I've read several threads over time, and I "hear" from both the RN's AND the CNA's that CNA's are there to "help the RN." I am a little lost on this one, I can see in a way what it means, but IMO, EVERYONE is there to help the patients, yes? I think the worst portrayal of this attitude is when CNA's (and NO, definitely not all of them) feel that the RN should kiss their feet for any thing that they do "for them," and should just suck up a poor attitude by that person, because it would be "worse" without them there. It goes the other way, too.
From my perspective, having been a CNA for 5 years before becoming an RN seven years ago, is that no one is REALLY "more" important than the other. We just have different roles. Of course I appreciate working with a good CNA (and I am fortunate, I work with very good ones!) but I don't necessarily think of them as "doing me a favor" when they bathe a patient or answer a light. That's their job. It's mine, too, so I will do both of those things when time permits me. To me, one is doing me a favor when they are working with a different RN and have a patient assignment, but will help me with my blood sugars when I'm working alone, if they have time. THAT'S above and beyond. If they're ON my team, it's not a "favor" to me for them to get sugars....it's an expectation. Now, if I'm going in to a room anyway, I WILL often enough get it myself, I have no problem sharing those tasks. I don't think I'm doing THEM a favor, either, by sharing the baths...we're a team. I do give plenty of "thank you's" when they do their job efficiently and thoroughly, as well. I don't really see anything as strictly theirs to do. If I had a day where I couldn't help with the basic patient care as much as I'd like to/usually do, I will explain to them WHY I had to stick to what are strictly my RN duties (more new orders than usual, a patient having complications, etc).
Anyway. Just my two cents. Any thoughts on this? I would think relations between RN's and UAP would be better overall if EVERYONE took responibiility not only for their jobs, but for all of the patient's care. As soon as an RN OR a CNA feels like the CNA is there just to help the RN, and that any of the work they complete is a favor to them, it gets hard to get ANYTHING done the right way.
Hope this made sense. I've read it several times now, so I just wanted to get that out.
I know I'm the nurses aide. But I don't see myself as that. I see myself as the residents aide. I work in a nursing home and there are always NACs on unlike a hospital. I think it very much comes down to respect! There have been many a times when I saved the nurses behind, as there were many times the nurse saved my behind. If a nurse that I respect asks me to do something that I don't have time for or usually wouldn't do (not in my job description). I will ususally stay over to do it. I will go the extra mile for the nurse. If she's behind and makes a mess, I'll stay over to clean it up. Just like if I'm behind she'll answer a call light or 2. Anywho, if a nurse is rude and disrespects me then I don't respect her. I will think twice about what I'm doing and if it's REALLY my job or if it's hers. She spilled Jevity, not my problem, especially IF I don't have time. Why should I stay over, when I know darn well I'm on my own the next night when I get out an hour late and she goes home an hour earlier. Also I've had nurses ask me to do things that kind of bended the rules. I did it and took the fall for it. So I also have to think twice if I will get into trouble for what she is asking me. I'm all for CYA and will do that especially if I know that nurse won't support me in what she tells me to do! For the record I'm taking my pre-reqs for nursing school and I'll find it very interesting on how I will see things when I'm a nurse.
I plan to become a RN, right now I'm a CNA. I've yet to see a lazy nurse on my unit. Also, I have a few RN friends and know perfectly well, that just because a nurse isn't running around does not mean she is not working hard!
I can take a scolding as long as I deserve it. I can take a nurse that bosses me around, as long as she says 'than you' to me in the end (I always thank the nurse when we do something together).
Today, one the nurses praised me by saying that my enthusiasm and approach makes up for my lack of experience and that it really gives her a lift to watch me work :) This made me feel sooooo good and appreciated!
The majority of nurses I know respect CNAs and vice versa.
I'm noticing a lot of CNAs lately (the younger ones, mostly) who have lousy attitudes when it comes to taking direction. They give you lip or this stupid look of defiance when they are ASKED to do something. No one berates them, no one acts high and mighty, but they act as though no one should be telling them what to do. They don't understand that a part of their job is to assist the nurse (in effect assisting the patient.) That's what a nurse's aide is.
