Stop applying to the USA

Silverdragon102, BSN · Nov 30, 2008

What you have to remember is each country will have their own licensing exam and each country's nursing schools will work towards that exam. That is why you see current figures shows 45.6% foreign nurses will pass first time and average 87.3% of US nurses pass first time.

https://www.ncsbn.org/Table_of_Pass_Rates_2008.pdf

It is not a case of not applying to the US but be aware of retrogression and the long wait, maintain nursing experience whilst waiting and keep up to date on US issues. If someone is prepared to wait and continue in gaining nursing experience then I wish them well just be aware that things change and if your employer backs out then you will start all over again from PD

Ginger's Mom, MSN, RN · Nov 30, 2008

Alexk49 - many foreign nurses have english as a second language. Of course the passing rate for foreign graduates is lower than for US-born staff. That may not have anything to do with the quality of their education, but rather their ability to interpret the exam.
Valerie, this is true in many cases. HOWEVER - you can't tar all employers OR foreign nurses with the same brush. I was directly employed by a hospital - no agency involved. I can leave whenever I want with no penalty. I get an similar (actually higher) wage as my colleagues, due to my training and experience which was desired by my employer. I do not have to put up with poor conditions, pay or treatment (and indeed, I would not).
There is no doubt that there are unscrupulous agencies, healthcare facilities, immigration lawyers/consultants etc, and it's the foreign nurses' responsibility to find out the ramifications of their actions and to ensure those working for them are working in their best interests.
To say that "the only reason nurses are brought to the US from abroad" is that "It's cheaper" is simplistic, inaccurate and offensive.

ghilbert, I don't think you can compare yourself with your very specialized experience that 99% of US Nurses don't have. It is not fair to compare yourself to a graduate where English is a second language and Nursing is being practiced at 1960 standards.

Also you were not working in the US in the late 1980s and 90s when seasoned nurses with perfect resumes where let go while cheaper alternatives where sought. Hospital Managers where looking at the bottom line. For a hospital to import Foreign Nurses it is very labor intensive ( and probably more expensive now that Medicare is not covering the costs of recruitment), look at the issues Canada is having. And for what I have read, Canada is giving lots of support, orientation, and time several nurses are now being deported.

mauiboy · Nov 30, 2008

"It is not fair to compare yourself to a graduate where English is a second language and Nursing is being practiced at 1960 standards."

i wonder who these graduates are?

NurseCubanitaRN2b, BSN, RN · Nov 30, 2008

What am I, chopped liver?

Chop chop! Not liver at all....

allnurses Guide · Nov 30, 2008

ghilbert, I don't think you can compare yourself with your very specialized experience that 99% of US Nurses don't have. It is not fair to compare yourself to a graduate where English is a second language and Nursing is being practiced at 1960 standards.

Thankyou for agreeing with me. **I'M** not comparing myself with that - several posters on this thread have chosen to lump all "foreign" nurses in one basket as undereducated, inexperienced morons. No, you may not have used those words, but the implications were clear.

allnurses Guide · Nov 30, 2008

OK, let's examine the statistics. Percentage of US-educated nurses who passed the NCLEX in 2008: 82%. Percentage of foreign-educated nurses who passed: 36.8%
So your comments sound plausible until you dig a little deeper.
Here's where it gets interesting:
Percentage of Filipino nurses who passed the NLE in June, 2008: 43%
The majority of Filipino nurses can't even pass their own exam. That is clearly an issue with the "quality of their education." There can be no other explanation. If US-educated nurses had such an abysmal rate of passing the NCLEX, there would be a major investigation!

Are you actually disputing the fact that a person with English as a second language would have more trouble with an English exam? Are you actually ignoring the fact that foreign nurses taking NCLEX for the first time are from worldwide, not just the Philippines? PLease reconsider the facts and then let's discuss plausibility.

What language is the NLE exam taken in?

I think I'm done reading this thread. The ignorance, prejudice and just plain xenophobia being displayed is just unbelievable.

suzanne4, RN · Nov 30, 2008

Everyone slow down and take a deep breath. This thread has gotten completely off topic from what was being asked or discussed in the original post to this thread. And it specfically was addressed to those that are from the Philippines.

It is not even a point of the NCLEX exam, but the fact that there is only a passing rate of about 43% on the NLE as a start, that would be cause for issues in most other countries and the programs would be closed down. What the OP was trying to say is that with the known long wait for the US, it is better to have a Plan B and that is what we have been stating all along. Due to the large number of applicants and many without much in the way of experience of any type, it is going to be quite hard to get to the US.

You cannot compare a nurse frm another country that has years of specialist training in critical care with a nurse where even critical care is not practiced the same as a start. It is a world of difference and there still is a limit as the number of visas that are available per year. Those from Canada and Mexico can qulaify for a treaty visa called the NAFTA TN. Those from Australia can come here under the E-3. Everyone else needs to go thru the green card processing and this is where many are going to have problems.

When one is pobably looking at more than 7 years for the Philipines for a chance at a green card and minimal work available for them at home. it is really necessary to try someplace else if your goal is for nursing.

PhillyRN82 · Nov 30, 2008

Hey guys. Don't get too much emotional. Things would just end up to a boiling point when everyone stands to what they beleive and does not consider anyones opinion.

