President Biden thread

Crusades said:

There's always been contention within the medical practice to under go sterilization under 30 yrs old. Many Dr do not feel comfortable doing that. 

However purposly distorting this with women getting sterilized because they are so scarred that the evil.republican SCOTUS will take away their birthcontrol is a fallacy. It's already a contested idea seperate of politics. So by all means exploit this too. 

If these women want to be sterilized because of reproductive hysteria, have at it. However don't condem a Dr for questioning a sterilization proceedure due to potential political action that has not happened. Doesn't ring sound of mind to me. I wouldn't be comfortable sterilizing a women for that reason. 

You can dismiss the women's stated reasons for seeking the procedures if you prefer. Maybe you know better than them what their thinking and motivations are.  

Sure, sure, women shouldn't worry about birth control now that abortion access is in chaos.  Conservative policy has been interfering in access to birth control for poor young women for years now.  Recently, Senate Democrats offered up a bill to protect access to contraception.  

Quote

Maine Sen. Susan Collins, one of two Republicans to vote with Democrats to move forward on the bill, said Monday that she would want the legislation to be amended to include more religious liberty protections. "It is clearly a messaging attempt and not a serious attempt in itself,” she said.

Alaska Sen. Lisa Murkowski, who along with Collins supports abortion rights, also voted to move forward on the legislation.

Many Republicans who voted against consideration of the bill said they support access to contraception but believe the legislation is unnecessary.

https://apnews.com/article/contraception-senate-abortion-biden-trump-reproductive-rights-3f9e8546624a3acf8e64d1138fcb84b1

The Guttmacher Institute is probably the group which follows these issues most closely.  

https://www.guttmacher.org/2024/06/midyear-2024-state-policy-trends-many-us-states-attack-reproductive-health-care-other

Quote

So far in 2024, eight states have enacted or proposed attacks on contraceptive access. These attacks are attempts to push contraception further out of reach for many people, particularly those with lower incomes. In one state, anti-abortion legislators, with support from activists, amended a bill to include the false notion that certain types of contraceptives can cause an abortion.

A law passed in Indiana focuses on providing long-acting contraceptives after birth to those with Medicaid coverage. However, during the legislative process, the bill was amended to provide for only subdermal contraceptives, based on the false claim by anti-abortion groups that IUDs cause abortions. The law limits the options and types of care available to those utilizing Medicaid based purely on misinformation from anti-abortion groups and perpetuates stereotypes about individuals with lower incomes not being able to manage certain types of birth control.

A bill proposed in Oklahoma sought to enact a number of restrictions on both abortion and contraception. The bill purposefully conflated abortion care and certain types of contraceptives, with the stated intention of banning IUDs and emergency contraception

We've already seen employers restrict use of health insurance by employees, to pay for birthcontrol in conservative states. Remember Hobby Lobby? Part of the ACA was intended to provide women some relief from that kind of fun beef conservative interference after that SCOTUS ruling. 

I didn't condemn a doctor for questioning a patient about requesting a procedure, where did you get that silly idea? Would you feel similarly uncomfortable providing a vasectomy to a young man? 

toomuchbaloney said:

You can dismiss the women's stated reasons for seeking the procedures if you prefer. Maybe you know better than them what their thinking and motivations are.  

Sure, sure, women shouldn't worry about birth control now that abortion access is in chaos.  Conservative policy has been interfering in access to birth control for poor young women for years now.  Recently, Senate Democrats offered up a bill to protect access to contraception.  

https://apnews.com/article/contraception-sen

Quote

 

ate-abortion-biden-trump-reproductive-rights-3f9e8546624a3acf8e64d1138fcb84b1

The Guttmacher Institute is probably the group which follows these issues most closely.  

https://www.guttmacher.org/2024/06/midyear-2024-state-policy-trends-many-us-states-attack-reproductive-health-care-other

We've already seen employers restrict use of health insurance by employees, to pay for birthcontrol in conservative states. Remember Hobby Lobby? Part of the ACA was intended to provide women some relief from that kind of fun beef conservative interference after that SCOTUS ruling. 