Personally, I'm tired of the token titles tossed around (UAP, etc.) I think there are forces trying to turn the nursing profession into something it isn't.
I know you weren't addressing me, cherrybreeze, but my response has to do with the concept that the CNA is not there to assist the nurse, but rather, for the patients. I disagree vehemently with this sentiment. The CNA is there for both.
I've worked with CNAs that behaved as if they had their own practice. The ones who go on break without informing the nurses or finding another CNA to cover their lights. Their attitude is "the nurses can answer their lights.". These are the same ones who don't do the Turn Q2s, but rather, wait for the nurses to come find them and ask for help turning the patient. I could go on and on. But basically, they've got it in their head that they're there for the patient, so they decide what is important that they focus on for each patient, which is often in conflict with what the licensed nurse views as the priority for that patient. They make decisions independently of the nurse, and overstep their bounds by doing patient teaching. In effect, the patients get substandard care and the nurses are overworked, while the CNAs walk around as if they have an independent practice.
I am nice to the aides. I sometimes get very focused and intense trying to do my job, and people can and do misinterpret that. Also, simply because I have an issue with the mentality of many of our aides in regards to their role as members of the patient care team, does not mean I am disrespectful toward them. There are a few who don't know their assess from a hole in the ground, but I keep that sentiment to myself and treat them as respectfully as any coworker.
And yet still, too many CNAs misplace priorities. Based on this, I personally disagree that it's just a matter of respect. I think it's a matter of the fact that I have walked in the CNA's shoes, having been one, but the CNA has not walked in my shoes, having never been an RN. Therefore, the CNA does not have the experience or training to understand just how vital they are to the nurse, not just the patient, and that by assisting the nurse, they are also assisting the patient.
Edited to add: And being in nursing school doesn't count. You really don't get a taste of what it is like to practice bedside nursing until you are out of school and practicing. Even if you're taking a full patient load in clinicals, you've still got that preceptor and nursing instructor backing you up.
Specializes in Med-Surg; Telemetry; School Nurse pk-8.
I work on a 39 bed med-surg/tele floor. It is a heavy floor. I was a PCT (nurse's aide) on this floor for a little over a year, and then started as an RN after passing my boards this past summer. The only way to ensure that the patient's needs are met is if everyone works together in a professional and respectful manner.
As a PCT, I was assigned 7-12 patients depending on the census. That meant I had more than 2-3 RNs to work with -- different personalities, different expectations/priorities. I always knew how my shift would be, depending with whom I was paired...
As an RN, I always look to see who my PCT will be. In fact, I look at the PCT schedule when I sign up for my own schedule. Never under-estimate the power of a great PCT. We have some great PCT's, and I love it when they get assigned to my patients. I know that I can count on them -- and if they are overwhelmed, I'll do my patients bed-bath, BGT, whatever. It doesn't happen often, simply because thet are that good.
The bottom line is that there are good PCTs, good RNs, and good Unit Secretarys (ours was out sick yesterday, and boy did we miss her!). There are also substandard RNs,PCTs and secretarys. We all need to respect each other, praise the good, be cognitive of the burdens in each other's job, and above all, work together to make the patient the priority. Because really, that's why we chose nursing -- it wasn't the prestige and glamour, right? LOL.
I'm seeing some very naieve, idealistic, defiant, hostile and arrogant remarks from non-nurses and those who's experience with nursing consists of watching soap operas.
If YOU are not there to assist the nurse, then YOU need to have YOUR title and job description changed. Period.
I personally get tired of having these girls spit in my face when I ask them to do something. Most of them are great. And I have never asked anyone to clean up a mess I made or requested anything unreasonable. But don't stand there when I ask you to help someone to the bathroom and tell me you are about to go on break or do something else.
As for this you-have-to-earn-my-respect deal, take a step back and look at yourselves. What makes you think you deserve any respect?
