New overtime law "myths and facts" Yes, hourly RNs are affected

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http://www.aflcio.org/yourjobeconomy/overtimepay/mythsfactsheet.cfm?RenderForPrint=1

Myths and Facts on the Bush Administration's New Overtime Regulation

MYTH: Under the Bush Administration's new overtime laws, very few if any workers making between $23,660 and $100,000 a year will lose overtime eligibility.

FACT: The new Bush Administration overtime laws are written such that many workers who currently earn overtime pay in this pay range are likely to lose it. For example:

Concurrent Duties--Under the old rule, an employee who spent a substantial amount of his or her time on nonexempt work but who also performed some exempt supervisory duties generally remained eligible for overtime pay (under old rule 541.116). Under the new rule, that person will generally be an exempt executive, and not eligible for overtime pay. (New section 541.106)

EXAMPLE--An assistant manager in fast-food, grocery or retail may spend most of his or her time performing "line" duties, like burger flipping or ringing up customers, but still be "in charge" of other workers at the same time. Under the old rule, many of these workers still received overtime pay. Under the new rule, they may very well lose their overtime pay, even if they make as little as $23,660 a year--a wage that qualifies a family for food stamps.

Salary Basis Test--The old rule required an employer to pay a worker a salary in order to deprive the worker of the right to overtime pay. The new rule (541.604) defines salary as an hourly wage, so long as the employer guarantees a minimum wage that bear a loose relationship to hourly compensation.

EXAMPLE--Registered nurses (RNs) are very likely to lose their overtime pay rights. RNs' work satisfies the duties test for professionals, but they are paid hourly, and they don't have much freedom to come and go. If they come in to work late, they are docked an hour's pay, for example. They used to receive overtime pay for the many hours of overtime they are required to perform. Under the new rule, they are likely to lose that right.

There are many other examples of how workers in this salary range are likely to lose overtime pay rights. In general, the final overtime regulation will have an especially large impact on workers with minimal supervisory or "leadership" responsibilities, workers who perform minimal amounts of administrative work, workers with special skills, and certain kinds of employees in the computer field.

MYTH: The new Bush Administration overtime law merely clarifies murky law, thus eliminating unnecessary lawsuits. The law is part of its "proven commitment to protecting workers' rights."

FACT: The new Bush Administration overtime law, in fact, lays out in the regulation exemptions which corporations have not been able to win in the courts. For example:

Journalists--There has been a lot of litigation over whether journalists have the right to receive overtime pay. Courts ruled both ways, based on the facts of each case, and many decisions prohibited journalists from losing the right to overtime. The Bush Administration points to the cases in which journalists have lost the right to overtime as the basis for their new rule, which now makes it much harder for journalists to get overtime pay. In fact, there's a big difference between court cases in a limited number of jurisdictions and the new Bush Administration federal rule, which broadens the exemption nationwide for all journalists. (New section 541.302)

Insurance claims adjusters--Again, court cases on whether insurance claims employees receive overtime pay have gone both ways--some courts have said they are exempt and other have said they should receive overtime pay. This is a very heavily-litigated field, and corporations have not been able to win a blanket victory. The Bush Administration has handed them that victory by changing the nationwide regulation to specify that these employees are generally disqualified from receiving overtime pay. (New Section 541.203(a)) A quarter of insurance claims adjusters make less than $35,000 a year.

MYTH: The Bush Administration merely updated the rules to reflect today's modern workplace, but did not strip workers of overtime pay rights.

FACT: The Bush Administration could have supported the Harkin Amendment which allows them to make any updates to the rules, as long as no worker loses overtime pay. In fact, the Bush Administration has made it MORE difficult for many workers in the structure of today's workplace to receive overtime pay.

Team leaders--Many workplaces are moving toward having a team leader structure under which co-workers oversee one another's work. In the old overtime law, the only people disqualified from receiving overtime pay were "staff" who oversaw "special projects." The new Bush Administration overtime law changes that language so that people who do "line" work--whether it's turning out hamburgers or ringing up sales--and who oversee "major projects" will be likely to lose overtime pay rights. "Special projects" implied that there was a definite start and end to the project, whereas the new "major projects" could go on indefinitely, thus knocking many team leaders out of overtime pay rights.

MYTH: The Bush Administration has cut back on the number of lawsuits which will arise over overtime pay.

FACT: The 500 plus page rule and preamble is very likely to lead to MORE, not LESS, litigation. The rule is, at best, ambiguous. It essentially invites employers to push on these ambiguities, forcing workers who lose overtime pay to challenge their new status in court.