Let us just stick to what is real and with what is happening at present. No one forces you to stop applying for AMERICA. You always could. But the thing is, you must learn to accept the fact that anything might happen along the way. Job offers at any time may get cancelled when our economy is way too bad. And also, the waiting game is another issue. When one is planning to apply in USA and will just start now, then you are looking at a 7 or more years of waiting. This is what posters and moderators is emphasizing. This is for your own good. Why invest your money and time for something that is not certain while you can certainly apply for any other countries without having the fear of job offer getting cancelled and processing of visa is fast. Right?

Filipinos are smart people. YES I AGREE because I too is a filipino by blood, in fairness to me.hehehe

But the quality of nursing education is now a big question to me. The board exam passing rate is dropping over the years. The national passing rate of 43% is quite alarming. Philippine board of nursing must see this problem closely. This is a big shame. More and more students are taking up nursing and hospitals are very limited where they could have their practicum. So how in the world could these student nurses acquire good nursing skills??? come to think of it. And also, Nursing schools in the Philipines is like a mushroom scattering all over, having 60-70 students per lecture room definitely is a bad practice, surely not conducive for learning. And the Big question is, are the nursing educators/faculties qualified for the position? I think for a nurse to be a Clinical INstructor, one must be a MAN holder and I am in serious doubt if these Clinical Instructors posesses such.

We are not concern about the quantity of nurses Philippines may produce annually, what is most important is the Quality of education these nurses acquired during their studying years. That makes a difference. A drop in passing rate to 43% clearly implies that something is wrong and CHANGE must take place.

Godbless

Ginger's Mom, MSN, RN · Nov 30, 2008

Sometimes life has a strange way of rewarding people being in the right place at the right time. People who make lots of money in the stock market while others loose their shirts. Students who get accepted to one college or university despite the fact people with less qualifications get rejected. Why women who want to get pregnant can't and women who don't what to get pregnant do.

A few years ago it was much easier to immigrate to the USA, now the climate has changed. There are forces greater than you and me in place. Sorry the immediate future does not look promising.

To put all your career aspirations in one basket( the USA) is not going to happen anytime soon. And just as a women's body ages and she is unable to bear children, the more time that one graduates and time to immigration occurs, the hope one can be employable in the USA is going to happen.

Yes, I read how women in their 60s have babies but they are the extreme. Just as the chances of someone who graduate 5 of more years from nursing school and never worked as a RN getting a position in the USA.

Professionally, if I was in your shoes, I would try to get any experience you can, Suzanne has a thread create your own jobs. The hospice movement, VNA movement, Skilled Nursing Facilities and Parish nursing are all nurse driven organizations. In your area do these organizations exist? If not you have a perfect opportunity for you to grow your own job. If you put the efforts that you have put towards the NCLEX you will do well. If that is not for you find any job that will hire you as a RN.

madwife2002, BSN, RN · Nov 30, 2008

My view on this is How much money are you all paying to wait for a green card that may never happen?

Financially it could be very expensive to pay for something that only a few are ever going to get there.

Ginger's Mom, MSN, RN · Nov 30, 2008

Thankyou for agreeing with me. **I'M** not comparing myself with that - several posters on this thread have chosen to lump all "foreign" nurses in one basket as undereducated, inexperienced morons. No, you may not have used those words, but the implications were clear.

The majority of foreign nurses are new graduates with no nursing experience, of course there are exceptions to the rule. In your home country, one has to pay for a bridging program, which does seem to be the most logical and safe mode for a country to adopt new nurses. Sending new foreign nurses to a new country with little orientation is a recipe for unsafe nursing. Experienced foreign trained nurses are the exception not the rule.

Now domestic train nurses have to under go extensive newly licensed nurses programs it is becoming harder and harder for internationally trained new nurses to come safely to the USA.

Health care is changing at a rate that is ever changing, I have read and heard that many standards change every 5-7 years, there is no way a nurse who never practiced even if they where trained by Florence Nightengale could enter the workforce without an extensive refresher course.

PhillyRN82 · Nov 30, 2008

"Thankyou for agreeing with me. **I'M** not comparing myself with that - several posters on this thread have chosen to lump all "foreign" nurses in one basket as undereducated, inexperienced morons. No, you may not have used those words, but the implications were clear."

Well, I have to say that we have our own way of thinking. If you think the message implies the way you perceive it. Then be it. The truth hurts. Posts that are published here may sometimes seem to be harsh, but these are realities.

Yes, to draw generalization is quite dangerous and might attract critical comments from several members. But the truth lies in every words spoken is better yet appreciated than denying the real happenings taking place.

I suggest each and every Neophyt nurse out there, especially to my fellow filipinos, to set forth and gain good nursing experience in our country first before ever thinking of coming to USA, or any other place. Experience is a good source of confidence. I wonder how courageous young filipino nurses nowadays planning to come over here and practice nursing without having sufficient nursing experience. You are prone to unsafe nursing practice and might put americans in danger. You might as well be in danger when you'll commit mistakes due to lack of experience.

But again, there are also nurses with good nursing knowledge and skills and had pratice nursing for years already. These nurses are welcome. But again, with economic crisis going on, with news of job offers getting cancelled, with retrogression set. Things wouldn't be as easy as years and years ago.

Filipino members of this site may hate me for this. But I stand with what I perceived is right. And since this is a forum where opinion is highly being respected, might as well share my thoughts.

God Bless America.