religion and nursing

Erin RN · Jan 17, 2004

When I worked Oncology I prayed with all different religions...I was raised catholic but do not practice now and havent for a long time. I am a spiritual person and I have my own relationship with my higher power..even as an atheist or agnostic you have to have a source of strength..be it yourself, love or family (it does not have to be god). I think it perfectly okay for you to pray with someone, you are showing support and respect for them as a human being and a pt.

In ONC I dealt with many different religions..I worked with Native Americans where the whole and I mean whole family was there at the time of death..particularly if it was the matriarch of the family. I took care of Jehoviah Witness that refused trnsfusions that would save their lives. I didnt personally agree with some of what I saw but I respected their rights and did not judge.

It is helpful for the Onc nurse to have general/ basic knowledge of the religions that are most prevelent in her/his area..Also of the cultures that they will be dealing with. Makes the pt feel more at ease and if they are on the Onc floor they usually have enough stress as it is.

Good luck to you, Oncology can be very rewarding and very heartbreaking..I just couldn't leave it at the door so I left and went to the ED..Sounds like you are really thinking it through and that is good....

CCU NRS · Jan 17, 2004

Originally posted by alikat70
Hey everyone. I am a beginning nursing student wondering about a few things. I was contemplating the idea of working in oncology, but Im unsure about how to handle the death experience. I am an agnostic/borderline athiest. I was questioning whether I would be able to provide complete care of a patient with different religious views. What Im wondering is if I can still be a good nurse in a setting where I am bound to deal with this situation over and over again.

We studied clutural differences in class today. We were told that it is our responsiblity as nurses to care for patients regardless of cultural differences. Im not questioning my ability to care for a dying patient in a physical way, but more of the spiritual part of it. I try to respect all beliefs. Would it be wrong to pray with a patient even if I dont believe in it? If a patient asks for comfort and to be told that they are going to heaven would it be ok to tell them yes even if I do not belive in a life after death? I dont think I would mind doing these things for a patient if asked, Im justs wondering if it is moral to do so.

I did a search for athiest nurses, and this forum is what I came up with. I got to read part of a really hot debate on this topic, but I think it got locked down. Im not trying to start another religious debate, but I was wondering about all of this. I guess the bottom line of what Im asking is if it is ok to pretend to believe what someone else does in order to give them comfort?

Any feedback would be appreciated and please remeber that I am only a nursing student with no experience yet.

Very confusing to me. I would just like to ask a few questions. If I may? ...Thank you

Ok if you are agnostic borderline atheist just what is the dividing line? I have always been a little unclear, is it that agnostic is sort of nilist in other words they believe in nothing and atheist believe in other things just not religion?

Second if you are concerned about morales what is your basis for morales? I mean those of us that are even semi religious basically follow the old standards you know basically the Ten commandments. So where do your values and morales come from and to what degree are they important? I mean if you don't beleive anything you do in life matters what is the point? Secondly I am curious as to what end a career of helping others is appealing to you?

edited by CCU NRS D/T sarcasm and impertinence after reviewing this post I found myself to be sarcastic.

alikat70 · Jan 17, 2004

Erin

Thanks for the positive feedback. I was thinking that it may be a good experience for me. Who knows, maybe it will give me some insight into my own questions regarding religion. I could even see something that might change my mind altogether. The more I think about it, the more I think it might be a good thing for me to do. Thaks for the insight.

eak16 · Jan 17, 2004

I think the fact that you are cognizant of this shows that you care about their spiritual well being. I have had patients of many religions ask me to pray with them (I personally am Christian) and I felt comfortable doing so. But I have also seen nurses who did not feel comfortable praying with patients and informed them of that fact in a polite caring way and then made arrangements for a chaplain or equivalent to visit them. I think both ways of handling this are fine. As a nurse, you can recognize that they are reaching out for spiritual support, which is healthy. If you are not able to provide the client with what they need, its ok to call someone else or ask for help.

caroladybelle, BSN, RN · Jan 17, 2004

Originally posted by CCU NRS
Very confusing to me. I would just like to ask a few questions. If I may? ...Thank you

Second if you are concerned about morales what is your basis for morales? I mean those of us that are even semi religious basically follow the old standards you know basically the Ten commandments. So where do your values and morales come from and to what degree are they important? I mean if you don't beleive anything you do in life matters what is the point? Secondly I am curious as to what end a career of helping others is appealing to you?

Is lieing a big problem especially lieing about something that other people hold sacred and how do you feel that people would feel if after having prayed with them they found out you were atheist etc?

If people are dying and they are looking to you for comfort and you tell them you don't believe in God or religion and you think that death is just the big dirt nap will this be a comfort to them?

I have always found that morals have very little to do with religion. There have been similar codes for appropriate conduct, before the ten commandments came to be, from many different societies. Having morals is not dependent upon being religious. Some people do not have the need for fear of being punished if they do wrong. We are capable of being moral on our own.

By the same token, some people help others because it is right and rewarding of its own accord. We do not require a commandment to do so.

If one does not wish to pray with someone, one does not do so. I find this, when people wish me to pray to Jesus - I do not do so as I do not believe that he is a deity. Much the same with nonCatholics that do not say the rosary with their patients (d/t its emphasis on the Virgin Mary). There is no need to lie about it.

If the patient is in pain or at peace with themselves and their life, many are satified with leaving it, especially when they no longer enjoy life due to their condition. We will all leave this world, inevitably. You just deal with the eternity thing (good or bad) and others deal with eternal rest.

