Senate passes health care bill

ybq2008 · Dec 21, 2009

I think the reform bill is a good start, but I agree with Otessa. Good for Big Insurance, bad for me. I hope that the bill continues to evolve to reach some sort of middle ground to satisfy all. But I'm happy to see that the uninsured will be served. Also, there is a plan within the bill to subsidize premiums for low-income families (i.e. the family of 4 with an annual income of $40,000 per year; reference: http://www.familiesusa.org/resources/tools-for-advocates/guides/federal-poverty-guidelines.html). However, for those slightly above federal poverty standards, the income gap will continue and deficits other areas will arise.

I believe that we will eventually adjust to the concept that we can't have nationalized health care without some price. We can definitely take a look at our big brothers and sister across the pond as examples. They pay upwards of 40% of their incomes to cover the costs of government programs like nationalized health care. They've had some time to adjust, as we will over the next 20 years. Social programs are hard. I'm sure the American people had similar arguments when the Social Security act was passed in the 1930s. But honestly, we have a foundation for nationalized health care and that's a great start. With our current spending levels on health expenses, we were going to bankrupt our system in the next 20-50 years anyway. Now that the uninsured have access the preventative care, we can begin to see less ER visits and healthier people. Isn't that really what matters most anyway?

P.S. Now all the ER nurses will actually have more EMERGENCY cases to treat instead of the headaches, belly aches, and pap smears. I don't know how many times I've heard that complaint... (lol)

lab211 · Dec 21, 2009

My concerns are the following;A. 30+ million new customers. We need more nurses/doctors,etc.??B. Will the middle class shoulder the majority of the cost, since this has been traditional? B. Diluted service delivery (Longer waits, increase in nurse:patient ratio)?C. Will the bill improve patient safety?D.Will working conditions/environment improve?D. Will the insurance companies dictate less health care delivery and have genuine compassion over saving dollars for themselves? What I am trying to understand, is the bill going to make health care delivery better for the average american? Insights and opinions appreciated.

Otessa, BSN, RN · Dec 21, 2009

Health Reform Subsidy Calculator

http://healthreform.kff.org/SubsidyCalculator.aspx

otessa

wlb06 · Dec 21, 2009

yah...i don't follow politics all that well and probably don't know enough about this as i should, but i would guess that there will be an increase in the need for nurses if more people are going to be givin care

HeartsOpenWide, RN · Dec 21, 2009

I need to check a source but I was listening to someone who gave an example of how much this will cost.
example:
Someone makes $54,000/year-they will pay approximately $9,000 out of pocket for insurance under the new government plan. How is this 'free'?

Its "free" for all of those that do not work. I am totally against this.

Study24/7 · Dec 21, 2009

My concerns are the following;A. 30+ million new customers. We need more nurses/doctors,etc.??B. Will the middle class shoulder the majority of the cost, since this has been traditional? B. Diluted service delivery (Longer waits, increase in nurse:patient ratio)?C. Will the bill improve patient safety?D.Will working conditions/environment improve?D. Will the insurance companies dictate less health care delivery and have genuine compassion over saving dollars for themselves? What I am trying to understand, is the bill going to make health care delivery better for the average american? Insights and opinions appreciated.

You and all those posting before make valid arguments. Some things to consider:

Where we are currently, nationally with Healthcare is inadequate. The real intention of this proposal is to "begin" the transition to a system which provides for a larger portion of the entire population of these United States. Seldom, if ever has legislation been created in our history that "perfectly" addressed the needs and the concerns of "we the people". By merely laying a foundation, adjustments can be made to "build" this reform into something providing more for the general population. I try to remind myself that while this will be done at an expense, the size and cost of which we cannot yet hope to know; to continue "status quo" would be irresponsible. We can banter back and forth about the costs, the consequences, the burden this will place on "we the people" but maybe we need to do several things: ask why is this only just now happening? Why isn't our government being more progressive and forward thinking? How are our representatives voting? How can I hold my representative more accountable?

If the costs are such that I must get by on less and pay more - who am I to deny shouldering part of the costs in order to help provide for some of my fellow countrymen. If we look into the very beginnings of this great country it was founded on the principle that in order to gain, rights, freedoms sacrifices have to be made. Trust me I do not have "extra funds" readily available to pay my share, but I will gladly make adjustments to my way of living in order to help provide healthcare to those currently unable to provide it for themselves.

For me it comes down to what is the right thing to do, the responsible thing to do. It has made me more aware of who represents me and how they are representing me. Maybe this is a wakeup call for all of us to get reacquainted with how we are being represented. Its never been easier to inform our representatives of where we stand, you can email, or call those that represent you. I will say this, before you complain to me or your neighbor- have you taken the time to let your your senator or congressman know your thought? If you haven't how do you know how you are being represented?

Again, I have no allegiance to any political party. Just my thoughts.

Otessa, BSN, RN · Dec 21, 2009

I am aware that costs will go up if we are to provide care for all BUT a 9 fold increase in out of pocket premium costs (!), according to the Health Reform Subsidy Calculator, this does NOT include copays, etc.

Many families with nurses will not qualify for subsidies if you have been a nurse for a few years. For a family of 4 in a moderate area the income cut off for the subsidy is around $80,000.

All I can say is Ouch!

otessa

ybq2008 · Dec 22, 2009

Its "free" for all of those that do not work. I am totally against this.

Why? You pay for it eventually anyway in higher premiums for those with insurance. Why not pay for prevention and save some of our health care dollars?

