Very disturbing...one of our frequent psych patients (d/c'd) was picked up by the police. For what, I don't know. But I've never known the guy to assaultive. Agitated at times, yes. Assaultive, no.
Police apparently had him and he got agitated. He was Taser'd a few times and died when he got to our hospital.
This is the fourth time *this year* that police in our area have ended up killing a psych patient. Mostly from Tasering, once from being 'restrained' according to the news.
I just think police need some training on dealing with mentally ill people. This is a crying shame. Mentally ill and agitated is not the same as criminal!
Well done! Those were exactly the points I was going to address! Excellent!
Lurksalot is biased, sure she/he wants to see his/her spouse at the end of the day. I imagine, though, that so did the patient's family want to see him, too.
And jut to humor him/her, here's an article from yesterday:
By the way, this article only mentions 3 deaths. The fourth to which I referred was at a juvenile detention center in another county.
Actually, I'm not seeing your humor, and after providing a link it is pretty clear that your original post way entirely off base and inflammatory. There is nothing in that article that indicates unjusitified force was used. It's about mentally ill people who break the law.
This isn't a cop bashing thread. And what makes you think you have more of a clue than I do? How do you know I wasn't at the ER when the man was brought in, or that I haven't read the record? You are so determined to prove a point that you are blindly making assumptions.
Ummm, I guess I just too the "Police Killed Our Patient" title you know, to mean police killed a person? And then the subsequent body of the post that makes out a department where police killing people is rampant?
This isn't a cop bashing thread. And what makes you think you have more of a clue than I do? How do you know I wasn't at the ER when the man was brought in, or that I haven't read the record? You are so determined to prove a point that you are blindly making assumptions.
Well, if you were there, please inform us all of what actually occurred. But since none of us were there to witness it, I guess we should just assume the rumor is correct and blindly support that. Have fun with that!
Specializes in Happily semi-retired; excited for the whole whammy.
Actually, I'm not seeing your humor, and after providing a link it is pretty clear that your original post way entirely off base and inflammatory. There is nothing in that article that indicates unjusitified force was used. It's about mentally ill people who break the law.
What she said was that a cop killed a patient. If the cop used the taser and the patient is dead, then, yep, the cop killed the patient. It could well be that the killing was justified. That doesn't mean it didn't occur. I find it interesting that you are accusing anyone else of being inflammatory, but hey, I sure do hope you have a nice day.
THANK YOU! ! My hubby goes to work every night as a police officer with his bullet proof vest. He has a taser and has been tased himself (he said it hurt )but hasn't used it yet.
Our city also likes settlements even if the case is ridiculous because trials cost even more.
Oh yeah, I hear you. My husband has been tasered, maced, and shot with rubber bullets. Our town also has been sued numerous times, and they always settle even when the cops have been proven not to have done anything wrong.
What she said was that a cop killed a patient. If the cop used the taser and the patient is dead, then, yep, the cop killed the patient. It could well be that the killing was justified. That doesn't mean it didn't occur. I find it interesting that you are accusing anyone else of being inflammatory, but hey, I sure do hope you have a nice day.
They're trained to be very confrontational--the opposite of the approach we view as acceptable for psych patients. Unlike us, they're allowed to defend themselves with whatever means they feel necessary ...
I agree that it's horrible that so many psych patients who are acting out are treated as criminals, but the problem is that there is no easy way to distinguish the nonviolent psych patients who are having a psychotic break from the criminally violent ones who are on a rampage.
But God, I wish there was.....what a tragedy for these people who are trapped in an illness and cannot get the right help.
You raise some very interesting points. I sometimes wonder if some elements of the law enforcement approach should be used more ... especially in criminal psych facilities. Because even when those patients are getting treatment, they still can be very dangergous.
I just did a clinical rotation at a criminal psych facility and, while we were there, an RN was stabbed and had to be hospitalized. Other incidents include a doctor got his jaw broken by a paranoid schizophrenic and, despite multiple operations, the doctor is still out on disability after two years because he still hasn't recovered.
Also, one psych tech was choked to the point of brain damage. When another psych tech was attacked by a patient and tried to press charges, she was told by the DA that is was "her job" to take such abuse. Basically, that was the overall attitude of management as well.
My point is that some of these patients can be very dangerous, even when they are receiving medication and treatment from trained psych staff. Yet the staff often can't do anything about violent patients until after someone is attacked and, by then, you could be severely injured or, even worse, dead.
I'm not necessarily saying that the confrontational law enforcement approach should be used with psych patients or, even criminal psych patients but, due to the above mentioned incidents, I'm not sure that the existing medical approach works either. I'm just wondering if there's some middle ground between the two.
Yeah, whatever, Lurksalot. You asked for proof of the news that several people were killed by police, I gave it to you. I'm not going round and round with you. Chill out.
My BIL retired after 25 years as a city cop. Every day my sister would wonder would he come home. In those 25 years he was assaulted with num-chucks (sp), he was sitting in his car when a suspect shotgunned through the car door...bil still has some lead from that.
He had to go to court on his days off for anything from tickets for speeding to assault cases where the plaintif did not show or changed their mind.
I have great respect for cops.
OK having said that, I doubt anyone of us knows what went on that day.
I've been knocked unconscious at work by a patient, I've been thrown against the wall by a visitor. I've been followed through a dark parking lot at the hospital. That time it was a biker named Tiny who stepped in and escorted me to my car.....his wife was a cop. I was there......any other combination of occurrences reported can either be absolutely true, to the other extreme total lies and inflammatory reporting.
I take wellbutrin does that make me a psych patient? I guess so.
My wandering point here is debate the topic. Stay away from wild generalizations that are unfounded, unsupported, or inflammatory.
'NURSES KILLED OUR PATIENT".....Sounds bad doesn't it, so does "Police killed our patient". Think about it a minute. When is society, especially American society going to stop pointing fingers and looking for a responsible person when in fact, people are responsible for THIER OWN ACTIONS, mentally ill or otherwise. A documented mentally ill person recently attempted to stab a person in my community, it was witnessed by a police officer, who, shot and killed her after she refused to drop the knife. Cops are human, and do things that a lot of other people can't do or won't do. That cop was drug through the mud for years and made to look evil, when in fact he saved anothers life. SO my point is we are accountable for our actions....sad sometimes, but life goes on. Tasers do have a nasty reputation and I would no like to be tazed...however, If I were in that position, then I guess my vote doesn't count.
I don't think anyone here is blaming individual cops. Isn't it clear that they could benefit from better training regarding dealing with the mentally ill?
I'm thinking of an example in my city where a paranoid schitzophrenic called 911 and after various conversation, admitted to the dispatcher that "the doctors say I am a paranoid schitzophrenic, but they are wrong." He then proceeded to talk about how the secret police were going to take him away...he was a secret spy...blah blah blah. The responding officer escalated the situation and insisted on controlling the man (their objective and training). The man ended up dead. The cop chased him directly into a highway and he ran into oncoming traffic. All this because he was acting odd at an entrance of a grocery store.
My point is that the officers are to be respected. We can recognize that their training is deficient and still respect the officers. Just as many police departments are starting to question if they should always follow high speed chases to the end because the damage is often worse than the original offense, they should question if the objective of controlling a clearly mentally ill person is always worth the cost.
:chuckle
Lurksalot, BSN, RN
236 Posts
Actually, I'm not seeing your humor, and after providing a link it is pretty clear that your original post way entirely off base and inflammatory. There is nothing in that article that indicates unjusitified force was used. It's about mentally ill people who break the law.