I have met many excellent oncology nurses that were agnostics/atheists. While I am not one, they do exist and they frquently give excellent care

fergus51 · Jan 17, 2004

I would probably call myself agnostic (just means I don't know if there is or is not a God) and I have never had a problem praying with patients who wanted to. I find it to be a bit of an asset at times, because I consider all faiths equal, which can be hard for a nurse who devoutly believes that her religion is the right one and others are wrong or misguided.

A nurse of any religion, or who is not religious at all, can be a good nurse. The key is simply to respect your patients beliefs and be willing to explore them if they wish.

BarbPick · Jan 17, 2004

As an oncology nurse of 22 out of 28 years, I have done death in every religion except Islam. Even Hari Krishnas. You pick these things up as you go and each time it is easier. Especially when you are asked by the patient to promise they will die pain free, you do your darndest to keep the promise.

CCU NRS · Jan 17, 2004

Originally posted by caroladybelle
I have always found that morals have very little to do with religion. There have been similar codes for appropriate conduct, before the ten commandments came to be, from many different societies. Having morals is not dependent upon being religious. Some people do not have the need for fear of being punished if they do wrong. We are capable of being moral on our own.

By the same token, some people help others because it is right and rewarding of its own accord. We do not require a commandment to do so.

If one does not wish to pray with someone, one does not do so. I find this, when people wish me to pray to Jesus - I do not do so as I do not believe that he is a deity. Much the same with nonCatholics that do not say the rosary with their patients (d/t its emphasis on the Virgin Mary). There is no need to lie about it.

If the patient is in pain or at peace with themselves and their life, many are satified with leaving it, especially when they no longer enjoy life due to their condition. We will all leave this world, inevitably. You just deal with the eternity thing (good or bad) and others deal with eternal rest.

I have met many excellent oncology nurses that were agnostics/atheists. While I am not one, they do exist and they frquently give excellent care

Interesting I am not by any means a religious fanatic or zealot or even very devout. I do beleive in God I have my own spirituality and don't really believe in organized religion or anyone that sks you to send money because God need you to help others. I did go through a period of time from about 19-21 when I strongly questioned God and clamed to be atheist but for me it WAS just a sort of rebellion not becaue anybody else was doing it just because I was hurting about things and was pissed.

I had a very close call with death and suffice to say at that time I had an experience that changed my views.

caroladybelle, BSN, RN · Jan 17, 2004

PS. I should clarify that I am not a Christian or atheist/agnostic. I am Jewish. I am an Oncology nurse.

alikat70 · Jan 17, 2004

Very confusing to me. I would just like to ask a few questions. If I may? ...Thank you

Ok if you are agnostic borderline atheist just what is the dividing line? I have always been a little unclear, is it that agnostic is sort of nilist in other words they believe in noting and atheist beleive in other things just not religion?

Second if you are concerned about morales what is your basis for morales? I mean those of us that are even semi religious basically follow the old standards you know basically the Ten commandments. So where do your values and morales come from and to what degree are they important? I mean if you don't beleive anything you do in life matters what is the point? Secondly I am curious as to what end a career of helping others is appealing to you?

This is very interesting to me and I am not being flippant or sarcastic I am curious.

Is lieing a big problem especially lieing about something that other people hold sacred and how do you feel that people would feel if after having prayed with them they found out you were atheist etc?

If people are dying and they are looking to you for comfort and you tell them you don't believe in God or religion and you think that death is just the big dirt nap will this be a comfort to them?

__________________

"Knowledge is the only tool that doesn't rust" Larry Leeds 2000

Don't sweat the small stuff...BTW it is all small stuff" author unknown

IP: Logged

01-17-2004 05:47 AM

I hope im doing this right....still trying to figure it all out.

Well I cant speak for everyone, but to me an agnostic is someone who isnt quite sure what they belive, and an athiest is someone who doesnt belive in god. I think those terms are used loosley and may have a slightly different meaning to each person.

Im always surprised that alot of people think that athiest do not have morals. My morals are based on my interpretation of what I think is right and wrong in terms of humanity and life in general.

I think you should respect life in all its forms because it is the right thing to do and because doing so will hopefuly ensure the continuation of the human race. Religion aside I believe that life is a precious, precious thing and we should do what we can to enhance and appreciate it. The idea that there might not be another life after this one makes me want to make the most of this one...for myself and others. Life does matter....it is a fragile, awesome thing that I think most of us take for granted most of the time.

I think helping others will be satisfying. I like the idea of being able to provide some sort of comfort or help to others. I think I can learn from the people that I care for and make myself a better person for having done so.

The question about praying with someone is what Im trying to get feedback on. Im unsure about how I would handle that. I could get another nurse to come and take my place, but what would happen if no one was available? I think the humane thing to do would be to keep my beliefs to myself and comfort the patient in the way they request. No one would ever know except me and god (if I believed in that) and Im sure god wouldnt mind if I helped someone pray to him. I would never be so crass as to tell someone on their deathbed that there was no god or afterlife if they believed otherwise.

I think that is a morally sound decision, but Im interested to know if you or anyone else things that I am wrong. Normally I dont think it is ok to lie, but in this case I think the best thing to do is just not offer up the truth.

I think after answering this post that I have answered my own question. However, anyone else feel free to take a turn.

alikat70 · Jan 17, 2004

I just want to thank everyone for the positive feedback. I just want to do a good job and help my patients in the best way. I guess we all have to find our own way....