Specializes in Home Care, Primary care NP, QI, Nsg Adm.
"By the way... How long is retrogression? 5-10 years or some such? If one studies full time (~4-5 hours a day + watching TV/listening to radio reading and talking in said language) with immersion techniques one can be considered technically fluent in Arabic in 42 weeks (yes, it is possible, I did it at the Defense Language Center). Spanish was 25 weeks, English was 62 weeks. Would I have to learn medical terms? Sure, but I still have a base. Many people that I have seen have no base in English.."
It would be great to use the above method to learn a language, but apart from it being job related, most people would hardly have the time, financial resources or place to do it.
I agree, if a nurse came to the States unable to speak English, they should not be on the job, but, are there nurses who can't speak English working in America?
The difference in Saudi, English is widely used by health care workers besides Arabic. There are many western physicians and others as well who don't speak Arabic. English is the international language at this time and widely used as the main medium of communication professionally and in Education so it is common to find it used along side another native language.
Interesting, the Ministry of Health put out a national policy manual a few years back. it was in English and I need it in Arabic for my staff. I asked for an Arabic translation. There isn't one.
It would be great to use the above method to learn a language, but apart from it being job related, most people would hardly have the time, financial resources or place to do it.
Every time I see them in the lounge speaking in whatever language I remind them that they could be using that time to practice.
I make appts for a dr office and there are several nurses that have thick accents that call. I have transcription experience with foreign drs (indian and romainian) so I think I have a pretty fair ability to comprehend what people are saying. My main problem with these nurses is not the accent alone but that they do not identify themselves and then they speak very quickly. When I ask them to repeat something they are the ones that tend to become rude. I know that this may not be a problem that everyone has, but it makes my job quite difficult. It is difficult enough to deal with hospital calls (nurses are always in a hurry and can be a bit short) but to add to that a thick accent and speaking very quickly it is a recipe for disaster. I do take extra time with these calls because I want to get the appt correct, even if this does frustrate the person on the line.
For the past two days we've had a new staff member who says has been working in theatre for years.
I cannot understand hardly a word this nurse says. Her accent is so thick that no one can understand her.
I also get the impression that she has trouble understanding us. She seems to be unable to follow basic instructions. She nods her head as though she understands then does the complete opposite. I'm happy to repeat myself enough times so the message is understood, I don't like it when someone pretends to understand when they clearly don't.
I have told her things more than 6 times, tried different means of explaining but she just doesn't understand enough English to grasp what anyone is saying. I have concerns that she is a danger to patients because she still cannot understand how to use the emergency call button even though I've told her twice now and no doubt will go through the whole thing again tomorrow :icon_roll
This nurse is such a burden on us all, it's making our job harder. I've had many nursing students who have never worked in the OR before that are miles ahead of this nurse. I'm starting to get very frustrated with her and it's starting to show. I know today that I spoke to her in a very harsh manner because it was a stressful list (a lap case had to be very quickly converted to open) I think it's unfair of anyone to expect us to teach her to speak English properly because we simply don't have the time for it.
Myself and my co-worker in general surg had to report her communication problems to the CNC today and request that if she works with us again, that another person is there with her to help her.
people you are making a big deal about language in jesus time everybody speaks the same lingua. But everybody wants their own way that is why we have different language now. I think we should just get along no matter what language you speak accent or with accent we still can understand each other capiz everyone. We should live by faith alone and not to be perfect.
people you are making a big deal about language in jesus time everybody speaks the same lingua. But everybody wants their own way that is why we have different language now. I think we should just get along no matter what language you speak accent or with accent we still can understand each other capiz everyone. We should live by faith alone and not to be perfect.
This isn't about getting along this is about speaking and understanding a language to communicate effective. Think about it this way if I were going to go to Spain to work for a few years, then I would learn fluent Spanish. I wouldn't expect them to speak English to benefit me. Also the same goes if you come to work in the USA, Canada, England, or Australia.
The above example given by Scrubby is a HUGE pt safety issue. We had a RN like that in our unit. The scary thing is he went onto CRNA school. I had a difficult time understanding him due to his thick accent as did his patients. We had many famlies refuse his care, not only because of him not speaking clearly but his practice. One night he had accidentally hung a isulin dirp as a IVPB. He didn't understand what he did wrong when he did that eventhough it was explained over and over by the other staff RN's. The pt sugar was like 15 after that, but he still told the staff he didn't do that and he clearly did, they even showed him and he didn't get it.
people you are making a big deal about language in jesus time everybody speaks the same lingua. But everybody wants their own way that is why we have different language now. I think we should just get along no matter what language you speak accent or with accent we still can understand each other capiz everyone. We should live by faith alone and not to be perfect.
