"undercover" patients in New Mexico

hipab4hands · Sep 19, 2004

http://www.aarp.org/bulletin/yourhealth/Articles/a2004-08-26-undercover.html
Great idea. Undercover agents posing as nursing home patients. Wonder when the hospitals will start using undercover patients. Or... undercover nurses.

We used to have the 'mystery shoppers" call us to see how well we triage patients. However, after the same people kept calling, I got to know their voices and was able to identify one of them before he started his "spiel".

When I asked if he was one of the "mystery shoppers", because his voice was very familiar, he admitted he was one of them. Funny part is, they stopped using the "mystery shopper" shortly afterwards:rotfl:

LadyMadonna · Sep 20, 2004

I think this "program" is a ridiculous waste of time and resources!! It takes nurses away from the real patients. Shame on those who do this!
Ooohh this makes me so mad! :angryfire
Imagine being a patient in a hospital and your nurse cannot get to you because s/he is taking care of some a-hole who is just trying to cause trouble and "spy". I do not have the time for playacting patients. Thank God this cannot be implemented in my specialty. (I don't think the babies are going to write an article about the care...but if any of them ever did, I'd hate for it to read - I was hurting and scared, but my nurse was tied up taking care of a baby that was just pretending to be sick and couldn't get to me.)

I agree with you all the way. What are these JERKS trying to prove by having this "secret shopper" garbage? If anything, maybe it will proved how short staffed nursing homes are and how a few unreasonable creeps (like the secret shoppers) take time away from the people who really need the help in an already strained situation.

It should be no secret that nursing facilities have tremendous turnovers and the facility will hire as few employees as possible to save a buck. But I am taking it that these secret shoppers are out to prove that the fault lies with complacent, lazy uncaring staff. :angryfire :angryfire :angryfire

vaughanmk · Sep 20, 2004

The problem with the entire thing is that there are too many lazy, uncaring incompitent nurses working various units. They can chart all the lies and cover thier butts legally. Remember if it's not charted it's not done. Therefore, if it was charted then it was done, right? I've seen too many patients come in from outlying nursing homes into the ICU from neglect and abuse. A review and suspension was done, but no one was fired and the place stayed open.

If no one is sent into the nursing homes/ hospitals to see these issues then how will they know what really goes on. We all moan and groan about patient loads, duplicate charting, not enough help too many patients, right? Research on mortality and patient nurse ratio hasn't changed much. Why not some undercover patients? It might actually help our cause. Not all of them are a-holes. Some are just quiet patients watching the world go by their room without entering because they haven't hit their call light 5 times an hour.

I just hope that people out there can see this as a review of the system, not of the individual nurse. Much of our shift consists of what our administration down to charge nurse has put in our lap. We do the best with what we have. I think the goal in the end for everyone, is to put less on our plates. This if for patient safety and the safety of our licenses.

UM Review RN, ASN, RN · Sep 20, 2004

The problem with the entire thing is that there are too many lazy, uncaring incompitent nurses working various units.

I just hope that people out there can see this as a review of the system, not of the individual nurse. Much of our shift consists of what our administration down to charge nurse has put in our lap. We do the best with what we have.

You do see the serious contradiction here, do you not?

Why are your unit's problems administration's fault, but the nursing home's staffing problems (traditionally worse than the average hospital) are the fault of "lazy, uncaring incompitent [sic] nurses?"

UM Review RN, ASN, RN · Sep 20, 2004

PS I agree that this deception takes away care from the real patients and time from the real staff, which could ultimately result in a real crisis for one of those real patients, resulting in a real hospital stay, and a real lawsuit ensuing later.

Just how much responsibility will the "mystery patients" take for that?

None. It'll be the fault of the lazy, uncaring, incompetent staff. Of course. :rolleyes:

imenid37 · Sep 20, 2004

Truly, I think the need for "mystery" pt's would be eliminated if inspections were ALWAYS a surprise. Then the accrediting folks would see the real facility, not the "botoxed" face we put on when they come. Pt's are cared for every day, not just when JCAHO or the state inspectors are present. Lazy staff are a problem. The bigger isssue is admin. that give staff an undoable job and don't discipline those who loaf, but expect the rest of us to carry them in order to save the big picture. I have been told some people just have a "different work ethic" than you. If you do do a good job, you are not really rewarded anyway so I think some people do much less than they would if they knew there was something for them if they went the extra mile. :)

jkaee · Sep 20, 2004

I think "undercover" pts are a good idea in LTC, but not in ER!

Not to start anything, but why is it a good idea in nursing homes and not in the ER? We have truly sick patients too, in LTC, and this "undercover" patient would most likely be taking a bed from someone in the community that needs our services. And, who is paying for the stay of this so-called resident? How do they meet the criteria for admission? I just have big problem with this considering it's all based on lies and deception. You want to help change nursing homes or hospitals.....then use the money that you spent "training"people to be sick and paying for a unneeded stay to work on the real issues at hand....adequate staffing, for one.