There is no excuse for any RN, EN whatever to be rude and demanding of CNA's.
However I agree with Virgo and Golytely that the CNA's must understand that they are there to assist the nurses in caring for the patient as a team. CNA's work under our supervision, therefore we are held responsible for the care given. CNA's do not practice independantly, the RN does. If you do not like being directed in what to do, then by all means go and study and get your nursing liscence.
[when I am finsished doing what i am doing i will help you if you can't wait til then find another nurse.]
And if the RN makes a judgement that they need your assistance with something NOW you have to do it. As an RN we have to delegate and prioritise. If one task needs to be finished first and what your doing can be finished later then you have to respect the nurses judgement. If you think the RN is not doing the right thing then yeah, question them about it. But outright refusing like that isn't going to get you anywhere because your not doing your job properly and you may be reprimanded for it.
I personally get tired of having these girls spit in my face when I ask them to do something. Most of them are great. And I have never asked anyone to clean up a mess I made or requested anything unreasonable. But don't stand there when I ask you to help someone to the bathroom and tell me you are about to go on break or do something else.
As for this you-have-to-earn-my-respect deal, take a step back and look at yourselves. What makes you think you deserve any respect?
And I get sick of nurses telling me how I'm worthless and not worth anything and I'm so much lower than them because I'm not a nurse. And then demanding I get there vital signs right away when mr. so and so needs to go to the bathroom right now as well and mrs. b wants ice water.
And last I checked pretty much anyone I work with has my respect until they ruin it. Then it's gone....And what make YOU think you deserve MY respect...seems like another high and mighty I'm better than you attitude to me.
And if the RN makes a judgement that they need your assistance with something NOW you have to do it. As an RN we have to delegate and prioritise. If one task needs to be finished first and what your doing can be finished later then you have to respect the nurses judgement. If you think the RN is not doing the right thing then yeah, question them about it. But outright refusing like that isn't going to get you anywhere because your not doing your job properly and you may be reprimanded for it.
See that's the problem. I must cover my own behind. I once had a nurse ask me to do something questionable. Being a naive new aide I listened and didn't question what she was asking. I got pulled in the office and said nurse didn't back me up and said she had no idea what was going on. I did tell the DNS the truth. A little later said nurse was ranting that back in the day aides did whatever nurses said. I said yes but back in the day nurses also backed up their aides. She stated it was part of the game and I said well some of us don't play that game. Ever since then I question what is more important. I'm not going to leave my high fall risk on the toilet to go answer a fall alarm. I'm not going to do something that the nurse wants me to do that might get me into trouble. So I use my OWN judgement. No I don't tell the nurse they can go find another nurse. Depending on what it is, if I'm busy I state I will be there as soon as I can.
Butterfliesnroses
348 Posts
I know I'm the nurses aide. But I don't see myself as that. I see myself as the residents aide. I work in a nursing home and there are always NACs on unlike a hospital. I think it very much comes down to respect! There have been many a times when I saved the nurses behind, as there were many times the nurse saved my behind. If a nurse that I respect asks me to do something that I don't have time for or usually wouldn't do (not in my job description). I will ususally stay over to do it. I will go the extra mile for the nurse. If she's behind and makes a mess, I'll stay over to clean it up. Just like if I'm behind she'll answer a call light or 2. Anywho, if a nurse is rude and disrespects me then I don't respect her. I will think twice about what I'm doing and if it's REALLY my job or if it's hers. She spilled Jevity, not my problem, especially IF I don't have time. Why should I stay over, when I know darn well I'm on my own the next night when I get out an hour late and she goes home an hour earlier. Also I've had nurses ask me to do things that kind of bended the rules. I did it and took the fall for it. So I also have to think twice if I will get into trouble for what she is asking me. I'm all for CYA and will do that especially if I know that nurse won't support me in what she tells me to do! For the record I'm taking my pre-reqs for nursing school and I'll find it very interesting on how I will see things when I'm a nurse.