Noooo we can't all still understand each other and that is a HUGE problem in a healthcare setting. Faith has nothing to do with this particular situation...well, unless you're the patient and pray like heck to get providers you CAN understand!
people you are making a big deal about language in jesus time everybody speaks the same lingua. But everybody wants their own way that is why we have different language now. I think we should just get along no matter what language you speak accent or with accent we still can understand each other capiz everyone. We should live by faith alone and not to be perfect.
For the record, in Jesus' time, people around the world spoke dozens of languages. In Israel alone, three were so prevalent--Hebrew (the language of the Jews), Greek (the "business" language and the primary tongue of non-military non-Jews) and Latin (the language of the Roman occupiers)--that all three were included in the sign placed at the top of the cross identifying Jesus as the King of the Jews.
No one should be harassed or ridiculed for speaking with a heavy accent. But the fact remains that accurate and effective communication is extremely important in a health care setting. Asking if we can't all just get along is a starting place for kindness and decency, but the next step--eliminating barriers to spoken language--still needs to be taken. It's just that if people are good to each other, that's more likely to happen.
Update: The new nurse has been placed back on orientation. One of the more seasoned nurses who hurt his back is going to preceptor her. This will hopefully give her some more time to pick up some more language skills and learn where everything is.
I actually feel a bit ashamed of myself now because by the end of yesterday I was clearly showing signs of impatience with her. She did apologise to me and I simply told her that it was not a good day for learning because it was so busy and that I'm not a good teacher (I'm still learning stuff myself!).
What really angers me is that obviously this girl had to attend an interview and went through an entire week of orientation with the OR educator. Her language difficulties should have been picked up during her interview and orientation. She must have thought there wasn't a problem and then they went and threw her into a very busy surgical and stressful surgical list. I really do think management and the educator have done the wrong thing by this girl and the rest of us.
This is the point I continue to make; whose accountable for hiring nurses with communication problems.
Don't shoot the messenger.
BAM!!
Am I understanding you to say that those nurses with communication problems are not responsible in any way?? Heck, I KNOW I can't speak Russian therefore I won't be seeking a nursing position in Russia!!
It's really quite simple: if someone doesn't speak, write, and read the language proficiently then please stay at home. Or don't be surprised when patients refuse them as their nurse.
Specializes in trauma, ortho, burns, plastic surgery.
comunication in health care field is and will be still a big issue. before to blame one or another, please go back at communication theories and practices, and you could see that the circle of comunication implies a lot of factors objectives - controlable and unfortunatelly and subjectives ones.
you could not blame a foreign nurse just for her accent, when on the other part, you refuse or you are in impossibility to listen to her/him.
you could not blame any one if the work place factors disturbe a good coomunication.
are so many factors implied in... just if you have bad intentions you will refuse to see what is really happen in real life.
communication here is impaired, and is a very bad think! is not to blame one each other and all against foreign nurses (guilty i am the one, looool), but we all need to resolve this situation... balanced, logical, with mind and heart involved.
and i am so sure that your father, or your grandfather, or your grandgrand father talked a poor bad accent english when their first came in us. and after time they improve their english. be good! they are people like you, i am people like you and we try our best!
making a hostile work environment beetwen foreigners and others, is not a constructive way to deal with and a big blame for other woanderfull americans that was one time in their family hystory foreigners also.
my americans, americans that are known by all other nations, appreciate hard workers and people who try hard to improve them self daily. my americans, the americans, are open and celebrate the hard work ones.
i have couple of woanderfull song for you guys...loooool...listen her improvements, her totally courage and crazyness to come again and again and sing the same song... because her heart is there. just i love this gurl!
foreign nurses was came here, fallowing them heart.... and for sure they speak a little better english than in this song, looooool. be good, be funny smiling, and love them, and them will give you back a good nurse like they are..... we are good people don't push us out just because of our accent and background! :lol2:
let's listen the valentina - ken lee phenomenon i am so sure that in couple of months she will speak much better, loooool.
:lol2:
Saifudin
234 Posts
"By the way... How long is retrogression? 5-10 years or some such? If one studies full time (~4-5 hours a day + watching TV/listening to radio reading and talking in said language) with immersion techniques one can be considered technically fluent in Arabic in 42 weeks (yes, it is possible, I did it at the Defense Language Center). Spanish was 25 weeks, English was 62 weeks. Would I have to learn medical terms? Sure, but I still have a base. Many people that I have seen have no base in English.."
It would be great to use the above method to learn a language, but apart from it being job related, most people would hardly have the time, financial resources or place to do it.
I agree, if a nurse came to the States unable to speak English, they should not be on the job, but, are there nurses who can't speak English working in America?
The difference in Saudi, English is widely used by health care workers besides Arabic. There are many western physicians and others as well who don't speak Arabic. English is the international language at this time and widely used as the main medium of communication professionally and in Education so it is common to find it used along side another native language.
Interesting, the Ministry of Health put out a national policy manual a few years back. it was in English and I need it in Arabic for my staff. I asked for an Arabic translation. There isn't one.