I didn't condemn a doctor for questioning a patient about requesting a procedure, where did you get that silly idea? Would you feel similarly uncomfortable providing a vasectomy to a young man? 

Nah. Women who seek out sterilization at a young age because they feelings or fear not being able to access birthcontrol, maybe, no evidence but they just know it are irrational. They are using the situation to stike fear. They are opportunist political activist. 

Women right to birth control should always be protected and I will stand against any bill or SOTUS decision any day. However the article ypu posted is being distorted into something political when the issue of permanent sterilization of women at child bearing stage has always been a contested issue. These women exploit it for political purposes. 

I would absolutely be uncomfortable giving a young man a vasectomy that told me that he was doing it because maybe the Republicans won't let him get on in the future! 

From the AP article

Quote

Many Republicans who voted against consideration of the bill said they support access to contraception but believe the legislation is unnecessary.

Try again this time don't use a Democrat show vote to prove your point  

The insurance paid benefits of birthcontol has always been an issue as well. By the insurance companies. 

Crusades said:

What are my comments  what beliefs do you think I have and what comment I have made lead you to belive this? 

Yes. Stating Trump and MAGA Republican extremist need to be stopped at all cost by the POTUS  most certainly do and I I argue did invoke violence.  

Or is it only applicable when Trump does it? 

Show me the Biden quote. Then we'll compare.  

Crusades said:

The first article is regarding if the Dr violated confidentiality for disclosing the girls situation in a bid to advance her advocacy for abortion rights . It has nothing to do with the Dr being investigated for providing an abortion rather than if the Dr.adhered to mandatory reporting. The title in itself is spin bias. Suggestive that it was in regards to abortion laws not that the Dr was being investigated for confidentiality breaches and using the girls situation for her abortion rights activism.  

Also it demonstrates the the 10 yr old was able to get treatment in a differnt state. Quite easily in fact. Too bad this Dr  exploit the 10 yr old rape victim to advance her political beliefs.  

The second article is about teen pregnancy. Did you think I said that it isn't common for teens to get pregnant? LOL 

Also, it made no reference to these teen pregnancy being "forced". 

So no. Both are irrelevant.  

 

The girl in the first article was 10 years old and pregnant in Ohio where she could not obtain an abortion.  The doctor being hounded is the Indiana physician who provided the abortion for the girl from Ohio. The rape was reported in the state of the occurrence.  The legal issues are just an excuse to try to punish the provider for the abortion.  

That's quite a spin about forcing a family to take their raped and pregnant child to another state to obtain an abortion. Yay... everything worked great, and provided a good example of how easy this is?  Time off work, travel expenses, insurance issues with out of state care... this was probably all just a piece of cake for the girl and her parents.  

I love how data is just an irrelevant distraction to you when you talk about things that are closely tracked and cataloged.  You just do a quick skim and dismiss a citation as irrelevant.  Who cares about the details about teen pregnancy.  

Crusades said:

Then that would mean all Republicans, all conservatives are indoctrinated cult members where you said that this isn't the case. You just contradicted yourself. 

It interesting you would use biblical quotes considering your demonstrated opinion of Christians as out off reach religious zealots. LOL. So quote some Bible verse  to make your point. 

More contradictions. 

I guess that's your opinion even though I just stated clearly why that characterization would be wrong.  

It's not "interesting" or even unusual that I would use a Bible verse to make a point, I am a born again Christian and casual student of the Bible and related documents.  I'm not alone in understanding that there are some crazy preachers in this group of Trump Christians. 

Talk about contradiction in beliefs

toomuchbaloney said:

The girl in the first article was 10 years old and pregnant in Ohio where she could not obtain an abortion.  The doctor being hounded is the Indiana physician who provided the abortion for the girl from Ohio. The rape was reported in the state of the occurrence.  The legal issues are just an excuse to try to punish the provider for the abortion.  