Not to start an argument, but this is always something that I challenge people to think about. If you're paying for it in the long run, why not get more bang for your buck?

HeartsOpenWide, RN · Dec 22, 2009

Why? You pay for it eventually anyway in higher premiums for those with insurance. Why not pay for prevention and save some of our health care dollars?
Not to start an argument, but this is always something that I challenge people to think about. If you're paying for it in the long run, why not get more bang for your buck?

First, my health insurance is paid through my job. Although I went without for many years to work my butt off in nursing school to get the job I have, yes I am grateful.

Second. I don't want to fork out tons of money for a crappy health insurance plan. As some one else said, Medicaid in their state pays $0.14 on the dollar. How much do you think this national health insurance is going to pay when covering 304,059,724 people (http://quickfacts.census.gov/qfd/states/00000.html); of which only 56.6 pay any taxes (http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2009/04/15/politics/otherpeoplesmoney/main4945874.shtml

And I already get money taken out of my paycheck to pay for Medicaid, and Medicare (of which resolve before I reach 65). I rather see them raise the cap on what a person can make to get Medicaid than pay for every Tom Dick and Sally that choose to buy a boat, new house, or car than insurance. There are plenty of people figured into the statistics of those without insurance that can very well afford it but choose not to.

elkpark · Dec 22, 2009

First, my health insurance is paid through my job.

Your insurance through your job is paid for with income you earn but never see -- your employers are certainly not paying for it out of their pockets ... It's part of your compensation (and your employer gets a tax break on that money instead of you) but your employer takes it "off the top" and gives it to the insurance company (which is why so few people realize how much their insurance actually costs).

ybq2008 · Dec 22, 2009

first, my health insurance is paid through my job. although i went without for many years to work my butt off in nursing school to get the job i have, yes i am grateful.

second. i don't want to fork out tons of money for a crappy health insurance plan. as some one else said, medicaid in their state pays $0.14 on the dollar. how much do you think this national health insurance is going to pay when covering 304,059,724 people (http://quickfacts.census.gov/qfd/states/00000.html); of which only 56.6 pay any taxes (http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2009/...n4945874.shtml
and i already get money taken out of my paycheck to pay for medicaid, and medicare (of which resolve before i reach 65). i rather see them raise the cap on what a person can make to get medicaid than pay for every tom dick and sally that choose to buy a boat, new house, or car than insurance. there are plenty of people figured into the statistics of those without insurance that can very well afford it but choose not to.

i have been in mental health services for several years and i like to think i have a pretty good understanding of the medicaid program. i also took a public policy course in grad school and researched this topic; so i feel pretty passionate about social programs. let me explain the medicaid program, as many people are confused by the concept and where the money comes from.

medicaid is a state program that is partially funded by the federal government. the feds match state contributions to medicaid programs and each state is the administrator of their own medicaid program. this is why some states have better programs than others. most of the 40 million who are uninsured do not qualify for medicaid. they are typically your low to middle income earners who do not have access to health insurance programs on the job and cannot afford private insurance. they are frequently young adults [like you (28) and me (26)] who are unemployed or underemployed. there are of course others who are outside of that demographic, but statistics show that young adults are one of the largest demographics.

most people don't choose to be uninsured, contrary to popular belief. i spent all of my undergraduate years partially insured and a year or so since then uninsured because i couldn't afford private coverage and my employer didn't offer affordable coverage. i certainly didn't choose to buy a boat or a car (i had student loans to pay!). there are millions of others in the same position. certainly, there are some that choose no coverage, but they are certainly the minority in those statistics. raising the cap on medicaid is a temporary solution to a permanent problem. it also increases your state's bottom line. i don't know about your state, but my state doesn't have extra cash lying around to pay for additional medicaid expenses.

either way, we're all still paying for it in some way. why not be good stewards of our tax dollars and find a program that actually helps people and saves money? i certainly don't believe that the current health care reform legislation is perfect, but i believe that we have a great start. the social security act of 1935 wasn't perfect at its initiation; but we have amended it several time to suit our society's needs. the same will happen for the health care act of 2009.

the point that i'm making is that many people argue against health care reform because they want to believe that their are 40 million lazy people out there who deserve to be uncovered because they're not working hard enough. we all know deep down that this is not the case. its frustrating and nerve racking to imagine that we're going to pay even more for our health care. you quoted the statistic of only 56.6% of the 304 million americans are currently contributing to the system. health care reform will boost our work force by creating additional jobs that will serve the additional 40 million in the health care system. it will also provide preventative care that can decrease the likelihood of someone leaving the workforce due to disability from years of not having any health care. the bill creates more checks and balances for insurance companies too; as regulates some of the ridiculous rules that prevent coverage of pre-existing conditions and limit coverage to people with certain conditions.

i have attached a pdf of the health care reform bill that passed in the house. feel free to review it. its 1018 pages, so i’m taking my time, but it will definitely help to inform all of our thinking about this whole thing… :specs:

AAHCA-BillText-071409.pdf

chuchie, ADN, BSN, MSN, LPN, APRN, NP · Dec 22, 2009

This bill will help nurses find jobs, but do you think there will be any incentive to become a doctor with this bill? Will it create a shortage of doctors? Do you think that this will give incentives for companies to create new medical devices that can improve and/or save lives? Under the new plan you can keep your insurance through your employer, but what if your employer will choose the government option (which is likely to be cheaper) and reduce the quality of care that you receive?