No HS diploma or GED, but is a CNA?

Published

In your state, is it a requirement to have a HS diploma or GED to enter CNA courses??

Specializes in Case mgmt., rehab, (CRRN), LTC & psych.
There were a few people in my CNA class that caused me to wonder how on earth they were able to graduate high school in the first place but somehow they did. As far as I know none of them are working as CNAs though.
As I've previously mentioned, many of today's high school graduates have slipped through the cracks of shoddy public school systems and possess skills that are far below their completed grade levels. I know of high school grads who have problems with functional illiteracy, do not even know how to do long division with a calculator, and would never be able to assist their young children with homework without some serious remediation.

A large number of these underprepared high school grads end up in the fast food and low-end retail industries because these areas of employment do not require rigorous testing of one's academic abilities. I've met many people who fit this description while I was a teenager and working in fast food and discount retail.

Up Vote Up Vote ×
Specializes in Med-Surg, NICU.
Important work doesn't always require a formal education. A person does not need a GED or diploma to provide basic care such as feeding, toileting, showering, dressing, grooming, ADLs, bed-making, reporting of changes in condition, and other tasks. This work is extremely important, but a person who has not attained a high school education can do the job competently, efficiently, and compassionately. Some of the best CNAs have never completed high school.

High-school dropouts are not stupid people, since many of them are products of tough social circumstances. I've met high school graduates who are functionally illiterate and can manage to read only at a second or third grade level because they slipped through the cracks of a shoddy public school system. I've also met high-school dropouts who are intelligent, good readers, and critical thinkers, but they simply cannot extricate themselves from their current situations.

If they were so smart, why drop out of high school? Many decent paying jobs require a minimum of a bachelor's degree, and having no high school diploma won't get most people very far in life.

In my opinion, it IS stupid to drop out of high school, and why should anyone be rewarded for that? I have met some high school drop outs, and even some of them admitted to dropping out due to laziness and just not caring about doing anything with their lives. One guy I talked to didn't really care to have a GED. I don't want that kind of person in a hospital. EVER.

Up Vote Up Vote ×
Specializes in Case mgmt., rehab, (CRRN), LTC & psych.
If they were so smart, why drop out of high school?
Many drop-outs get caught up in unfortunate social circumstances. I was born and raised in a working-class city where many students were pressured by their families to leave school once they reached the compulsory age so that they could start contributing to the household finances as soon as possible. My birthplace, which happens to be a city on the West Coast, has 200,000 people and only 59 percent of the population over the age of 25 graduated from high school. Out of the 59 percent, only 8 percent went on to college. The other 41 percent are high-school drop-outs.

I know that people will call this "backward thinking," but if someone's single mother is working full-time at Taco Bell for minimum wage, feeds the family with food stamps, and cannot really afford her five children who are under the age of 18, you'd better believe that she's going to pressure the older children to get a full-time job as soon as they are able. People surely love their children, but not all parents are oriented toward the best possible future of their kids.

In addition, some parents are indifferent when it comes to the education of their children.

Up Vote Up Vote ×

no, thats why a lot of cnas are a box of rocks that cant even write legibly

Up Vote Up Vote ×
Specializes in ICU.
no, thats why a lot of cnas are a box of rocks that cant even write legibly

Excuse me? That's a rude generalization, at best. I'm sorry you seem to know or work with unprofessional CNAs, but in my experience unprofessionalism exists at every education level. At my facility, every CNA I've worked with can write and communicate on a professional level - and I don't ask to see their high school diploma before I converse with them.

As CNAs, we should advocate for a level of respect that we deserve as hard working men and women that provide invaluable care to those who are suffering or incapable of providing it for themselves. It may not be a glamorous job, and for many of us it is a stepping-stone to other further education and careers in healthcare, but that does not mean we cannot have pride in our hard work and demand respect. Insulting your fellow CNAs (I'm assuming you're a CNA from your username, forgive me if I'm wrong) is NOT the way to go about that. :(

Up Vote Up Vote ×

I didn't say all, I said most. And for some, it's the only job they can get.

If the truth offends you, bury your head in the sand and remain blissfully ignorant.

Obviously this doesn't mean every place is like this, but mine is, and other places I've seen are like this.

Makes us intelligent ones look around and wonder what we're doing here and wish college was free.

Up Vote Up Vote ×
Specializes in ICU.
I didn't say all, I said most.