That's quite a spin about forcing a family to take their raped and pregnant child to another state to obtain an abortion. Yay... everything worked great, and provided a good example of how easy this is?  Time off work, travel expenses, insurance issues with out of state care... this was probably all just a piece of cake for the girl and her parents.  

I love how data is just an irrelevant distraction to you when you talk about things that are closely tracked and cataloged.  You just do a quick skim and dismiss a citation as irrelevant.  Who cares about the details about teen pregnancy.  

The Dr is being investigated for potentially not reporting the rape and/or abortion and/or violating confidentiality laws when using the case to push her abortion feelings against abortion laws. Not because she provided the abortion.

Are you saying the prosecutor is investigating her under false pretences? I though it was taboo to question prosecutors on their motive for their procecutorial choices? 

And it was easy for the 10 yr old to get an abortion in another state. This should be pleasing for you. As per the article it wasn't too difficult was it? Yay, many families have to travel out of state for certain treatments. Where's their political protest? 

Nonetheless a 10 yr old rape incest victim isn't why most abortions happen. 

You gave me data on teenage pregnancy like I made a claim that teenager don't get pregnant very much. Or were you providing that data to assert the complications of teen pregnancy? 

Yeah I know. I also think they should have safe legal access to abortion. Do you still think I am a religious zealot MAGA tyrant that disagrees with abortion in general? After there is no evidence of that and my actual clarification that I am not against all abortions? That I had one myself? Perhaps you reading comprehension should be evaluated.  

toomuchbaloney said:

I guess that's your opinion even though I just stated clearly why that characterization would be wrong.  

It's not "interesting" or even unusual that I would use a Bible verse to make a point, I am a born again Christian and casual student of the Bible and related documents.  I'm not alone in understanding that there are some crazy preachers in this group of Trump Christians. 

Talk about contradiction in beliefs

 

Oh now there's a special "Trump Christian group"? LOL 

What's the criteria for that? 

Use your Bible verses al you want just don't be a hypocritical when other do too. And don't asign religious funmentalist on some one without evidence. 

toomuchbaloney said:

I guess that's your opinion even though I just stated clearly why that characterization would be wrong.  

It's not "interesting" or even unusual that I would use a Bible verse to make a point, I am a born again Christian and casual student of the Bible and related documents.  I'm not alone in understanding that there are some crazy preachers in this group of Trump Christians. 

Talk about contradiction in beliefs

 

It's really impossible to believe that any MAGA self proclaimed and so-called Christian has appreciated Psalms.  To me they recall the vengeance and violence of the Old Testament and don't realize they walked I into the wrong bathroom.  JD Vance is a good example of a future ahole who wrote a smug book about bootstrapping, whe, in fact, he had loving and supporting grandparents in his little village.  Now, he serves no function anymore than the bootlicker of Trump.  IMHO , he and Trump are are oil and water.  One powerful and wealthy sociopath working into close quarters with a powerless, never wealthy enough sociopath in training.

subee said:

It's really impossible to believe that any MAGA self proclaimed and so-called Christian has appreciated Psalms.  To me they recall the vengeance and violence of the Old Testament and don't realize they walked I into the wrong bathroom.  JD Vance is a good example of a future ahole who wrote a smug book about bootstrapping, whe, in fact, he had loving and supporting grandparents in his little village.  Now, he serves no function anymore than the bootlicker of Trump.  IMHO , he and Trump are are oil and water.  One powerful and wealthy sociopath working into close quarters with a powerless, never wealthy enough sociopath in training.

  

Right on cue............ 

Character attack on Trump's VP. Continue to spout the uniform rhetoric that you have learned from left MSM and democrat mouth peices. I gotta give it to ya. You all seem very uniformed in the repetitive propaganda. Careful, one might say you act like a cult.... 

