MEPN equivalent to ADN?

klone, MSN, RN · Jun 30, 2019

What are you hoping to do with your RN? I think an entry-level Master's program is a waste of money if you're hoping to work as a bedside nurse. And I think that it's foolish if your goal is to work as an NP right out of the gate. (basically, I think entry level master's programs are a bad idea all around)

Hospitals will never require bedside nurses to have MSNs in our lifetime. While many do require a BSN, just as many do not.

I think that if you want to work as an RN, your best bet would be an ABSN.

SwimandTennis · Jun 30, 2019

Thanks for your response -- I'm hoping to eventually go for an MSN in leadership and/or DNP to be a Nurse Practitioner.

Let me flesh a few more things out for you:

I'm concerned about the viability of this MPEN program, which is simply a Masters in Science, not a Masters in Science in Nursing, is an ambiguous degree in the healthcare marketplace compared to a BSN, which is an established and recognizable nursing degree. I know I will acquire the RN license, but are there other factors to be considered about?

If I decide to work as an RN for quite a few years (say 5/6) -- do you think it's worth leaving this MEPN program for the accelerated BSN? Due to employability? I'm concerned about what the clinical instructor said: that MEPN is equivalent to an ADN, under a BSN and as such the pay and opportunities will reflect those differences.

I know ranking isn't everything but let me provide some more background: The program I'm currently in costs 53K total and is the number 30 ranked program. While the accelerated BSN program is the number 3 or 4 program in the country but its cost total is 88K. To add another layer, my fiancé is in the city where the accelerated BSN program is. I'm currently across the country in the MEPN program.

I just worry about this Master's Entry to the Profession of Nursing and its viability compared to the established BSN.

Thanks for your help in navigating these concerns!

Nurse Magnolia, BSN, RN · Jun 30, 2019

A few thing came to mind as I read your post because I also have a bachelors degree (two in fact!) and in the beginning didn't want to reinvent the wheel and get ANOTHER bachelors degree, however, nursing is it's own animal and degrees are not equivalent.

If your MESN is a Masters of Science and you get your RN along the way, that is NOT a Masters in Nursing and hospital systems will not think of you as having a Masters in Nursing. They will consider you to have your RN. And an unrelated masters degree. An RN can be achieved by getting an ADN, a diploma or a BSN. Since you will have the same title (RN) as someone with a BSN, but you won't have a BSN, you will then be considered to be in line with someone who has an ADN or diploma. That is why they said the MESN is considered the same as an ADN. Effectively, for bedside nursing, that's all you have.

I would NEVER EVER EVER spend 88k on an ABSN. Never. There are so many cheaper options. For example, I looked into the ABSN programs in my area and they were all one year but 50-60k. No thanks. I ended up going to a diploma program for 30k and graduating in 16 months. I had a job lined up 6 months prior to graduation and I'm working now in a level III NICU. I had no problem (in my area) getting a job with a diploma as there are still lots of diploma schools in our area. But the ADN grads also have no trouble landing jobs. In fact, many of the hiring managers I've had said they PREFER hiring diploma grads because we have had so much more hands on clinical vs the BSN programs. But that's for another post....

Now, because I already have two bachelor's degrees, and I did not want to get a third - I'm going on for an MSN In Nursing Education (I'll begin that in August), and that will run me another 30k, all online with a reputable brick and mortar school. So 60k all in for an RN and a MSN and I can work making good money while I work on the MSN.

If your end goal is to get your MSN in leadership, then I would look at the market in your area. IF they hire ADN's, I'd go that route as it's much cheaper. Even my diploma was expensive comparatively. Or a diploma program. (or a MUCH cheaper BSN option) And then go on for your MSN and you can skip the BSN altogether. Or some MSN programs combine the BSN and MSN into one program.

I would NOT continue the MESN if the only nursing credential it leads to is an RN and a masters degree you can do nothing with in nursing. That's my two cents anyway...

**NICU Guy, BSN, RN** · Jul 1, 2019

I agree with Nurse Magnolia, the MEPN program will get you an RN degree, the same as an ASN or BSN program. You would be considered a new grad RN and would be paid as a new grad with zero nursing experience. They will not start you out at an MSN rate the same as an BSN nurse with 5 yrs experience that went back to school to get their MSN.

25 minutes ago, SwimandTennis said:
The program I'm currently in costs 53K total and is the number 30 ranked program. While the accelerated BSN program is the number 3 or 4 program in the country but its cost total is 88K.

Ranking of nursing schools is truly irrelevant. The reputation of a school is only relevant locally because the hospitals are hiring their graduates. Some hospitals gobble up ASNs from a community college over BSNs from a local university due to that particular community college producing better prepared graduates. If you are applying outside of your local area, a degree from John Hopkins or Duke is valued the same as an unranked state university degree. Hospitals only care about if you have passed NCLEX and have a license to work in that state. They aren't looking at US News rankings of nursing schools to make their decisions. The ranking of nursing schools is not the same as Business or Law schools.