Copyright © 2004 AFL-CIO

A hospital in my area used MOT and refused OT pay to nurses a few yrs back (they enforced the laws claiming RN's are exempt professionals) Guess what...they lost many of their good nurses because they quit and went elsewhere. They could not recruit new staff because word got out what they were doing. So..they now pay OT and no longer mandate.

The new law won't affect me because I won't work overtime without overtime pay. I realy don't see what everyone is excited about. As long as the majority of nurses refuse to work overtime without the extra pay then hospitals will have no choice but to continue paying it.

What if your mandated to work overtime?

We dont have much of a choice, if were mandated to work the extra hours, they dont make exceptions

As previous posts have pointed out, if this new rule does allow employers not to pay overtime, it could only apply to states that don't already overtime protection laws.

So ... I found this link which points out all of the overtime laws in various states. It looks like there are at least 15 states that have no overtime laws so, if you live in one of those states, you could be affected by this new rule.

If you live in one of the overtime states, click on your state, where there's a brief, although not comprehensive explanation of overtime laws in your area.

For example, while Texas does have an overtime law, according to this site, it only prohibits retail employees from working seven consecutive days. So nurses still might not have much protection there, even though there's an overtime law.

http://www.toolkit.cch.com/text/P05_4053.asp

Hope this helps.

:clown:

Specializes in Trauma,ER,CCU/OHU/Nsg Ed/Nsg Research.
Thanks very much for pointing that out. Yeah, it looks like mandatory shifts are only prohibited in facilities with union contracts. Still, at least non-union workers get paid extra for it in this state. Others may not be so lucky.

What's the status with OT laws in other states? I'm not talking about mandatory OT but OT in general. Does anybody know?

As always Laura, thanks for the informative links.

;)

Thanks for THAT informative link, Lizz!

Here is a link to a grass-roots community group affiliated with the AFL-CIO. It's for non-union workers that want to get active in issues such as this, or just want to be kept informed. There are no dues, but they do accept donations (the only times I've been asked for donations is when strikers need a little financial help with a long strike). Check it out if you are interested!

http://www.workingamerica.org/

Specializes in LTC, assisted living, med-surg, psych.

I'm disappointed that so many seem to think that because they're already salaried, or because they work under a union contract, that this new rule can't affect them adversely. Big business has been salivating over this proposal for YEARS.....you think they're not smart enough (or greedy enough) to figure out some way to manipulate the rules to benefit themselves?? And do you honestly think the brain trust that came up with this horrid piece of legislature will care when it starts hurting people?

It's like watching a fire burn down your neighbor's house and saying "Oh, that's too bad.....but at least MY house is still standing." Come on, you guys, just because it doesn't affect you now doesn't mean that it won't at some point in time.........what if you change jobs? What if you go to work at a non-union facility? And what if the nursing shortage becomes less acute? Surely you realize that a good part of the so-called 'shortage' is, in reality, a shortage of employers willing to staff (and pay) adequate numbers of nurses......NOT merely a lack of warm bodies with an RN or LPN license. :angryfire

No, the new rule doesn't affect me either (I work at a unionized hospital), and I'm glad that low-income people appear to benefit. However, it's not right to deprive ANYONE of fair pay for overtime, and if you can't think of a single other reason for 'regime change' this November, this is it!!

This sounds like LIBERAL bs - its an election year. I think the OP is just trying to get things stirred-up. Im not going to work mandatory overtime - there are too many other jobs out there. Do you really think Kerry is going to be looking out for us?

What if your mandated to work overtime?

We dont have much of a choice, if were mandated to work the extra hours, they dont make exceptions

No one can force you to do anything you don't want to do. I would not work anywhere I was mandated to work overtime. Or where I didn't get paid for it.

Read mattsmom's EXCELLENT point!!

steph

Specializes in LTC, assisted living, med-surg, psych.
This sounds like LIBERAL bs - its an election year. I think the OP is just trying to get things stirred-up. Im not going to work mandatory overtime - there are too many other jobs out there. Do you really think Kerry is going to be looking out for us?

Thank you soooooo much for completely invalidating my concerns, as well as those of thousands of other RNs. And to answer your question: I honestly don't know if Kerry is going to be looking out for us, but I DO know George Bush isn't. :stone

I'm disappointed that so many seem to think that because they're already salaried, or because they work under a union contract, that this new rule can't affect them adversely. Big business has been salivating over this proposal for YEARS.....you think they're not smart enough (or greedy enough) to figure out some way to manipulate the rules to benefit themselves?? And do you honestly think the brain trust that came up with this horrid piece of legislature will care when it starts hurting people?

