic nails, hair stuff, cigarettes, and cell phones.
You .... you think poor people and those that are mentally ill should be forcibly sterilized!?
Living children get free or low cost breakfast and lunch at free public schools, not just on school days but also on weekends.
They get these during the summer, too, if they go to the free summer camps, not just the school year.
They might also get after school snacks if they are in post school day care, which is also free or low cost, depending on a family's financial circumstances.
There are free public libraries, scholarships to college based on finances, probably many other free things and services that I have not thought of just now.
There are free haircuts, free backpacks, free notebooks, crayons, pens, pencils, and markers, free Kleenex and shoes, free coats for living children.
These all come from sports teams, civic groups (Moose, Lions, Kiwanis) and other charitable or service organizations.
There is Medicaid for health care for living children, there is Section 8 housing and there are food stamps for them and their families. There are free or low cost bus passes, eyeglasses, and tickets to pro sports games.
There are free Christmas gifts from various groups and ministries.
Some people are foster parents and are thus involved with living children to try to help and nurture them.
Not everyone has the financial means, the health, the housing, etc. to bring children into our homes, but we are often involved with them in our religious or other organizations.
Not all of us know personally drug addicts or others with whom to get involved, as you or others suggest.
As for the Congressman, he showed his hypocrisy. Sometime or another we are all hypocrites.
By the way - all of the "free" things mentioned above are paid either by taxpayers or by private individuals or private groups.
I am stunned that you equate "free" services with placing a value on "living" children. The two are not related.
Yes, "free" services are everywhere and available to many people, not just children.
Placing a value on "living" children means they aren't kept in a home, with "parents" which is clearly unsafe because the state is overwhelmed with caring properly for these children.
Placing value on "living" children means that no child is forced to live with drug addicted "parents" or "parents" who beat children or otherwise threaten them because the state is overwhelmed with caring for these children.
Placing a value on "living" children means that aunts, uncles, grandparents, teachers, doctors and nurses report any mistreatment of children. It just isn't good enough to say: We didn't know. Somebody always knows, unless the child is locked in a closet, and usually a parent is aware of what is happening in that case.
The issue is societal, cultural. We do not live in a godless vacuum, an immoral universe, as many would have us believe.
We are going to answer to God for how we live here, for the choices we make. He is merciful and slow to anger, fortunately. Let us turn to Him while there is still time, before we enter His presence upon our death.
YOU may answer to God for the choices YOU made. However, since I don't believe in God, I will only have to answer to myself for my choices.
And believe me, I think about that in all that I do.
And the answer to my original question, which you didn't really answer is very simple:
It requires something from ALL of us in order to place value on living children. It requires NOTHING of us to attempt to control the lives and bodies of women we don't even know through anti-abortion laws.
Again, look at that so-called pro-life Congressman in PA. When the rubber hit the road in his own life, he was a supporter of abortion.
Not in this case, this happened in Auckland and I was living at the other end of the country.
I have however stepped in other circumstances and wouldn't hesitate to do so again.
One problem I have with our justice system is most offenders will eventually get out of jail. I'm more interested in ensuring these people don't wreck that destruction on someone else when they get out.
Unfortunately one of the people convicted of her murder has now had several more children taken off her at birth
Nia lived most of her very short life in utter hell.
Society can argue that abortion is inhumane.
What is more inhumane is to put a child in a clothes dryer and turn it on. To kick, punch and slap that child, to kick, punch and body slam that child, put the child on the roof, hang them from the washing line and spin it until the child falls off and then put them back on the washing line and spin it again.
Where you were at the time of Nia's torture is of no consequence. You knew about it and did nothing, just as you know about the other dozens, scores, hundreds, and thousands of children who are currently being starved, beaten, tortured today all over the world, yet you do nothing.
Humane, more humane, less humane. It's your fault because you are doing nothing to help these precious children. Distance and ignorance of them and having any other commitments are not excuses. That's what you told me. What's good for the goose is good for the gander. So get busy.
I am stunned that you equate "free" services with placing a value on "living" children. The two are not related.
Yes, "free" services are everywhere and available to many people, not just children.
Placing a value on "living" children means they aren't kept in a home, with "parents" which is clearly unsafe because the state is overwhelmed with caring properly for these children.
Placing value on "living" children means that no child is forced to live with drug addicted "parents" or "parents" who beat children or otherwise threaten them because the state is overwhelmed with caring for these children.
Placing a value on "living" children means that aunts, uncles, grandparents, teachers, doctors and nurses report any mistreatment of children. It just isn't good enough to say: We didn't know. Somebody always knows, unless the child is locked in a closet, and usually a parent is aware of what is happening in that case.
I am stunned by the defense offered.
You should have clearly communicated from the start what you meant by "placing a value". I think providing free and low cost things are related to caring about and trying to help living children. People do these things because they want to help alleviate want, trying to help kids feel happy and feel good about themselves. To me that says "value".