And if it's good for LTC, then it's good for hospitals, as well. I have seen too many residents come home from hospitals with decubs, bruises from restraints, significant wieght loss, and disaster areas in their mouths due to lack of basic mouth care. I have had resident's families tell me that they would do anything NOT to have their loved one in the hospital again due to the type of care they recieved. The problem of overworked and understaffed nurses in an epidemic everywhere, and bad care happens in every situation, not just LTC.

I have no problem with an outside consultant, inspector, whatever, coming and and observing us doing our jobs. I just hate sneakiness and deception...if you look hard enough, you will find something wrong everywhere.

imenid37 · Sep 20, 2004

I agree w/ you jkee. It is the sneakiness and deception that really irritates me. We don't work at Hooters or Burger King. Sometimes we have to prioritze who gets seen first, so we may not always seem "customer-friendly" to the outside observer. One ER in my area advertises that those w/ minor prolems will now be seen as quickly as those w/ more serious concerns. Is that a good use of our resources or shouldn't we be steering people w/ colds and scrapes to their own dr., not to encouraging them to make an expensive ER visit. Sometimes because of the nature of what we do, gushing w/ customer service is just not possible. We provide an essential service to people in need. We are obligated to be professional and appropriate. We teach and counsel our pt's. This means we often tell them things they don't want to hear. That might not sit well w/ them in terms of customer service. Someone forgot to tell those in upper management that pt. care is our primary goal and they need to work w/ us on this, not sugar-coated customer-service. If you primarily want smiles, go to Chuckie Cheese. I don't believe these "mystery" pt's are just to spot "abuse", I think they are there to spy and make sure the staff are kissing up to the patients and their often ridiculous requests. In fact, the quest to please some people's wants often takes away from time spent w/ less demanding pt's who may, in fact, be more in need of care. We can't do everything. There aren't enough of us and we don't have time. Certainly we should be professional and polite, but we are NOT customer service rep's or host and hostesses, we are professionals providing essential services. That should be our priority. Maybe instead of trying to make many of our hospitals look like resorts, we need to be spending those $'s on staffing apropriately. Attractive buildings and backside kissing staff do not always equal appropriate and safe pt. care.

RN4NICU, LPN, LVN · Sep 20, 2004

. Attractive buildings and backside kissing staff do not always equal appropriate and safe pt. care.

Amen!! It is this ridiculous "customer service" craze in healthcare that has made me regret going into nursing. Put THAT in the J&J commercial and sing about it.

BTW - I have yet to see a post-op CABG patient that WANTED to voldyne and cough/splint. They moan and groan and complain endlessly about how "mean" their nurses are. Know what? The last patient I saw throw a fit and absolutely refuse to comply with what the "mean" nurse instructed him to do - died in the unit a month later w/ respiratory failure. The nurses on the floor did not have the time to nag and preach (and refuse to leave the room until he complied) the way we did in the CVICU. There are more important things than customer service and patient buttkissing.

Then there are always the families that bring their diabetic family member candy, cokes, and cupcakes. Making the patient/visitors happy and providing good care are sometimes mutually exclusive.

Ok - rant over - back on topic.

Hospitals are not hotels or restaurants or Walmart. "Shoppers" do not belong there!!!!

Victoriakem · Sep 20, 2004

What a sick story about this "secret shopper patient". Not only the time, money & effort wasted, not to mention not being able to care for truly ill people, but who was paying this person to act this way? I always document any kind of abuse heaped on staff, uncoorporation (sp) by patients, etc, in case someone decides to send a letter complaining about their care. And who was behind all this anyway. Sick sick sick.

merricat · Sep 20, 2004

I think "undercover" pts are a good idea in LTC, but not in ER!

me too. the thing is, the make it so everybody is so crunched for time, but if people had a little more time while they were at work, we would all have a better idea about who is a good worker and who is not, and why. when my dad was in business he would get off his butt and go out and work with the guys (construction) and it told him a lot and also made him more respected as a boss. i'd like to see my DON come be a floor nurse when we are short-handed. it's be a good thing. i have never understood why bosses do not come in at various hours just to walk through, help where needed, and check it all out.

sassynurse78 · Oct 5, 2004

As I have read through this thread, I have been hurt by the assumption that poor care anywhere is the nurses fault. :angryfire A Mystery Shopper is a waste of time and will only be another leg to stand on for the management that the nurses actions, not theirs, is a cause of poor care. All management needs to wake up and take the blame where it falls-too many pts. for one nurse is going to be a disaster. Nurses go to school because they want to do this, not because it is easy money.