And that's a generalization. One that is insulting to CNAs who are proud to work among competent and professional healthcare providers of all levels. It's not burying one's head in the sand to stand up for one's own professionalism (and that of one's coworkers) - it is, though, to make sweeping assumptions that categorize an entire group of people that you cannot possibly claim to know for sure. Have you met every CNA? Even "most" CNAs, as you claim? What's your sample size, and how many different kinds of facilities and parts of the world do you know CNAs in?

I'm very sorry if it is true of your facility, but that does not make it true of "most" CNAs, just "most" of the ones you know. If your facility is that bad, come work at mine, we have job openings. :)

Up Vote Up Vote ×
Specializes in Med Surg.

In both Illinois and Iowa (I live on the border, so they both affect me) you must have a h.s. diploma or ged to take the classes at any of the local schools, so that would lead me to believe it is a state requirement.

Up Vote Up Vote ×
Specializes in Tele, OB, public health.

Well, I'll probably get flamed for this but here goes....

I would like to see it be required that every CNA have a high school diploma, or be required to complete one within a reasonable amount of time from their hire ( obviously many CNA's are not old enough to have completed high school)

YES being a CNA does not require a high level of formal education, but this oversimplifies the value of an education. It is more then being able to do Algebra or recite every state capital after graduation-

Education teaches people how to think articulately, sparks intellectual curiosity,teaches discipline and perseverance, and gives people tools on how to research and discover things on their own outside of the classroom.

Granted, high school only scratches at the surface of those things, but it is an important step none the less.

I want every member of the health care team to be curious and at least want to understand the rationale for why things are done the way they are.

I want the CNA to understand the bare minimum of things, like "The reason it is so important to get AM vitals done on time on the cardiac ward is because if a BP or HR is off, people can get hurt if they take their normal meds"

They do not need to understand every piece of the why and how beta blockers work, for example, but they need to undertstand all of their duties are very important.

I want the CNA to ask "Why?" and if I do not remember to or are unable to explain the why, I want them to know how to search for the answer on themselves.

And no, those without diplomas are not automatically dumb, but they will be lacking in the skills I mentioned above

Education is not solely about individual intelligence, it is also largely about hard work and honing of skills needed for life

Up Vote Up Vote ×

It must be nice for those who were able to cruise through their high school years without having to worry about where their next meal is going to come from, how the rent is going to get paid, or how to keep the lights and heat on. I mean, I didn't have to worry about these things but I know that there is a world full of people who worry about it every single day.

I guess when it comes down to getting a job and eating or staying in high school, the job is an easy decision for some. When you're hungry, or maybe you don't have heat, finishing high school and going to college is probably the farthest thing from one's mind. People who live under those circumstances live from day to day and many are afraid to look to the future at all.

Sure, it would be wonderful if everyone could stay in school and get that diploma but unfortunately, it isn't feasible in some situations. Also, to further complicate matters, some of those people attended such substandard schools that they have a hard time passing that GED test. Yes, there are schools where little to nothing is taught. I've witnessed it.

I live in a rural area with a high rate of poverty and my minor is in sociology. I've seen poverty and I've studied it so don't be so quick to judge.

I don't find the idea of CNA's who can't read to be NEARLY as alarming as I find the thought of a staff full of CNAs who don't speak English! What kind of care can one provide when you can't understand what a resident/patient is telling you?

Sure, we can require a diploma or GED to be a CNA but first, lets require a mastery of the English language. THAT seems more important.

Go ahead. Flame away.

Up Vote Up Vote ×
Specializes in Tele, OB, public health.

I really do not understand how this discussion derailed into ad hominem attacks.

It has quickly become focused on the character and worth of those, who for whatever reason, do not have a high school degree- this is not what the discussion is about.

It is not about whether the people who did not graduate are good bad or otherwise. It is not about the reasons, many very valid that a person did not finish high school.

It is about whether or not a high school degree should be required for a CNA job.

Do I want to see people who did not graduate shunned, unemployed and not be able to provide for themselves?

No, of course not

Do I think think those who have not graduated should be given support and every opportunity to do so, and ideally go onto to college? YES, absolutely.

Do I want them working as CNAs? No.

Up Vote Up Vote ×
Specializes in Med Surg.

I can see both sides, but what I can say is what I learned in high school has in no way helped me with being a CNA. So much of being a CNA is common sense and not about book smarts. If being a cna was about book smarts then you would not be able to become a cna in 3 weeks it would take 2-4 yrs. It is unfair to say that someone is not qualified to do the job of a CNA if they do not have a diploma. I do have a hs diploma, but I know some people who don't that succeed as CNAs just fine. You are not automatically stupid or incompetent for not have graduated high school. My father never graduated high school, and yet he is now in upper management.

Up Vote Up Vote ×
+ Join the Discussion