Editorial Team / Moderator · Jul 1, 2019

I don't understand the point of an entry-level MS degree that comes with an RN if it's not an MSN. Because yes, you're an RN with a non-nusing Masters and no BSN. In the nursing education hierarchy, that is a weird place to be — almost like a diploma RN with a non-nursing Masters.

SwimandTennis · Jul 1, 2019

Thanks for your response!

So, is there is no difference in pay between ADNs and BSNs who are new graduates with no experience? If that's the case, why would someone do the BSN over the ADN? Is there more room for growth for the new graduate BSN over the ADN?

Also, to note, the MEPN program where I'm at does not offer any licensure other than providing for the NCLEX subsequent to the 15 months -- no leadership aspect. As such it differs compared to other MSN/MEPN/Masters programs.

MotoMonkey, BSN, RN · Jul 1, 2019

10 minutes ago, SwimandTennis said:
So, is there is no difference in pay between ADNs and BSNs who are new graduates with no experience? If that's the case, why would someone do the BSN over the ADN? Is there more room for growth for the new graduate BSN over the ADN?

The answer to this is very regional. In my area it is very difficult to get a job at most of the major hospitals without a BSN. The hospitals that do hire ADN's often have a base pay rate for nurses, if you have a BSN you essentially get an incentive bonus of a certain percent.

In my opinion there are more opportunities for BSN prepared nurses especially if one desires to move into management positions or desires to pursue an advanced degree.

turtlesRcool · Jul 3, 2019

On 6/30/2019 at 8:46 PM, MotoMonkey said:
The answer to this is very regional. In my area it is very difficult to get a job at most of the major hospitals without a BSN. The hospitals that do hire ADN's often have a base pay rate for nurses, if you have a BSN you essentially get an incentive bonus of a certain percent.
In my opinion there are more opportunities for BSN prepared nurses especially if one desires to move into management positions or desires to pursue an advanced degree.

Agreed.

My hospital has stopped hiring ADN and Diploma nurses. Of course, there are current employees with those degrees (and no difference in pay vs BSN nurses with the same experience), but the hospital is not hiring newbies unless they have BSN after their names.

Of course, this isn't universal, and there are hospitals here that like nurses from one program or another. When I was considering ADN vs ABSN, I was at a career fair and a recruiter from one of the hospitals advised me to do the community college ADN because "they always rise to the top." My state's community colleges do have a really great ADN program (cheap, competitive, and thorough), but unfortunately, not every hospital will hire those grads at the end. It's too bad because I see some of those students doing their clinicals at my hospital, and think many would make great RNs with us, but the Powers That Be have decided to go in a different direction. Many ADNs find it more difficult to get acute care jobs in my area, so the ABSN made more sense in my case. My ABSN was also at a state university, so the cost was reasonable.

KeepGoingRN · Jul 3, 2019

My hospital does not hire ADNs only BSN/MSN. If the ASBN is about the same amount as Entry level MSN, I would do MSN for sure. If you want to go back and do a post-masters NP you will save money and time.

NavyResNurse · Jul 3, 2019

I attended a MEPN program in CA, it is Master Degree in Nursing, unless your program in somehow set up differently. The majority of these students do not graduate under the assumption they will receive some kind of Masters level positions, but nearly all start off as floor nurses. The advantages, I did receive higher pay at the major hospital I was hired at, but only around $2 more an hour. The one huge advantage it offers is the ability to teach. After one year of nursing, I was able to attain a nursing clinical position. It was mandatory to have a Master degree in nursing, the teaching part they can mentor you. I teach clinicals at an ADN school as well as a MEPN, I do believe at least in this case ADN students are better prepared to enter into an entry level new graduate position than the MEPNs. They obviously have a heavier focus on skills. After a year though all were on track at the same level with the same new nursing issues. Cost wise of course its up to the individual and the amount you make per your state. At least here in my city in CA majority of my fellow nurses had no issues paying off their student loans in 5 years or so. Of course all dependent on your situation. Most of these were younger single nurses with no kids.

beekee · Jul 3, 2019

I’ve never heard of such a degree! But, I will tell you that there were several people with graduate degrees in my ADN program who were going back to school as second career students. The decision was simple. At a community college, it was 5 semesters (including all the pre-reqs) to earn the degree, at a cost of less than $3,000 per semester. Any of the other options costs way more and aren’t significantly shorter in length. Once I graduated, I did a competency based BSN program that let me go at my own pace. In the end, I completed my BSN in less than six months for about $3500.

In my area, BSN is preferred, but not required for acute care.

No one cares that your program is ranked by anyone, if bedside nurse is your goal. No one cares what degrees you have other than the nursing degrees. They might ask why you switched, but it won’t make you any more marketable. I’ve never been asked my GPA. If you have a license, you are just as good as the next person who failed several classes at a for-profit school that is on the verge of losing its accreditation.

As you would not have a nursing degree, I’d think you would be lumped in with the ADN/diploma grads. You can’t claim a BSN or MSN, but maybe check with the hospitals in your area to be sure. You may also be limited with respect to future education. Can you get into a MSN or NP program without a BSN? I don’t know, but I’d certainly look into before you commit to spend that kind of money.