I still have no way of knowing what's going on in the homes of strangers, most of whom are hundreds or even thousands of miles away from me. So no, I did not and do not know unless I hear something on the news or from someone else. When issues have come to my attention at work about maltreatment of kids or elders or anyone more or less helpless, I have reported.
I really don't know what more you expect or want.
BTW, nothing I say will be good enough for you or correct because you hate me for being a Christian and for believing in God, Heaven, Hell, Salvation through Jesus, and because I don't think it's a good idea to go around burning, suctioning or cutting into pieces, drowning, and stabbing to death helpless pre-born babies who get no say whatsoever in what happens to them inside their mothers' wombs.
See on youtube Dr. Anthony Levatino.
The devil's best trick is to deceive you into thinking he doesn't exist and God doesn't exist.
Not only that, but he clearly believes that children deserve to be punished for the sins of their parents.
Frankly, the whole "welfare queen" excuse for cruelty to low income children was already old when Reagan first told that fairy tale.
Heron, I do not believe children should bear the punishment for the sins of their parents. I do not know why you would conclude such a think. I'm not sure the parents should even bear punishment for their own sins. The parents were likely victims, too.
My goal is not necessarily punishment but correction and uplifting each other. Rather, I'd like to see everyone forgive themselves and each other and start living right, making amends where possible - and it is often not really possible in a meaningful way.
BTW, nothing I say will be good enough for you or correct because you hate me for being a Christian and for believing in God, Heaven, Hell, Salvation through Jesus, and because I don't think it's a good idea to go around burning, suctioning or cutting into pieces, drowning, and stabbing to death helpless pre-born babies who get no say whatsoever in what happens to them inside their mothers' wombs.
I think I can safely speak for many here when I say that we don't "hate (you) for being a Christian" -- we simply don't care. That's your choice and you're welcome to it. What we object to is having your personal beliefs forced onto those of us who don't share them. If you are opposed to abortion, you are free not to have one. No one is going to make you, or even try to convince you that you should. But an awful lot of people in this country feel that they have some kind of right to force their beliefs about fetuses (which is what they are; there's no such thing as a "preborn baby," helpless or otherwise) and when life starts and what is or isn't okay to do regarding unwanted pregnancies onto those of us who don't share the same views.
You should have clearly communicated from the start what you meant by "placing a value". I think providing free and low cost things are related to caring about and trying to help living children. People do these things because they want to help alleviate want, trying to help kids feel happy and feel good about themselves. To me that says "value".
I still have no way of knowing what's going on in the homes of strangers, most of whom are hundreds or even thousands of miles away from me. So no, I did not and do not know unless I hear something on the news or from someone else. When issues have come to my attention at work about maltreatment of kids or elders or anyone more or less helpless, I have reported.
I really don't know what more you expect or want.
BTW, nothing I say will be good enough for you or correct because you hate me for being a Christian and for believing in God, Heaven, Hell, Salvation through Jesus, and because I don't think it's a good idea to go around burning, suctioning or cutting into pieces, drowning, and stabbing to death helpless pre-born babies who get no say whatsoever in what happens to them inside their mothers' wombs.
See on youtube Dr. Anthony Levatino.
The devil's best trick is to deceive you into thinking he doesn't exist and God doesn't exist.
I certainly don't hate you, because I don't even know you! You being Christian, Muslim, Jewish or Mormon has nothing to do with my impression of you.
By the way, I don't believe in the devil, either.
Personally, I don't think it is a good idea to drown, burn, beat, stab or shoot living children.
If this nation "valued" living children, the state in which I live (KY), wouldn't be among the Top 10 for neglect and abuse of living children.
heron, ASN, RN
4,660 Posts
Yes, you are. If the problem is societal, then you will answer for claiming that, since you never personally defunded anything, you have no responsibility for the living conditions you are forcing on unwanted children and their mothers in the name of your god.
You will have to answer for usurping pregnant women's own moral judgement and force them to live according to yours, essentially disregarding their god-given free will.
Do do you think your god will buy the excuse of reverence for life when you allow children to starve in the richest country in the world? When you allow your lawmakers and your president to gut their healthcare and their schools, flood their streets with guns in the hands of crazies and thugs, poison them with bad air and even worse water (you being given dominion over the earth and all). What do you think he'll say when you whimper that you never personally defunded anything and besides, free lunches! (as if kids only have to eat when school's open). Free lunches ... i'm surprised you didn't throw in obamaphones.
One third of American families are working poor. Your diatribe by way of Judge Judy against shiftless takers with their hands out for freebies is not only ignorant but ultimately irrelevant, unless you demand that such shiftless people be forced to have children they don't want and are incompetent to raise.
As for all that cheap and effective birth control you think is so easily available, think again. PP has been around for a century, well before Roe v. Wade. The rabid war on PP has been going on since the beginning and is really more about preventing women from controlling their own reproduction than it is about abortion per se. So much for free will and personal responsibility.
Yup, lots and lots to answe for.