It's like watching a fire burn down your neighbor's house and saying "Oh, that's too bad.....but at least MY house is still standing." Come on, you guys, just because it doesn't affect you now doesn't mean that it won't at some point in time.........what if you change jobs? What if you go to work at a non-union facility? And what if the nursing shortage becomes less acute? Surely you realize that a good part of the so-called 'shortage' is, in reality, a shortage of employers willing to staff (and pay) adequate numbers of nurses......NOT merely a lack of warm bodies with an RN or LPN license. :angryfire

No, the new rule doesn't affect me either (I work at a unionized hospital), and I'm glad that low-income people appear to benefit. However, it's not right to deprive ANYONE of fair pay for overtime, and if you can't think of a single other reason for 'regime change' this November, this is it!!

The new rule probably won't affect me either when I graduate. But I agree with you, and I don't think it's liberal BS. I think it's a basic, bread and butter issue that affects everyone, sooner or later.

I too am surprized and disappointed when people don't take this kind of thing seriously. It one of the reasons that wages and benefits have been declining for over 30 years now.

:uhoh21:

Specializes in Trauma,ER,CCU/OHU/Nsg Ed/Nsg Research.
This sounds like LIBERAL bs - its an election year. I think the OP is just trying to get things stirred-up. Im not going to work mandatory overtime - there are too many other jobs out there. Do you really think Kerry is going to be looking out for us?

If being against anything that takes away rights from everyday nurses and other workers & hands them on a silver platter to corporate entities makes me a "LIBERAL," then I'm honored to join their ranks.

And your post was extremely RUDE.

Specializes in LTC, assisted living, med-surg, psych.
If being against anything that takes away rights from everyday nurses and other workers & hands them on a silver platter to corporate entities makes me a "LIBERAL," then I'm honored to join their ranks.

And your post was extremely RUDE.

Thank you! And ditto for me on the 'liberal' charge. :)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brickman

"The new law won't affect me because I won't work overtime without overtime pay. I realy don't see what everyone is excited about. As long as the majority of nurses refuse to work overtime without the extra pay then hospitals will have no choice but to continue paying it. "

There ya go. Plain and simple.

I agree with Steph. I will NOT do overtime. I do work in a state with overtime laws AND a union contract. People died for the8 hour day. Our Federal government is NOT conservative now or we would be conserving the value of the ability to work and also spend time with family.

That said I truly believe based on past actions my employer would pay us all exactly $455.00 a week and mandate overtime just to avoid paying benefits. They already tried to make us charge nurses salaried with the promise of a pitiful pay increase. Allmost all of us stepped down takind a small cut in hourly pay. Those few were putting in horrendous hours so they resigned their salaried position too. They were forced under threat of insubordination to work up to 20 hours in one day or to work six 12 hour shifts a week. They had to step down because they were asked to accept a patient assignment in the "emergency" of a sick call AND attend meetings while responsible for patient care. Our RN salaried 'super nurse' told the DON she couln not simultaneously care for patients and attend a meeting on another floor but NOTHING was done.

That happened only once. Our committee went to the DON with a petition signed by about 95% of the RN, LVN, CNA, MT, and US staff. She agreed the law must be followed. The experement with salaried direct patient care charge RNs lasted less than a day! That was a few years ago.

So far by sticking together we are doing fine. I want better for the nurses who come after my 'close to retirement' generation.

Of course if these same commpassionate people get their way and privatize Social Security with the stock market so unpredictable we may all just drop dead on the job.

Those who said we need to stick together are right. That IS the only way, not only for nurses all of us.

Just my opinion but I think it unwise to vote for the candidate who forced this change in the labor law.

http://www.dol.gov/esa/regs/compliance/whd/fairpay/fairpayprintpage.asp?REF=fs17n_nurses.htm

To qualify for the learned professional employee exemption, all of the following tests must be met:

The employee must be compensated on a salary or fee basis (as defined in the regulations) at a rate not less than $455 per week;

The employee's primary duty must be the performance of work requiring advanced knowledge, defined as work which is predominantly intellectual in character and which includes work requiring the consistent exercise of discretion and judgment; The advanced knowledge must be in a field of science or learning; and

The advanced knowledge must be customarily acquired by a prolonged course of specialized intellectual instruction.

Registered nurses who are paid on an hourly basis should receive overtime pay. However, registered nurses who are registered by the appropriate State examining board generally meet the duties requirements for the learned professional exemption, and if paid on a salary basis of at least $455 per week, may be classified as exempt.

The employer decides who is exempt. With a union they have to negotiate regarding such changes. I would much rather keep the hard won laws than fight my employer.

Not many of us work for private community hospitals anymore.

PS: I IS PLAIN AND SIMPLE but not easy to acheive that unity.

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