Crusades said:

Oh now there's a special "Trump Christian group"? LOL 

What's the criteria for that? 

Use your Bible verses al you want just don't be a hypocritical when other do too. And don't asign religious funmentalist on some one without evidence. 

That's right.  There's a group of conservative Christians, calling themselves evangelicals, who are devoted to Trump.  One of the pastors in that group was just charged with some crimes related to sex with a minor female. As a group,  they are happy to follow a unrepentant philanderer and pathological liar who doesn't practice confession of sin or forgiveness. They don't care that he was unfaithful to all of his 3 wives and joked about having sex with his daughter.  They like the guy who sells Bibles with government documents included because he doesn't understand that contradiction at all (maybe they don't understand either). 

https://divinity.uchicago.edu/sightings/articles/donald-trump-and-exceptions-american-evangelicalism

Am I the beneficiary of an anticipatory scolding by you?  Don't do this and don't do that?  That's funny.  Let me know when you use a Bible verse. 

You're pretty preoccupied with my supporting evidence for someone who ignores evidence of Trump's incompetence or disqualifying character flaws and believes things about a Trump which enjoy no supporting evidence.  That's a conundrum.  

Crusades said:

Right on cue............ 

Character attack on Trump's VP. Continue to spout the uniform rhetoric that you have learned from left MSM and democrat mouth peices. I gotta give it to ya. You all seem very uniformed in the repetitive propaganda. Careful, one might say you act like a cult.... 

Trump's VP compared Trump to Hitler.  That was before he did a 180° pivot to become the biggest Trump champion.  The fellow will now proudly tell the world that he won't accept the November election results if/when Trump loses. What a faithful patriot, am I right? 

Again, we don't generally call factually correct information propaganda. That's a confusing detail for you.  An example of repetitive propaganda is the lie that the 2020 election was fraught with fraud and Trump didn't really lose.  Another example is the idea that Trump was the best president, like we heard over and over at the convention yesterday.  That's not even close to being true but it's repeated again and again and people believe it because of the repetition and their predisposition to believe it.  That's propaganda.  

Sure, people might say that I might be in a cult.  Mostly that happens when cult members try to project their indoctrinated state into others.  But, yeah, people say things that aren't really true all of the time in defense of their Trumpism. 

Crusades said:

The Dr is being investigated for potentially not reporting the rape and/or abortion and/or violating confidentiality laws when using the case to push her abortion feelings against abortion laws. Not because she provided the abortion.

Are you saying the prosecutor is investigating her under false pretences? I though it was taboo to question prosecutors on their motive for their procecutorial choices? 

And it was easy for the 10 yr old to get an abortion in another state. This should be pleasing for you. As per the article it wasn't too difficult was it? Yay, many families have to travel out of state for certain treatments. Where's their political protest? 

Nonetheless a 10 yr old rape incest victim isn't why most abortions happen. 

You gave me data on teenage pregnancy like I made a claim that teenager don't get pregnant very much. Or were you providing that data to assert the complications of teen pregnancy? 

Yeah I know. I also think they should have safe legal access to abortion. Do you still think I am a religious zealot MAGA tyrant that disagrees with abortion in general? After there is no evidence of that and my actual clarification that I am not against all abortions? That I had one myself? Perhaps you reading comprehension should be evaluated.  

Oh, I see.  You don't want to discuss the fact that this case is the evidence that you asked for about 10 year old rape victims needing abortion. You don't want to admit that you got what you asked for.  

You apparently want to deflect now to go down a rabbit hole about why the doctor who helped the child is now facing legal challenges over her efforts.  Yes I think the legal problems are retaliatory. 

And you want to move the goalposts again.  Now it's about why most abortions happen. Of course, when I presented you with information about teen pregnancy and abortion you dismissed it as irrelevant. 

And round and round we go.  

I think you are spinning and not particularly well informed about the laws, current events or the subject of pregnancy and reproductive health.  You have opinions though.  You asked what I thought.